The SF4 Juggle System:

KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
Preface: All of this data has been thoroughly tested by me and is accurate to the best of my knowledge. There were certain moves, certain situations in this game, that made me repeat them for hours--I set them up under as many possible scenarios as I could to figure out how they occurred. Ken's character contributed most of the testing, as his moves are probably the most intricate and mind-blowingly amazing moves in the game for juggling.

There is a rather large section about him and his gdlk SRK's, but I put everything in spoilers for a reason!


Not all of this information will be 100% accurate, especially as I venture into unfamiliar characters. If you know of a combo that refutes my data, please tell me so I can update it. It would be best to either PM me the correction (preferably with a video proving it) or post it here on this thread (again, preferably with a video attached).

Any move that has a JP of Infinity, is just my way of saying "There was no situation that which this character could make this move not juggle." So for all intents and purposes, that move's juggle potential is infinite.
Change Log:

Contributors:
Pokey86
Doopliss
- Fixed some incorrect JP and flag properties.
- All data for all characters completed.
- Added commentary for each character.
- Added notable juggles for each character.
- Reformatted all character information layouts to be easier to read.
- Updated previously incorrect data.
- Updated main post
- Backed up all character information in case of loss.
- Bison, Sakura, Rose, Gen, Rufus and Ken all updated.
- Slight note changes.
- Added the request for further testing of Balrog's super and ultra, as I'm not proficient enough with him to connect those juggles.
- Added Pokey86 as a contributor.
- Fixed a series of incorrectly displayed data.
- Updated many character's juggle data.
- Added many attacks that weren't previously listed.
- Updated main page Player State information to better reflect what Hard Knockdown State is.
- Added Doopliss as a contributor.
- Fixed a series of incorrect data.
- Added a bug notice to Ken's light kick tatsumaki.
- Added a notice on Fei Long's ultra, as the second and fourth hits cannot connect on an airborne opponent.
- Simplified some of the information.
- Updated the main post.

The Street Fighter 4 Juggle System:


First and foremost, there are a few things that need to be understood about the juggle system. It revolves around 3 things: an imaginary counter that I'll be referring to as "the counter" or "Juggle Count" (JC from here on out), a series of flags on every hit of every move in the game, and recognizing the current state of your opponent. And I'll be exploring each of those in reverse order, as that's how everything will make the most sense.
Player States:
Odds are, you're already familiar with this concept. Certain knockdowns you can't hit people out of, certain knockdowns you can! Well, sort of, on the most primitive level that's basically true--but the fact of the matter is, some of those knockdowns you actually can hit people out of, you just don't have a move that has the properties that allow you to do it.

There are probably more states of a character than you'd think:

Standing: This is the state you spend most of your time playing in. You are standing, not knocked down, and susceptible to any attack.

Jumping: This is a state that has subtle differences over Standing. In this state, unlike in Standing, normals will put you in the Reset State, while most special moves that doesn't grapple in the game will put you in some kind of knockdown.

Reset: This only occurs off of Jumping and Float Knockdown, any normal hit will put your character in this state. You are wholly invincible to being struck, though typically are vulnerable to mix-up games given you've no control of your character while landing.

When people refer to resetting, they are referring to deliberately putting someone in this state in order to put them in a situation in which they are required to correctly guess a mix of: where you will be, what you'll do, which way to block, and/or what to do when they land.

Standard Knockdown: The most common kind of knockdown, the Standard Knockdown is essential to juggling. This is a knockdown in which you are only capable of being hit by moves that have a certain property that I call Juggle Potential (JP from here on out). In this knockdown state, you can "Technical" the knockdown and recover faster than you normally would by either tapping :d: (down) as soon as you hit the ground or pressing any 2 buttons simultaneously.

Moves can only hit you so long as their JP is greater than the current JC on the opponent. Moves that cause the initial Standard Knockdown don't contribute towards the JC. But that'll all get discussed much more later.

Hard Knockdown: The Hard Knockdown is very straight forward. Any move that puts someone in a Hard Knockdown cannot be "tech'd" (they cannot quick rise from the ground).

Float Knockdown: Very similar to Jumping, but definitely different. Jumping is a state in which the player is in control of the character--Float Knockdown is a very, very bad state to be in. You have no control of your character and virtually any and all attacks will connect. You are complete at the mercy of your attacker, and typically, they won't pass this opportunity up. Any attack you are hit by will put you in whatever respective state it can. (For example: if you are fierce punched out of a float knockdown, you will be reset, because it operates under Jumping conditions and normals put people in Reset state when used on someone in an Aerial Float state.)

The relationship between Float Knockdown and Standard Knockdown is sometimes confusing and we'll be going more in depth on that subject in the next section.

Crumple: Crumples are nothing more than a multi-staged knockdown state. Stage 1 is Stun, stage 2 is Float Knockdown. You'll know stage 2 of the knockdown has occurred when the opponent has dropped to their knees.

Very few attacks cause this state, as of right now: Viper's EX Lightning Knuckle and Focus Attack Level 2 or 3.

Stun: The Stun state is reached once your character has accrued enough Stun Points. You are in a Standing state for all intents and purposes, though you have extremely little control of your character. The only control you have is that, any input you push (be it punches, kicks, or movements) reduces the length of the stun.
Juggle Flags and Move Properties:
Now that every possible player state has been covered, we start going into how they actually get there (obviously not including Standing Float and Aerial Float as they imply player control).

Every single attack in the game has a series of properties to it, or as I like to call them, flags. More accurately, every single hit, of every single move, in the game has a series of flags attached to it that determine what happens when it successfully connect.

Some of these flags are actually quite intricate and only occur when certain conditions are met. Also, certain flags have priority over others, such that if they occur then similar flags are ignored.

List of most flags and what they do:

Juggle Potential (JP): Let's start with the most important one to this thread! Juggle Potential is the numerical value of whether or not a given normal, special, super, or ultra will connect during a juggle. Each hit, of each move, has a designated Juggle Potential.

