Comparison of HDR Versions (PS3, 360, DC, CPS2)

135

Comments

  • RufusRufus An unexpected database error has occurred. Joined: Posts: 1,966
    If 1-2 frames (the difference between 360 and PS3 HDR) could disrupt so many players' timing, imagine how much 2-3 or 4 frames (the difference between 360 or PS3 HDR and CPS2 ST) could affect ST players. That's no problem for folks wanting to stick to remix mode (since it's technically a different game) but it shows classic mode isn't accurate enough to stand in for ST for players deeply attuned to the timing.

    Rufus: if you're able to, please try the exact same tests as papasi (well, what NKI originally came up with when testing CCC2) and see if that's also what you get. Not every action animates at the same moment so this is really a relative speed test on those moves. I worked with papasi to get some test controls down with frame-by-frame in Kawaks so if you find any differences running the exact same tests, feel free to post up.
    PS2 CCC2 ->CRT 8 frames
    PS1 ST ->CRT 4 frames
    DC ST ->CRT 5 frames
    ...
    cps2 s-video encoder->CRT 4.5 frames
    cps2 vga encoder->LCD 7-frames
    xbox classic mode->LCD 6-7 frames
    PS3 classic mode->LCD 8 frames
    ps2 ae->CRT 6 frames
    ...
    FWIW, you really ought to specify the LCD you used.

    The way I did the tests doesn't actually involve a display of any kind. I don't have all the bits to do VGA testing and I'm not sure I want to bother right now. I don't have a PS2, PS3, Dreamcast, CPS-2 or any of the appropriate versions of the games available.

    In practical terms, this seems mostly academic. For people who really care, superguns are not that expensive. Everyone else is going to have to try the versions, and make up their own mind if it matters, and any serious competition is going to specify what the exact version and platform of the game is going to be.
    Hitboxes http://www.pedantic.org/~nate/HDR/
    "You don't know what you're talking about as much as I do." -- Unknown
  • ultracomboultracombo Weakest Loser Joined: Posts: 741
    I wonder why the PS3 lags so much. Do other games on the PS3 have more lag compared to the 360?
    "If ultracombo misses a low roundhouse, he is likely to continue doing it." - TheMuffinMan
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    FWIW, you really ought to specify the LCD you used.

    Console hdmi output to Asus V236H in gaming mode
    The way I did the tests doesn't actually involve a display of any kind. I don't have all the bits to do VGA testing and I'm not sure I want to bother right now.

    Yes, the test needs to be done END-TO-END. Earlier someone was testing fba's input lag by using the cps2 system input test menu & emulator's frame pause function.

    He would go into the cps2 system input test menu, pause the emulator, hold a button down, forward 1 frame, and check that the input display on screen toggle from 0 to 1. And then claim that it is lagless.

    But in practice that test is invalid.

    i.e. The LCD might still need some time to process the digital signal sent from the console via the hdmi cable, even it claims that the panel has a response time of 2ms.
    In practical terms, this seems mostly academic. For people who really care...

    The PS3 is as worst as PS2 CCC2. I remember Gian canceled all his MM once he found out that is the version being used. I don't think it is just academic because the timing difference really throw people off with the combo, etc.

    And with 4 additional frames of delay, you have 4 less frames to react to moves, which is a big deal as well.
    I wonder why the PS3 lags so much. Do other games on the PS3 have more lag compared to the 360?

    Since we have recorded the sf4 test using your ps3 the other day, I'll try to do the same test on my xbox sf4 later and compare the result. I think it would be similar (1-2 frames behind)
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
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  • philcitophilcito The Berserker Shoto Joined: Posts: 1,178
    the input lag is bigger in ps3 because Capcom creates games(all genres), first on xbox 360, then they port the game to ps3, is not the console itself, is the way how they port the game from one system to another.
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  • ultracomboultracombo Weakest Loser Joined: Posts: 741
    Yeah 4 frame lag is really terrible.
    "If ultracombo misses a low roundhouse, he is likely to continue doing it." - TheMuffinMan
  • FulaaniFulaani Of terrorist descent Joined: Posts: 2,555
    Console hdmi output to Asus V236H in gaming mode
    You need to test the console versions on CRT. No matter the general opinion, people, including myself, still feel a difference when playing on so called lagless monitors compared to CRTs.