Knock Down: This is an important flag, as many moves cause Standard Knockdown--but not if the person is grounded. Knock Down is a quality of a hit that actually knocks the person down in some way shape or form.

CC Standard Knockdown (CCSK): A move that has the potential to cause Standard Knockdown, but may not inherently do so. However if the move knocks down, then it will also cause this type of knockdown.

CC Float Knockdown (CCFK): A move that has the potential to cause Float Knockdown, but may not inherently do so. However if the move knocks down, then it will also cause this type of knockdown.

CC Hard Knockdown (CCHK): A move that has the potential to cause Hard Knockdown, but may not inherently do so. However if the move knocks down, then it will also cause this type of knockdown.

Standard Knockdown Reset (SKR): If this hit connects it resets the target back into a 0 JC standard knockdown so long as they are currently in a standard knockdown. Very few moves have this flag.

Float Knockdown Reset (FKR): If this hit connects it resets the target back into Float Knockdown so long as they are already in a Float Knockdown. That part is actually quite key, as there is a difference between Aerial Float and Float Knockdown. Very few moves have this flag. In other words, FKR only occurs given that your opponent is already in a float knockdown state, otherwise this flag is ignored.
The Juggle Count:
The Juggle Count (JC) is an imaginary counter that keeps track of what the current JP is at. There are a few key things to know about the Juggle Count.

First and foremost, each individual hit of a move has it's own Juggle Potential. That means that the third hit of Akuma's fp.srk potentially (and in this case does) has a different JP than the first hit. Do not assume that just because a move hits 3 times that it's JP is 3, as this is usually not the case. Whether or not a move will juggle has little to do with the move, but rather each individual hit of that move and what the JP of each individual hit is. Many juggles, such as Ryu's Super > Ultra, won't fully connect because the JC reaches the maximum potential of the last move thrown.

Secondy, each hit during a juggle increases the Juggle Count by 1. So even though a move like Ryu's Super has a JP of 5 for each and every hit, it doesn't mean that the JC = 5 when the first hit connects. It means that every hit can connect until the JC = 5. Therefore if the JC = 2, the first 3 hits will connect and the last 2 will miss since 2 + 3 = 5. Or if the JC = 4, the very first hit of the super will connect and the last 4 will miss since 4 + 1 = 5. There's a reason I refer to it as Juggle Potential, since that's literally what it is: the potential a given hit of a given move has to juggle.

Third, as briefly outlined above, once a move's potential has been tapped, it's done. This can happen mid-move or on the very last hit of it. To be more exact, once the Juggle Count is equal to or greater than the highest Juggle Potential of any hit in a given move, then that move will no longer be able to juggle. Given that Ryu's super has a potential of 5, once the count hits 5, Ryu's super can't connect anymore hits, ever. At that point you need something with more potential, like his ultra. Which has a potential of 8. If you've followed me so far, you'd probably have guessed correctly: If you tried to Super > Ultra with Ryu, only 3 hits of the ultra connects: Super sets the JC to 5, Ultra hits until the JC is 8 (3 times), and then stops.

Fourth, moves that cause changes in player state do not, repeat: do not, add 1 towards the JC. Any hit that initially knocks down, any hit that resets, any hit that alters a player state will not add to the JC. Akuma's light kick tatsumaki changes someone into Float Knockdown state, no JC. The lp.srk afterwards changes them into standard knockdown state, no JC. The shaku afterward would normally put them in standard knockdown, but since they're already there it's not changing anything and goes on it's merry way juggling them.
I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
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Comments

  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    Character Specific Move Properties:
    Legend:
    JP = Juggle Potential
    CC = "Can Cause"
    CCSK = CC Standard Knockdown
    CCFK = CC Float Knockdown
    CCHK = CC Hard Knockdown
    CCR = CC Reset
    SKR = Standard Knockdown Reset
    FKR = Float Knockdown Reset
    Crouching Hard Punch:
    1: JP = 0 - CCR
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Float)

    Change of Direction (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK
    3: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    == Applies to both punch and kick follow ups.

    Tornado Throw (All):
    1: JP = 0 - Grapple - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Falling Sky LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - Grapple - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Falling Sky EX:
    1: JP = 1 - Grapple - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Wheel Kick LK / MK / HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Wheel Kick EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Super:
    1: JP = 0 - Grapples out of any float state - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    1: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Things to keep in mind about Abel: The second hit of his c.fp puts you in float state. Because it doesn't have the float knockdown reset flag, a second c.fp will either put them in a Reset state (if the first hit of it connects) or a Standard Knockdown (if the second hit of it connects) state--you can never put them back into Float Knockdown after the initial c.fp.

    Notable Juggles:
    C.fp > Super / Ultra / Falling Sky
    Hadouken LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Hadouken EX:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shoryuken LP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shoryuken MP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shoryuken FP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shoryuken EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Tatsumaki LK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Tatsumaki MK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Tatsumaki HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    *Tatsumaki EX:*
    1: JP = 5 - CCSK
    2: JP = 5 - CCSK
    3: JP = 5 - CCSK
    4: JP = 5 - CCSK
    5: JP = 5 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    * Estimated JP value *

    Air Tatsumaki LK / MK / HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)


    Air Tatsumaki EX: <--- Requires further testing, may indicate an alternate property for certain moves (what frame data calls Pursuit).
    1: JP = 0 - SKR - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 0 - SKR - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 0 - SKR - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = 0 - SKR - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    5: JP = 0 - SKR - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Demon Flip Kick (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCR

    Demon Flip Palm (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Shakunetsu LP:
    1: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shakunetsu MP:
    1: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shakunetsu FP / EX:
    1: JP = 3 - CCSK - Knock Down (Float)
    2: JP = 3 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 3 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Air Hadouken LP / MP / FP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Air Hadouken EX:
    (Both) 1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Super:
    Grapple: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    Grapple: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Akuma is juggle heavy as hell. His juggles mostly operate off of his air tatsu and lk tatsu both putting people in float state on their initial hit. If you did an air rh.tatsu, and 2 hits connected, the second hit would put them into standard knockdown and you'd limit your juggle options. It's advised, when using this as an air-to-air move, to use the lk version. It spins the fastest and afaik can't hit twice. Also, Shaku is trippy as balls. If you do it by itself, they end up with a JC of 1 even though the first hit knocks them down. This makes me assume that the first hit puts them in float state, the second hit then puts them in standard, and the third puts them at JC 1. After a standard knockdown juggle however, the JC is 3 after a fp.shaku since it doesn't have the properties to put them -from- standard knockdown BACK to float knockdown. LP.SRK > FP.Shaku = JC 3, whereas FP.Shaku > FP.Srk = JC 2. Also, do keep in mind that if you ever air-to-air someone with an air hadouken, you can easily land 2 hits of a fp.srk.

    Notable Juggles:
    LK.Tatsu > SRK
    Air Tatsu > SRK
    EX.Tatsu > SRK
    Air FB > SRK
    EX FB > SRK
    Shaku > SRK
    SRK > FADC > Shaku
    Running Punch (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Running Low Punch (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Running Overhead Punch (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Running Uppercut (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Running Low Uppercut (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Buffalo Headbutt (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Turnaround Punch (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Super:
    All hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard) -- Currently requires further testing

    Ultra:
    All hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard) -- Currently requires further testing

    Notes:
    Very little juggling going on here outside of his Headbutt > Ultra > Super (works mid-screen).

    Notable Juggles:
    Headbutt > Super
    Headbutt > Ultra
    Ultra > Super
    Blanka Balls (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Electricity (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Amazon River Run:
    1: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Super:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Essentially, Blanka just doesn't juggle.
    Cannon Spike (All):
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Spin Knuckle (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Spiral Arrow LK / MK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Spiral Arrow HK / EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCR
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Hooligan Combo (All):
    Air Throw: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    Ground Throw: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    Slide: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Cannon Strike (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCR

    Super:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Her cannon spike is really legit. Being able to hit-confirm it, FADC forward, and do it again, is really brutal damage. Likewise, for full meter you could hit confirm a cannon spike, FADC into another one, then FADC backwards into her ultra. The ultra is a "half-ultra", but it does over 400 damage regardless--a bit harder than Ryu's to connect, but worth it nonetheless. Her ultra is unique in that it stands them up of it connects, even if they're airborne. So while she's not intense on the juggling, her limited juggling options are superb.

    Notable Juggles:
    Cannon Spike > FADC > Cannon Spike / Super / Ultra
    Jumping Forward/Back Fierce Punch Target Combo:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Jumping Neutral Fierce Punch:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Counter Hit Down-Forward Short:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Back Medium Kick Target Combo:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    5: JP = 3 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    6: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Head Stomps (each hit):
    1: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down

    Lightning Legs LK / MK / HK:
    All Hits: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Lightning Legs EX:
    1: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Kikoken LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Kikoken EX:
    1: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Hazanshu LK / MK / HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Hazanshu EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Spinning Bird Kick LK / MK / HK:
    All Hits: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Spinning Bird Kick EX:
    1: JP = 9 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 9 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 9 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = 9 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    5: JP = 9 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Super:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Chun-Li doesn't have many opportunities to juggle--her ultra juggle isn't that impressive, nor is her super, but they're still there. She has some pretty ridiculous corner-combo potential though via EX Spinning Bird Kick. In fact, in a thread about highest combo damage, some of her corner combo's are tough to compete with. Kikoken has pretty good JP for it's availability--doesn't do a ton, but it's there when the opportunity arrises (like only landing 1 hit of your j.fp).

    Notable Juggles:
    J.fp > Kikoken / Head Stomps / EX SBK / EX Legs / Super / Ultra
    EX Legs > EX Legs / Super / Ultra
    EX SBK > EX SBK / Super / Ultra
    Anti Air Standing Roundhouse:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Thunder Knuckle LP / MP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Thunder Knuckle HP:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Thunder Knuckle EX:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Crumple)

    Burning Kick LK / MK / HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Burning Kick EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = 3 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Seismic Hammer LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Seismic Hammer EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Aerial Burning Kick LK / MK / HK:
    Same as Burning Kick

    Aerial Burning Kick EX:
    Same as EX Burning Kick

    Super:
    1: JP = Infinite - CCSK
    2: JP = Infinite - CCSK
    3: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Ultra:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    5: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Notes:
    When most people think Viper, they think juggling. Which is ironic, because individually her juggling capabilities aren't that impressive. The only thing that actually has any real value to it is Seismic Hammer, as it puts people in float state and launches them. Her ultra is odd in that it has a very small window of being able to land: either that or I just simply couldn't do it. But I couldn't connect it whenever the JC was greater than 1.

    Notable Juggles:
    Seismic Hammer > Anything
    HP TK > HP TK / Super / Ultra
    BK > HP TK / Super / Ultra
    Jumping Medium Punch:
    1: JP = 1 - CCR

    Dankukyaku LK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Dankukyaku MK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    DankuKyaku HK / EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Koryuken LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Koryuken EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Gadouken LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Gadouken EX:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Super:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    Grapple - JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Jumping medium punch has JP--what the fuck? His damage output is very low, his juggles aren't very useful.

    Notable Juggles:
    SRK > J.mp / EX Gadouken
    AA FA2/3 > Ultra
    Yoga Mummy: <-- Requires further testing
    1: JP = 5 - CCR?

    Yoga Fire LP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Yoga Fire MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSk - Knock Down (Standard)

    Yoga Fire EX:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Yoga Flame LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Yoga Flame EX:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Yoga Blast LK / MK / HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Yoga Blast EX:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Super:
    All hits: JP = Infinite - FKR - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Ultra:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - FKR - CCSK - Knock Down (Float)

    Notes:
    His only real juggle-power rests in his super and ultra putting people in float state and the combination of the two to produce a lot of damage.