    CRT is the only sure way to determine the lag of the system used.

    Also the response time of a monitor has nothing to do with the input lag. The response time meassures how fast a pixel can go from 1 value to another and back again. High response times are the cause of ghosting efefcts and such. But it doesn't meassure how fast the monitor responds to a signal.
    zoning took an indefinite hiatus
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    You need to test the console versions on CRT.

    Nah I'm not gonna bother. These tests are done with the setup that people ACTUALLY use.

    PS3/Xbox360 + LCD are used in 99% of majors in the US. There is no point to test PS3/Xbox360 + CRT since no tourney in US is gonna switch to all CRT with PS3/Xbox360.

    Same reason I'm not gonna test PC emulation output to CRT.

    Have you tried playing PS3/Xbox360 with non-HD CRT TV? The text on the screen are unreadable...

    Also I didn't say they are pure input lag. It could be a combination of input/display lag on various systems/display. But in either case, you would see the animation changes X frames late on screen.
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • mad possummad possum Joined: Posts: 1,091
    Nah I'm not gonna bother. These tests are done with the setup that people ACTUALLY use.

    PS3/Xbox360 + LCD are used in 99% of majors in the US. There is no point to test PS3/Xbox360 + CRT since no tourney in US is gonna switch to all CRT with PS3/Xbox360.

    Same reason I'm not gonna test PC emulation output to CRT.

    Have you tried playing PS3/Xbox360 with non-HD CRT TV? The text on the screen are unreadable...

    Also I didn't say they are pure input lag. It could be a combination of input/display lag on various systems/display. But in either case, you would see the animation changes X frames late on screen.

    Well, to be fair you put up numbers of CPS2 to CRT numbers, which would be used even less than PS3/360 on CRT. Also, most tournies, big or small, won't have arcade set-ups. We need to find the best solutions with what most people have.

    Most local tournies around here use CRT TV's. Plus lets face it, most ST and HDR tournies are going to be self-run, possible side tournies from here on out, and I think most of us would rather play it on CRT TV's. I don't think it would that hard to get a couple of the HDR guys going to a tourney to bring a 360 and a CRT TV (that's what's going on for the tourney in Indy that Silver is running).

    A 360 plus CRT TV shouldn't be any worse input wise than a DC for ST (which is what was used for years), and would be a lot more managable to set up.
    GGPO name : madpossum
  • DontBlowThis.comDontBlowThis.com ST Revolution Joined: Posts: 54
    How many hdr players use crt's?

    Seasons beating and nec ran arcade st. Final round, ufgt7 and mwc will be running it soon. Arcade st is the standard for majors now.
    Welcome to the Super Turbo Revolution, streaming on random sundays at http://dontblowthis.com/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    Well, to be fair you put up numbers of CPS2 to CRT numbers, which would be used even less than PS3/360 on CRT. Also, most tournies, big or small, won't have arcade set-ups. We need to find the best solutions with what most people have.

    I do think that arcade setup or supergun + CRT are used more than PS3/360 + CRT. Show me examples of tourney using PS3/360 + CRT. We can easily find examples of tourney with arcade ST or supergun setup.
    Most local tournies around here use CRT TV's. Plus lets face it, most ST and HDR tournies are going to be self-run, possible side tournies from here on out, and I think most of us would rather play it on CRT TV's. I don't think it would that hard to get a couple of the HDR guys going to a tourney to bring a 360 and a CRT TV (that's what's going on for the tourney in Indy that Silver is running).

    A 360 plus CRT TV shouldn't be any worse input wise than a DC for ST (which is what was used for years), and would be a lot more managable to set up.