    Notable Juggles:
    Super > Anything
    Ultra > Anything
    Hundred Hand Slap (All):
    All Hits: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Sumo Splash LK / MK / HK:
    1 (On the way up): JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    1 (On the way down): JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Sumo Splash EX:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Sumo Headbutt LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Sumo Headbutt EX:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Oichio Throw:
    Grapple: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Super:
    1: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    2: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Juggle and E. Honda aren't very synonymous.
    Standing Roundhouse:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Tostada press:
    JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Hard) (can connect after s.HK)

    Fajita buster:
    JP = 0, grapple, Knock Down (Hard)

    Gordita sobat:
    JP = 0, CCSK

    Calamari Slide:
    JP = 0, can't hit aerial float, Knock Down (Hard)

    Propeller tortilla:
    JP = 0, grapple, puts opponent in special state, then hard knockdown. (you can connect with s.LK after this move, and they act as if they were standing on the ground)

    Quesadilla Bomb (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard) *Level 1 does not knock down*

    Guacamole Slew (All):
    Grapple: JP = 1 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Super:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    Grapple

    Notes:
    As with most other grapplers, juggling options are limited. True-fact though, you can EX Quesadilla Bomb by holding down 2 kicks for 8 seconds. Noticed that was missing from the EventHubs database.

    Notable Juggles:
    S.rh > GS / Super
    Rekkas:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK
    3: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Flame Kick LK / MK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Flame Kick HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Flame Kick EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Chicken Wing (All):
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK
    2: JP = 2 - CCSK
    3: JP = 3 - CCSK

    Super:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    * Second and Fourth hit do not Juggle. This is currently under investigation, but the most likely cause of this is that the second and fourth hit are initiators into his full ultra. If they did connect, he'd be able to juggle people out of the air with his ultra. *

    Notes:
    So even though his super and ultra have infinite JP, you rarely get to take advantage of that, because they're really, really bad to juggle with. Both of them need the Cammy/Sakura ultra/super property of grounding the fkn opponent on hit. That way he could full-super and full ultra people on juggles. Otherwise, his options are limited and do very, very little damage.

    Notable Juggles:
    FK > CW
    Jumping Roundhouse Kick Target Combo:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Crane low short:
    1: JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Slap Chop (All):
    All Hits: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Gekiro (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    All other hits: Cumulative +1 JP per hit

    Jyasen (All):
    All hits: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Oga (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Mantis Super:
    Initial hit: JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Mantis Ultra:
    Initial hit: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Crane Super:
    Initial hit: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Crane Ultra:
    Initial hit: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    As with several other characters, his primary juggle opportunities are from his Super (mantis) and the options provided thereafter. Other than that, not so much.

    Notable Juggles:
    Super > Anything
    Oga > Anything
    J.rhx2 > Super / Ultra
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    Character Specific Move Properties (Cont.):
    Legend:
    JP = Juggle Potential
    CC = "Can Cause"
    CCSK = CC Standard Knockdown
    CCFK = CC Float Knockdown
    CCHK = CC Hard Knockdown
    CCR = CC Reset
    SKR = Standard Knockdown Reset
    FKR = Float Knockdown Reset
    Jumping Medium Punch:
    1: JP = 0 - FKR - CCFK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Gohadouken (All) Level 1:
    1: JP = 0 - FKR - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Gohadouken (All) Level 2:
    1: JP = 0 - FKR - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)
    2: JP = 0 - FKR - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Kongoshin (All):
    1: JP = 0 - Knock Down (Float)

    Tatsumaki Gorasen (All):
    Initial Hit: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Float)

    Air Tatsumaki Senpukyaku (All):

    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Senkugoshoha LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Senkugoshoha EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Float)

    Super:
    1: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    3: JP = 2 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    4: JP = 3 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    5: JP = 4 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    6: JP = 5 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    7: JP = 6 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    Initial Hit: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Half Ultra:
    Basically his super.

    Notes:
    Christ almighty. Almost the juggle property king right here. Every single one of his moves puts you in float knockdown except his normal Senkugoshoha and the second hit of his j.mp. Other than that--reset's ALL DAY. The only thing is, it's a damn shame his Ultra and Super have pretty shitty juggle properties. If they had infinite JP like many other ultra's or super's, he'd be a pain-train of scary ass whooping. He is the unchallenged champion of corner combos. If he had better normals and easier juggling super/ultra's (he really only has 1-2 good setups for his ultra) he'd probably be top tier.

    He's more about resets than juggles however, don't let the float properties mistake you, if the moves themselves don't have solid JP, then you're not going to see the high juggle counts that you can with other characters.

    Notable Juggles:
    EX Senku > Anything
    Back Throw > Anything
    AA FB > Anything
    Guile High Kick:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Flash Kick LK / MK / HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Flash Kick EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Sonic Boom LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Sonic Boom EX:

    1: JP = 2 - CCSK
    2: JP = 2 - CCSK

    Super:
    1: JP = 1 - CCHK
    2: JP = 2 - CCHK
    3: JP = 3 - CCHK
    4: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down (Hard)
    5: JP = 5 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    6: JP = 6 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    1: JP = 3 - CCHK
    2: JP = 3 - CCHK
    3: JP = 3 - CCHK
    4: JP = 6 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    5: JP = 6 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    6: JP = 6 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    7: JP = 6 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    8: JP = 6 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    9: JP = 7 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Guile's ultra is really designed for people on the ground. It doesn't actually launch them until the 8th hit if I'm not mistaken. So what happens is, the move was designed in such a way that it's first kick has very, very low JP (relative to the juggle required to land it). If every hit had infinite JP, this would actually truck people left and right when using it to juggle. People frequently, and incorrectly, state that Guile's ultra is very weak. It's not, it's actually average or perhaps even a little above average at 503. Most ultra's do between 400-600 at level 2, some do less than 400. All that really needs to be done to fix this thing is give it infinite JP and return it's input to Back > Forward > Down > Up where any back/forward/down/up satisfies those 4 inputs.

    Notable Juggles:
    Full Screenish Sonic Boom > EX Sonic Boom
    Traded Flash Kick > EX Sonic Boom
    Early Flash Kick > EX Sonic Boom / EX Flash Kick / Super / Ultra
    Guile High Kick > EX Flash Kick
    Tatsumaki LK:
    All Hits: JP = 0 - CCSK

    * Bugged Move: This move's actual kick portion for some reason sets the JC to 1 and simultaneously knocks them down. Theory: This move is listed as having 3 hits, but in actuality only has 2, there's supposed to be a second kick after the first spin. I'm suspecting that, as awkward as it is, only for purposes of juggling that single kick counts as 2 hits somewhere, somehow. *

    Tatsumaki MK / HK / EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK
    3: JP = 1 - CCSK
    4: JP = 1 - CCSK (MK ends here)
    5: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Air Tatsu LK / MK / HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Air Tatsu EX:
    1: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Hadouken LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Hadouken EX:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Shoryuken LP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shoryuken MP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shoryuken HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCFK - FKR - *Special* Knockdown (Float) on counter-hit
    2: JP = 0 - FKR - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shoryuken EX:
    1: JP = 0 - FKR - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - FKR - CCSK - SKR - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Super:
    Theory: The first hit definitely has JP = 0, second hit has JP = 1. If the second hit connects, the rest can as well. If the JC is 1 or greater, this will whiff.

    Ultra:
    Initial hit: JP = 0 - Locks target into ultra animation - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra (Half):
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Essentially the juggling God. His HP and EX Shoryuken's are the most intricately developed moves in the game, and it took me well over 6-10 hours to wrap my head around how the hell they worked. Once I fully understood them, they really opened up how every other move works and how this game's juggling system works. His EX Srk proves that there is flag priority, in which certain flags are considered before others, and also proved that knockdown states are resettable if the move has that property.

    All in all, he has insane attributes. You can juggle very, very hard with him. If his Ultra's initial hit had infinite JP, he'd probably be top tier with his other Shoto brethren.

    Notable Juggles:
    FP.SRK > FADC > EX.SRK / EX.Air Tatsu / Ultra
    AA MP.SRK > EX.SRK / Super / Ultra
    Super > Ultra
    Air MP Target Combo:
    1: JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Scissor Kick LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Scissor Kick EX: *JP of at least 2, difficult to see how high it goes*
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Psycho Crusher LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Psycho Crusher EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (standard)

    Devils reverse:
    JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    EX Devil Reverse:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (standard)

    Head Press:
    JP = 0 - CCSK

    EX Head Press:
    JP = 0 - CCSK - Knockdown (hard)

    Somersault Skull Diver:
    JP = 0 - CCSK

    EX Somersault Skull Diver:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Super:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Doesn't have a lot going on in the juggle department outside of his air combo to ultra. I believe that was Capcom's half-assed attempt to give him a way to land it that wasn't a focus attack.

    Notable Juggles:
    J.mp x2 > Super / Ultra
    Soul Piede:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Soul Spark LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Soul Spark EX:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Soul Spiral (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Soul Reflect (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Super:
    1: JP = 1 - CCHK
    2: JP = 2 - CCHK
    3: JP = 3 - CCHK
    4: JP = 4 - CCHK
    5: JP = 5 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    Grapple: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Not a lot of juggling going on here. She has a setup for one with her soul reflect HP, but it does very little damage and isn't very practical. If you were going to use it to juggle into her super, then you'd have to hit confirm if, and if it's hit confirmed, you might as well use something that hits harder before cancelling into your super.

    Notable Juggles:
    HP.SR > Super
    Falcon Kick:
    1: JP = 1 - CCR

    Target Combo:
    1: JP = 0 - CCR
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Far standing roundhouse:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Float)

    Fragrance Palm:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (standard)

    Jumping HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCFK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Galactic Tornaro LP:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Galactic Tornado MP / HP:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK
    3: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (standard)

    Galactic Tornado EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Messiah Kick LK / MK / HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Messiah Kick High:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Messiah Kick Mid:
    1: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Messiah Kick Low:
    1: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Messiah Kick EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK
    3: JP = 0 - CCSK
    4: JP = 0 - CCSK
    5: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Messiah Followups EX:
    Same as normal followups.

    Snake Strike LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = 3 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Snake Strike EX:
    1: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    5: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    6: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    7: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Super:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    As odd as it may seem, Rufus doesn't really have a lot going on in the juggle department. His ultra and EX Snake Strike are all he can really use for juggling that has any real worth to it. But lucky for him, those two options are all he really needs. EX Snake Strike is the single hardest hitting special in the game at 270 damage and is very easy to land after a j.rh. His ultra is the same way. He has a lot of great ultra setups and EX Snake Strike alone hits harder than many character's bnb combos.

    Notable Juggles:
    J.rh > EX.SS / Super / Ultra
    TC > Super / Ultra
    Jumping MP:
    1: JP = 0 - FKR - CCFK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Hadouken LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Hadouken EX:
    1: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Tatsumaki LK / MK / HK / Air:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Tatsumaki EX:
    1: JP = 5 - CCSK
    2: JP = 5 - CCSK
    3: JP = 5 - CCSK
    4: JP = 5 - CCSK
    5: JP = 5 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Air Tatsumaki EX: <-- Requires Further Testing
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = 3 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    5: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shoryuken LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shoryuken EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Super:
    All hits: JP = 5 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    All Hits: JP = 8 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Shoryuken is an awesome juggle setup tool. His normal specials don't offer much in terms of juggling, but EX Hadouken and EX Tatsu are fantastic for it. It's entirely possible to EX Tatsu > EX Tatsu > Ultra someone in the corner, though the timing is hella-strict and may be character specific. A lot of Ryu's strength lies in his ability to easily connect his ultra or super after shoryu's. Early LP.SRK > EX Hadouken is also one of the best jump-in punishes in the game for how easy it is to connect and how little it costs you.