    I don't know if you have tried setting up a sf2 tourney with these equipments, but in most cases CRT is your major problem since it's hard to transport.

    If I'm gonna have CRTs at the venue (ie. major problem solved), I might as well play it on the real thing with supergun instead of playing a console port. Does that make sense?

    edit:
    Final round, ufgt7 and mwc will be running it soon.

    Final round will also run HDR on ps3 with horrible 4 additional frames of lags, sigh.....

    Why would someone prefer to play HDR on a CRT when there are lightweight HD monitors

    which is exactly his (and my) point...
    that have been proven to have zero input lag?

    You meant display lag. It's not proven yet... it might not have ghosting issue. but there might be processing delay before the digital signal from hdmi cable is rendered on the LCD panel...



    btw post above updated with xbox/ps3 ssf4 test. ps3 is 2 frames behind
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • geogeo Official Contrarian Joined: Posts: 1,291
    How many hdr players use crt's?

    Why would someone prefer to play HDR on a CRT when there are lightweight HD monitors that have been proven to have almost no input lag at all? Maybe cost I guess...
    Seasons beating and nec ran arcade st. Final round, ufgt7 and mwc will be running it soon. Arcade st is the standard for majors now.

    Ah.
    Just one example of ST fundamentalism on dontblowthis.com: "HDR is just another game with no relation to the Street Fighter II series" - riz0ne
  • DNGR S PAPERCUTDNGR S PAPERCUT Joined: Posts: 1,608
    papasi, unblock me on on ggpo. I'm sorry that I said "your test are just like you, probably retarded". lettuce be friends again. I'm cereal.
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    Ah shit..    
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  • HAD0-KINGHAD0-KING Joined: Posts: 214
    lettuce be friends again. I'm cereal.

    ^ truly ROFLMAO worthy!

    Here's my 2cents, (which is worth a whopping $1500 in Monopoly Money) it's called HDRemix.....HDRemix. So yea...tests run on HD sets with HD cabling should be the benchmark for these tests.

    Also, anyone keeping a running list of the potential HDR roster for Final Round? If not, I propose we start one. If you're going, reply "I AM" :D
  • GrogGrog discombobulatingly Joined: Posts: 3,617
    I actually play HDR on a CRT just because I like the size and I don't like widescreen mode. I just can't bring myself to buy a 27" monitor when I already have a CRT that's still working fine.
    no one cares syxx

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  • FulaaniFulaani Of terrorist descent Joined: Posts: 2,555
    Nah I'm not gonna bother. These tests are done with the setup that people ACTUALLY use.

    PS3/Xbox360 + LCD are used in 99% of majors in the US. There is no point to test PS3/Xbox360 + CRT since no tourney in US is gonna switch to all CRT with PS3/Xbox360.

    Same reason I'm not gonna test PC emulation output to CRT.

    Have you tried playing PS3/Xbox360 with non-HD CRT TV? The text on the screen are unreadable...

    Also I didn't say they are pure input lag. It could be a combination of input/display lag on various systems/display. But in either case, you would see the animation changes X frames late on screen.
    I've been playing HDR on a small SD-CRT since release and all the text is perfectly readable.

    Anyways the demand was for a test to determine the input lag inherent to 360/PS3 HDR. So all of that is irrelevant, the point is not what people use. The point is that to test something, you need to develop a method that will only detect that which you want to test. Your tests are unscientific, without eliminating other possible sources of lag your tests mean very little.

    I'm not trying to be a dick but why are you being stubborn about this if the means to test it properly are readily available to you. Knowing the inherent lag of 360 and PS3 HDR is worthwhile information. Say the inherent lag of HDR on 360 is the same as DC. That would be great news for all of us who do not have the arcade game available to us. So please test HDR on CRT, I'd be very grateful if you did.
    zoning took an indefinite hiatus
  • x64x64 Fuck your SRK Joined: Posts: 3,202
    the input lag is bigger in ps3 because Capcom creates games(all genres), first on xbox 360, then they port the game to ps3, is not the console itself, is the way how they port the game from one system to another.

    Capcom didn't do it, Backbone did. For some reason the PS3 version seems to be more of an afterthought. Even Sirlin has railed on the PS3 version numerous times.
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  • RufusRufus An unexpected database error has occurred. Joined: Posts: 1,966
    I'm not trying to be a dick but why are you being stubborn about this if the means to test it properly are readily available to you. Knowing the inherent lag of 360 and PS3 HDR is worthwhile information. Say the inherent lag of HDR on 360 is the same as DC. That would be great news for all of us who do not have the arcade game available to us. So please test HDR on CRT, I'd be very grateful if you did.

    Based on NKI's testing of the Dreamcast version, and the tests that I ran on the XBox 360 offline , the input lag is similar - the differences should be smaller than those caused by hitting buttons right after, or just before the game checked for input.

    (To be clear: NKI tested on a CRT with an LED and a camera, so his results are effectively +/- a frame because of the camera's frame rate. Up to the camera's frame rate, the input delay seems to be the same.)
    Hitboxes http://www.pedantic.org/~nate/HDR/
    "You don't know what you're talking about as much as I do." -- Unknown
  • FulaaniFulaani Of terrorist descent Joined: Posts: 2,555
    Yea to me HDR on CRT feels pretty much the same as DC.

    My preference for non arcade (which face it, is a situation a lot of us are in) ST is HDR classic mode on SD-CRT with old sprites. It actually doesn't look bad at all this way on a SD-CRT. HDR also fixed that weird delay after ROUND X sound that was in the DC i think.
    zoning took an indefinite hiatus
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    I've been playing HDR on a small SD-CRT since release and all the text is perfectly readable.

    If HDR is only game you got on xbox/ps3 then yeah maybe it's fine.
    Anyways the demand was for a test to determine the input lag inherent to 360/PS3 HDR.

    Nope, the test is to determine the input/display lag of the whole setup. Not just the system.

    Rufus's test doesn't go through the display, but the player can only rely on the display to tell if the move comes out. The test has to be done end-to-end to mean anything at all.
    So all of that is irrelevant, the point is not what people use.

    It has everything to do with what setup is being used by people out there.
    If I want to go crazy I can also test it with 100" projector that people used for watching movie, no?
    The point is that to test something, you need to develop a method that will only detect that which you want to test. Your tests are unscientific, without eliminating other possible sources of lag your tests mean very little.

    If you want to have a comprehensive combination of everything you'll also need to get different sticks/pad, etc. You realize how much work that is going to be right?
    I'm not trying to be a dick but why are you being stubborn about this if the means to test it properly are readily available to you. Knowing the inherent lag of 360 and PS3 HDR is worthwhile information. Say the inherent lag of HDR on 360 is the same as DC. That would be great news for all of us who do not have the arcade game available to us. So please test HDR on CRT, I'd be very grateful if you did.


    I am not being stubborn but please realize there is only like 2% of people out there using that setup. There is no flying chance that tournament is going use PS3/Xbox + CRT, period.

    If you don't have arcade board / cab available to you, from the test above I'd say mame/fba are miles better than classic mode as it is still the real thing, but emulated. You can use CRT with PC if you really are not comfortable with LCD, but I really cannot bother to test PC+CRT either.

    Like HadoKing said, if people want to play HDR, they will play it with new sprites, 16:9 with a HD display. Classic mode is a lost cause for ST heads as far as offline play is concerned (online it's ok, as a lot of people just can't play on ggpo/supercade).

    [ Actually I did try to look for my composite cable that comes with my xbox yesterday night. But I might have thrown it away already..., and I don't have the ps3 anymore]
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • DNGR S PAPERCUTDNGR S PAPERCUT Joined: Posts: 1,608
    friends again pap? :)
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    Ah shit..    
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  • RufusRufus An unexpected database error has occurred. Joined: Posts: 1,966
    It all depends on what the question you want answered is. If the question is, how much does my setup lag, then testing the setup as a whole is appropriate. That said, I don't see a whole lot of posts of "my setup has x frames of input lag", but rather "the xbox has x frames of input lag". OTOH, most of those test are of the set-up as a whole, and I find myself quite dubious of claims that LCDs are lagless when nobody seems to run tests with better than 1-frame resolution. (To be fair I'm a bit nuts about stuff like that.)