    Notable Juggles:
    FP.SRK > FADC > EX.FB / EX Tatsu / Ultra
    AA LP.SRK > EX FB / Super / Ultra
    EX Tatsu > EX FB / Ultra
    Air Tatsu > Super
    Forward HK:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Jumping MP:
    1: JP = 1 - CCR

    Tiger Shot LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Tiger Shot / LK / MK / HK:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Tiger Shot EX (Both):
    1: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Tiger Knee LK / MK / HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Tiger Knee EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Tiger Uppercut LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Tiger Uppercut EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = 3 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    5: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Super:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard) <-- From the uppercut on

    Ultra:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard) <-- From the uppercut on

    Notes:
    He has a command normal that juggles into itself.
    He has JP on his normal fireballs.
    Nuff said.

    Notable Juggles:
    F.RH > F.RH / TS(EX) / Super / Ultra
    FP.SRK > FADC > F.RH / TS(EX) / Ultra
    Hadouken LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Hadouken EX:
    1: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shunpukyaku LK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCR

    Shunpukyaku MK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCR
    2: JP = 0 - CCR

    Shunpukyaku HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCR
    2: JP = 0 - CCR
    3: JP = 0 - CCR

    Shunpukyaku EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCR
    2: JP = 0 - CCR
    3: JP = 0 - CCR
    4: JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Air Shunpukyaku:
    Every hit of every version: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Shoryuken LP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shoryuken MP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK
    3: JP = 0 - CCSK
    4: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shoryuken HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK
    3: JP = 0 - CCSK
    4: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    5: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    6: JP = 3 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Shoryken EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK
    3: JP = 0 - CCSK
    4: JP = 0 - CCSK
    5: JP = 0 - CCSK
    6: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    7: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    8: JP = 3 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Sakura Otoshi (All):
    1: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 3 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 4 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    *Super:*
    1-6: JP = 0 - CCR
    7: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    *Yes, her super actually -resets them- if you try to juggle with it*

    Ultra:
    1-2: *Unique Trait* Stands the opponent on the ground out of the air - JP = 0
    3: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    4+: Animated ultra

    Notes:
    One would think, given her ex.tatsu, that she'd be really great for juggling...but not so much. It's good for resets, but that's about where it ends. The biggest improvement to Sakura would be to amp up the JP on her shoryuken's. If her SRK's knocked down on first hit and the subsequent hits all had a JP of (Hit Number - 1), she'd be a lot better than she is now--a lot better. Being able to do things like EX.Tatsu > Land a full HP.SRK afterwards.

    Also, as I mentioned before. Don't use her super to juggle...it's hilariously bad.

    Notable Juggles:
    EX Tatsu > Anything but super
    Jumping Medium Punch:
    1: JP = 0 - FKR - CCFK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK

    Crouching Hard Punch:
    1: JP = 0 - CCR
    2: JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Head Stomps:
    1: JP = 2 - CCSK
    2: JP = 3 - CCSK
    3: JP = 4 - CCSK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Dive Kick:
    1: JP = 4 - CCR

    Sonic Boom (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Lightning Legs (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCFK *Unique Property* -- Stands a person up out of the air (creating a glitched standing float, where you stand on the ground, but moves affect you like you were in a normal float knockdown, so if you get hit by a CCR move, you're invurnable until you come out of hitstun, but this only happens if the first hit of LL connects when you are in the air. You can still be grabbed though, and be hit by normal move xx super)
    2-16: JP = 0 - FRK - no hitstun
    17: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knockdown (standard)

    Shoryuken LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK
    3: JP = 2 - CCSK

    Shoryuken EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK
    3+: JP = 2+ - CCSK

    Tanden engine:
    1: JP = 0 - grapple - can't hit unless opponent is in standing float

    EX Tanden Engine:
    1: JP = infinite, *Unique Property* -- Stands a person up out of the air

    Spinning Pile Driver (All):
    Grapple: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Super:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    Initial Hit: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Talk about a juggle-heavy character. Even his dive-kick has 4 JP. That's fuckin ridiculous. His Tandem Engine having seemingly infinite JP is from doing things like EX SRK > EX TE. His EX SRK hits something like 6 or 7 times setting the JP very high. It could use more testing, but I'm fairly sure you can't EX SRK > Head Stomps, if you could (and when I have free time I'll check, or if one of you could kindly check that'd be great) then it would disprove my initial Head Stomp JP (Not his dive-kick JP though, that's solid and testable) AND the EX Tandem Engine JP.

    Things like j.mp > EX Tandem Engine are entirely possible, and you can do some seriously damaging shit with it.

    Notable Juggles:
    c.fp > EX Tandem Engine / LL / lp.srk / super / ultra
    LL > Head Stomps
    lp.srk > Head Stomps
    ex.srk > EX Tandem Engine
    Head Stomps > Dive Kick
    J.mp > j.mp / dive kick / head stomps / EX Tandem Engine
    Down Forward HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Rolling Crystal Flash (All):
    All Hits: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Scarlet Terror LK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Scartlet Terror MK / HK / EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Sky High Claw LP / MP / HP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Sky High Claw EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Flying Barcelona Attack EX:
    On the way up:
    JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)
    Claw Attack:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    Grapple:
    1: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Super:
    Claw Attack:
    1-3: JP = infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    4: JP = infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)
    Grapple:
    1: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    All Hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    They really tried to give him some juggling options with his DF.RH kick, ST, and EX FBA, but it's not enough to be a viable playstyle really. He still has basically no hit-confirms that aren't a series of 1 frame links, nor does he have any useful cancel's outside of EX FBA. In juggling terms, he's actually not that impressive, as the juggles he can do are wholly pre-determined and leave you with linear options.