    Component performance is, for example, useful when you make buying decisions. Which monitor do I buy? Do I buy an Xbox or a PS3? Do I shell out extra cash for the XRBG-2? This game is lagging... do I upgrade my net connection (might be a good idea), get a better monitor (probably a smaller issue), or do I swap out the PCB in my TE stick (you won't notice)?
    Hitboxes http://www.pedantic.org/~nate/HDR/
    "You don't know what you're talking about as much as I do." -- Unknown
  • FulaaniFulaani Of terrorist descent Joined: Posts: 2,555
    you are being stubborn. because...
    If you want to have a comprehensive combination of everything you'll also need to get different sticks/pad, etc. You realize how much work that is going to be right?
    No.

    What is needed is the exact opposite. a test that determines the lag of 360/PS3 HDR itself, without any other factors contributing to lag. Say it turns out it's 5 frames. With that knowledge you can apply it to any other setup and determine the complete lag from there with a simple stopwatch test to test any monitor. With your tests this is impossible as the results are only valid for your HDR + HDMI + ASUS V236H in game mode setup. Not every runs that setup dude.

    basically your test measured input lag, which can be made up of a number of factors.

    input lag = inherent lag in the game + Monitor + Cable/port.

    You meassured the input lag to be 6 in one of the tests for example, but cannot specify where the lag comes from. hence your test doesnt say anything about either HDR, the monitor, the cable/port.

    It's not even that I'm saying CRT is the only acceptable way to play. What I'm saying is that when testing any variable you make sure to eliminate unknown factors that can contribute to that variable. CRT is the way to do that in input lag tests.

    Also, are you seriously claiming suprme knowledge of how people are playing their games everywhere in the world? What if I told you UK ran HDR on 360+CRT 2 years straight in their majors? And who says maors are the only thing thatt matter. What if people are hosting sessions in their houses and want to play ST?

    You have the means to give a clearcut answer of 360 HDR lags THIS much. PS3 HDR lags THIS much. Yet are refusing to do so.
    zoning took an indefinite hiatus
  • mad possummad possum Joined: Posts: 1,091
    Because Papasi has a clear agenda, that's why. He's never going to do anything that might make HDR or HDR classic look viable. To him it's arcade ST (even though they play with Jap sticks and buttons, which isn't how arcade ST was ever played in the US) or nothing, which would mean nothing for most people.
    GGPO name : madpossum
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    You have the means to give a clearcut answer of 360 HDR lags THIS much. PS3 HDR lags THIS much. Yet are refusing to do so.
    Because Papasi has a clear agenda, that's why. He's never going to do anything that might make HDR or HDR classic look viable.

    Did any of you actually read?
    [ Actually I did try to look for my composite cable that comes with my xbox yesterday night. But I might have thrown it away already..., and I don't have the ps3 anymore]

    I now regret spending that 30 mins yesterday trying to find that damn composite cable. And no I'm not going to bother asking ultrcombo to borrow his ps3 again.

    mad possum how many HDR players do you think would be crazy enough to get a CRT and play HDR in 4:3 SD, if they already have a nice hdmi > LCD setup?

    I don't know about the euro scene, and I don't know about the brazil scene either.
    You have the means to give a clearcut answer of 360 HDR lags THIS much. PS3 HDR lags THIS much. Yet are refusing to do so.

    Seriously none of us learn anything from these tests I guess.
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
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  • FulaaniFulaani Of terrorist descent Joined: Posts: 2,555
    mad possum how many HDR players do you think would be crazy enough to get a CRT and play HDR in 4:3 SD, if they already have a nice hdmi > LCD setup?
    I gave my mom my big widescreen HDTV and got a small CRT in return. Because it was lag free.

    And indeed, those tests you did provide no answers about HDR itself.
    zoning took an indefinite hiatus
  • DNGR S PAPERCUTDNGR S PAPERCUT Joined: Posts: 1,608
    :(
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    Ah shit..    
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  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    I gave my mom my big widescreen HDTV and got a small CRT in return. Because it was lag free.

    And indeed, those tests you did provide no answers about HDR itself.

    I ask how many. So you're saying you're the only one you know of? So I take that your answer is one.

    Well, number not big enough for me to go to bestbuy to buy a composite cable just for this test or borrow the ps3 again. Sorry.
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • ShariShari Overestimated. Joined: Posts: 2,626
    Average LCD computer monitor with VGA cable plugged to 360 4tw.
    Haunts: Is it lag or just impeccable footsies and spacing, I don't know.
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  • krknightkrknight Joined: Posts: 1,743
    i played my xbox with a crt instead of my asus 27' for over a year. then i got my lg w2363d.

    Amazon.com: LG W2363D-PF 23-Inch Class Widescreen 3D LCD Monitor, Gloss Black: Computer & Accessories

    and here is the test.

    LG W2363D Review - 3D Vision Blog

    if console is still standard, at least the display aspect of lag can be resolved. i can't say how much more the xbox lags compared to ST arcade though so i really didn't help much. just thought i'd show everyone that there are hd lcd's without lag.
  • ultracomboultracombo Weakest Loser Joined: Posts: 741
    Whether or not you think you believe the tests were completely scientific (do LCD monitors lag enough to add 1+ frames of delay?), you have to admit that they have some value because the majority of HDR play is on LCD monitors.

    Oh and Papasi if you want to retest on PS3, you'll have to wait at least 3 weeks :( unless of course you have access to someone else's PS3. I don't see why you should bother though, nobody will appreciate it and you'll just be accused of conspiring against HDR.
    "If ultracombo misses a low roundhouse, he is likely to continue doing it." - TheMuffinMan
  • DNGR S PAPERCUTDNGR S PAPERCUT Joined: Posts: 1,608
    David, ask pap why he won't talk to me anymore.
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    Ah shit..    
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  • djfrijolesdjfrijoles First ST player to ever moon a live stream baby ! Joined: Posts: 2,054
    Awwww maaaan, I promied Thelo I would stay out of his section but I couldn't resist......
    Have you tried playing PS3/Xbox360 with non-HD CRT TV? The text on the screen are unreadable...


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    <garyangel> ceks,cani,robbiers,yito all mexico players dont know where kyouya
    <garyangel> (((((((((((((((
    <djfrijoles> kyouya is with his gf gary
    <Random.Jab.DP.Spamer> his gf is gary ?
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    I think most of us would rather play it on CRT TV's. I don't think it would that hard to get a couple of the HDR guys going to a tourney to bring a 360 and a CRT TV (that's what's going on for the tourney in Indy that Silver is running).

    A 360 plus CRT TV shouldn't be any worse input wise than a DC for ST (which is what was used for years), and would be a lot more managable to set up.

    You guys are just relentless, but considering that you want to actually bring CRT to the tourney that sliver007 runs, and dj just made me laugh with that tiny ass TV that he could only afford, I picked up a cable on my way home to save you the trouble.

    xbox -> crt is 6.5 frames (average of 20 cr. rh)

    btw classic mode with old sprites does look much better in sd.

    I used to play a few games of Forza 3 on a SD TV at a friend's place (2 players verse mode, so sd screen is split in half) and I honestly couldn't read anything on the screen.


    David, tell DSP that he's on my ignore list so anything he said on ggpo or here I just couldn't read...

    [edit: ganelon : it's just the regular composite xbox360 cable, and a regular tv with composite input. what else you want to know?]
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • GanelonGanelon Joined: Posts: 1,101
    OK, so there's no difference from the Asus to a CRT, still 2-3 frames of additional lag compared to CPS2 ST. I actually compared performing links on a CRT and Asus one after another multiple times (to see if an ST setup to an Asus was viable) and couldn't detect any noticeable lag so the monitor performance results are consistent with my experience (and it's what Ponder concluded in the first place after all).