    Notable Juggles:
    lk.ST > EX ST
    Running Bear Grab (All):
    Grapple: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Spinning Pile Driver (All):
    Grapple: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Lariat (All P / K):
    All Hits: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Green Hand LP / MP / HP:

    1: JP = 0 - CCSK

    Green Hand EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Super:
    Grapple: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ultra:
    Grapple: JP = 0 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Notes:
    Lariat to EX Green Hand is all he really has.

    Notable Juggles:
    AA K Lariat > EX GH
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    To answer West's question from the previous thread:

    Shaku does not have 4 JP, though it would certainly appear that way at first. What actually happens is the very first hit causes Float Knockdown, the second hit causes standard knockdown, the third hit juggles and puts the JC to 1.

    The next shaku hits twice, putting the JC to 3, then the third hit whiffs.

    This is testable by LP.DP > FP.Shaku > FP.SRK in the corner. The SRK totally whiffs because the FP.Shaku wasn't able to put them in float knockdown (since they were already in Standard Knockdown from the LP.DP).

    However, at base, the FP.Shaku > FP.SRK in the corner, does work. The SRK connects it's third hit, because as I outlined above, a place FP.Shaku has a JC of 1 afterwards, letting a move with JP 2 (the third hit of FP.DP) connect.
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • Pokey86Pokey86 Persistent Git Joined: Posts: 551
    ^^So in regards to Shaku^^

    Hypothetically, if we did LK Tatsu -> Shaku -> We could then do SRK, because the first hit is changing the style of stun.
    Pokey--the difference between Float State and Standard Knockdown JP 0, is that you can put someone in a position where the counter is 0 and not be able to hit them with a normal (unless, much like Sagat's F.RH, it has a JP to it)

    Yeah, i forgot about Sagats "Normal" exception

    Float state is a state in which there is no juggle counter (as odd as that sounds). Because Float States only last a single hit, then they are put into another state, unless the attack you're using can put them back into float state via a reset.

    I'm certain you don't mean reset as in airborne hit = reset & more along the lines of resetting the JP counter)

    The rolling Abel situation wouldn't change--that's not a juggling issue, that's a spacing issue and timing issue. You didn't hit them with anything different than you did before, so the ultra can theoretically connect, but if it's not going to catch them, it's not going to catch them.

    What i'm saying is, the spacing doesn't change, from the first hit to the second hit the spacing just desn't seem to alter. I've tried many times at hitting the first combo & many times on the second one & i can do the first consistently, the second however... Never

    I'll glady make a video to illustrate my point :P

    & in regards to Able s Cr.HP. Are you saying it puts them in to float knockdown, then the second hit adds one to the counter?I only say this because most moves that offer float stun, usually when hit again keep the character in float stun. (Second hit of kens SRK [Hitting Float stun] Ryu, Seth, J.MP & Rufus J.HK for example... All the first hits in these particular moves, second move can't hit)

    What i mean is Abels doesn't follow this trend, as, i'm guessing capcom had the forsight to know that this could technically be done forever in the corner.

    ---

    Wow, youplan on doing every character, that is going to take quite some time. Good luck :P& great job so far
  • kte03kte03 The Hundreds Joined: Posts: 1,013
    sorry if I'm derailing this thread but... Kich got banned. He got 2 infractions in one page :wow: http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=210268&page=25

    He received both infractions from gilley on an argument about CvS2 and Sonic Hurricane. I don't see why he deserved it though, especially his first post, which was labeled as "trolling". The 2nd one I guess since he was being sarcastic. But really, no offence to gilley but he seems carried away :confused:
    My avatar is really Dudley in disguise.
  • elwoodelwood your mothers dick... Joined: Posts: 253
    oh.

    word?
    A lot of good has come from drugs. I think 'Penny Lane' is worth 10 dead kids. Dark Side of the Moon is worth 100 dead kids. Because a lot of kids wouldn't even be born if it weren't for that album, so it evens out.
  • WestWest westernets Joined: Posts: 926 mod
    back to doing your thing kich :tup:
    Whence cometh evil
  • LordofUltimaLordofUltima MY MOVES R NOTHING Joined: Posts: 844
    sorry if I'm derailing this thread but... Kich got banned. He got 2 infractions in one page :wow: http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=210268&page=25

    He received both infractions from gilley on an argument about CvS2 and Sonic Hurricane. I don't see why he deserved it though, especially his first post, which was labeled as "trolling". The 2nd one I guess since he was being sarcastic. But really, no offence to gilley but he seems carried away :confused:

    SRK Bans happen out of nowhere, don't question it. I've said too much *fearful of ban-hammer*
    ...yeah, but the summers are real nice in Washington.
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    Well now that I'm back from my, let's say, extended vacation away from SRK *coughtempbancough*...I have time to update my investigations into the SF4 Juggle System.

    A massive update has happened! I suggest browsing the now-very-short list of updates, but suffice to say, I completed every available character.

    Later, sometime tomorrow, I'll answer some of the lingering questions (Pokey's namely) that have been waiting for my week long trip to be over.
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    ^^So in regards to Shaku^^

    Hypothetically, if we did LK Tatsu -> Shaku -> We could then do SRK, because the first hit is changing the style of stun.



    What i'm saying is, the spacing doesn't change, from the first hit to the second hit the spacing just desn't seem to alter. I've tried many times at hitting the first combo & many times on the second one & i can do the first consistently, the second however... Never

    I'll glady make a video to illustrate my point :P

    & in regards to Able s Cr.HP. Are you saying it puts them in to float knockdown, then the second hit adds one to the counter?I only say this because most moves that offer float stun, usually when hit again keep the character in float stun. (Second hit of kens SRK [Hitting Float stun] Ryu, Seth, J.MP & Rufus J.HK for example... All the first hits in these particular moves, second move can't hit)

    What i mean is Abels doesn't follow this trend, as, i'm guessing capcom had the forsight to know that this could technically be done forever in the corner.

    ---

    Wow, youplan on doing every character, that is going to take quite some time. Good luck :P& great job so far

    To clarify: Abel's c.fp (cr.HP) first hit doesn't knock them down. You can c.fp > FADC and they'll still be standing. The second hit does though, the second hit knocks them up into the air into a float knockdown.