    Still, the Asus does have many shortcomings with the relatively lacking picture quality, poor viewing angle, low volume, and sound lag. papasi, for reference, can you detail what visual setup and cables for the 360 were used?
  • djfrijolesdjfrijoles First ST player to ever moon a live stream baby ! Joined: Posts: 2,054
    David, tell DSP that he's on my ignore list so anything he said on ggpo or here I just couldn't read...

    oooooooooooooooooooooo

    He just posted about your mom dude. daaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyuuuummnnnn you shouold take him off ignore and read it.
    <garyangel> ceks,cani,robbiers,yito all mexico players dont know where kyouya
    <garyangel> (((((((((((((((
    <djfrijoles> kyouya is with his gf gary
    <Random.Jab.DP.Spamer> his gf is gary ?
  • geogeo Official Contrarian Joined: Posts: 1,291
    Still, the Asus does have many shortcomings with the relatively lacking picture quality, poor viewing angle, low volume, and sound lag.

    Just more of the same, you guys just can't stop. Do you still somehow think that through these arguments you're going to stop people playing HDR? At the end of the day: what's your ultimate goal here? You don't play HDR anymore anyway do you?
    Just one example of ST fundamentalism on dontblowthis.com: "HDR is just another game with no relation to the Street Fighter II series" - riz0ne
  • RufusRufus An unexpected database error has occurred. Joined: Posts: 1,966
    I run Xbox VGA cable to VGA CRT when I care about video quality, but when I record video, I typically do that on a TV. (Some other games change their frame rate depending on what display is plugged into the Xbox.)
    Hitboxes http://www.pedantic.org/~nate/HDR/
    "You don't know what you're talking about as much as I do." -- Unknown
  • x64x64 Fuck your SRK Joined: Posts: 3,202
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    Señor Frijoles wins thread.
    ST/HDR/USF2: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    Fightcade/USF2: x64
  • DNGR S PAPERCUTDNGR S PAPERCUT Joined: Posts: 1,608
    David, can you ask pap if he ignored me cuz I said his tests were retarded? Or if it was cuz I said he was retarded?

    In both cases, tell him I was just joshing.
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    Ah shit..    
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  • GanelonGanelon Joined: Posts: 1,101
    Just more of the same, you guys just can't stop. Do you still somehow think that through these arguments you're going to stop people playing HDR? At the end of the day: what's your ultimate goal here? You don't play HDR anymore anyway do you?

    My bit about the Asus VH236H was admittedly unnecessary but everything mentioned were complaints that have been corroborated by others: unable to properly optimize the picture, difficult to see the picture when sitting on the ground, unable to hear the sound during loud events, and the annoying delay cutting off the first few seconds of sound starting up.

    I'm not sure why you'd be upset enough to suggest a connection between my longstanding and open disappointment with the Asus (outside of its great response and low cost) to HDR. Most of HDR at last year's Evo didn't even use the Asus monitor (despite having no warning about such beforehand) and, as has been surprisingly revealed, some European HDR events have used CRTs.

    Anyway, my goal with this thread has been to uncover HDR's version differences and place them into perspective. There were a lot of unsubstantiated rumors when I started (and have been perpetuated to this day) and I wanted to see where the truth was. Nobody questioned my intent when I created this topic so why start now? Now, I've played very little HDR in the past few months (and not much ST either for that matter) but feel responsible for making sure this topic is accurate and up-to-date.

    I've done my best to ensure that everything is correct and that papasi's tests follow the exact same process as NKI's (like I mentioned, other types of input lag tests could be comparing apples to oranges). That's why I was hoping the visual setup and exact cables would be listed for review, as I did for my tests. If anyone has factual qualms with any of the evidence, feel free to ask away, point out issues, or bring up counter-evidence.
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