    Now, this second hit doesn't have any properties that would reset (reset = put them back into float knockdown state, not to be confused with Reset State which is when you hit them out of the air (typically) with a normal attack) their float state, so they go into standard knockdown state.

    Float Knockdown lasts 1 hit. Unless the has the property "Float Knockdown Reset" (which abel's c.fp doesn't) then anything used on them afterwards will either put them in Reset State, Standard Knockdown, or Hard Knockdown. In this case, Abel's C.fp second hit will put them into Standard Knockdown if you use it after they're already in float knockdown.

    Ultimately, it'd be easier to show me what you're describing--include in the video the combo you're doing that works, and then the one that doesn't work.

    My assumption is that the Ultra either won't connect because they're too high / too low to the ground or that the second c.fp you're trying to do is connect on the first hit rather than the second: the first hit will put them in Reset State, not a knockdown state, which means nothing will combo from there on out.
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • Pokey86Pokey86 Persistent Git Joined: Posts: 551
    OK, upon testing my offshoot problem with Abel, i am wrong, & it was simply timing, amazed i can fuck that up 10 times but perform it nearly everytime doing it the other way :P

    I had a thorough look through you're character by character info, thought i'd add some more info to it. & a few corrections, if you think any are wrong let me know & i'll look deeper.


    I can confirm that at least the first 3 hits of Akumas Tatsu is JP 5, i did this by EX Shaku -> EX Shaku -> FADC -> EX Tatsu (Hits twice)

    I also learnt that Akuma can do two EX Shaku's back to back without FADC & it'll do 300 damage, not really useful, but still. Doesn't even have to be cornered.

    I also did LP SRK -> MP SRK -> HP SRK-> EX Tatsu hits 3 times. As for the air one, i can't seem to get it to hit more than 4 times, but it ends with the last hit, so i guess it could be a hit box thing.
    Akuma
    Air Tatsumaki LK / MK / HK:
    1: JP = 0 - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Akumas second hit of Air Tatsu is also Float, it's just that if you hit both the JP hits 1
    Balrog
    Super:
    All hits: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Ican't say for his ultra (Minimum JP 1) but his Super is a bit more spurious than infinite. First off, you can't do Headbutt -> Ultra -> Super & second you can't do Ultra -> Super whilst wall hugging, the first 1 hit has to whiff.

    What i thihk is, the Ultra has two knockdown hits at the end (making the enemy end in JP 2. & the Super may have the JP 1-2-3-4-5 for it's respective attacks. can't figure out a way to test this though.
    Cammy
    Her ultra is unique in that it stands them up of it connects, even if they're airborne. So while she's not intense on the juggling, her limited juggling options are superb.

    I've never been capable of standing the opponent up, does it have to be the first hit only? I tested this with FA Lvl 3 (Air hit) -> Ultra


    Gen
    Mantis Super:
    Initial hit: JP = Infinite - CCFK - Knock Down (Float)

    Mantis Ultra:
    Initial hit: JP = Infinite - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Both of these are JP 0, to test, simply do Air Target (single hit)

    You also didn't mention Gens Cr.LK (Crane) whichcause float knockdown
    Ken
    Air Tatsu EX:

    1: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    4: JP = Infinite - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Sadly these arn't infite, in fact they're only JP 4, You can do 2 EX Tatsu's back to back, if the first does 3 hits, the second will only do 2, if you can pull off 4 hits the second will only do 1, which is a shame. I was sure at one timei was able to pull LP SRK -> EX Tatsu 4 hits -> EX Tatsu 1 hit, but i can't seem to pull it off now.
    Ken
    Tatsumaki LK / MK / HK:
    All Hits: JP = 0 - CCSK

    One of these hits (I think the last) does JP 1, do an air hit of the first hit & the last (or possibly second to last, not sure) will hit, the first hit isn't float as if you FADC an HP SRK will only hit once. I'm talking about the MK & HK versions only

    Bisons Bisons EX Scissors is JP 1 on second hit.
    Rose
    Super:

    1: JP = 0 - CCHK
    2: JP = 1 - CCHK
    3: JP = 2 - CCHK
    4: JP = 3 - CCHK
    5: JP = 4 - CCHK
    6: JP = 5 - CCHK - Knock Down (Hard)

    Roses Super only has 5 hits, starting at JP 1, it's also wise to note that, Her Super benefits from the strength increase she gains from absorbing fireballs, normally it does 300 damage, however with absorption it's maximum reaches a nice 407.
    Rufus
    Messiah Kick High:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Rufus's LK Variation of his MEssiah follow on is actuall JP 1, to test this i did EX Messiah 1 hit on air opponent, then the follow on, then FADC'd & tried Falcon Kick or Tornado

    Also Rufus's Falcon Kick is JP 1, easy to test, do Fragrance Palm in corner then Dive kick, or J.HK then dive kick.

    You also didn't mention his far HK(Float stun) or Fragrance Palm. Which i think are worth mentioning :P
    Ryu
    It's entirely possible to EX Tatsu > EX Tatsu > Ultra someone in the corner, though the timing is hella-strict and may be character specific. It is however, one of the most damaging ways to land an ultra in the game

    It's really not, even without testing the JP would make it to high to be worthwhile for the Ultra. But i did test, EX Tatsu x 2 -> Ultra does 519. EX Tatsu -> Ultra does 515 :P

    However you can't knock the 400 that EX Tatsu EX Tatsu does, testing it out i can only consistently do it on Dahlsim, you need a small gap between you, As for combos you can do J.HP -> Cr.lP -> CR.HP -> EX Tatsu -> EX Tatsu For the full whollop (470 damage 735 stun)

    Or take off the Cr.Lp for a combo that does less damage -> more stun (775)

    I might do a quick test to see who it can hit on & who it can't. but i'll post that up in the Ryu section i guess.
    Sakura
    Sakura Otoshi (All):
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    3: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Sakuras Otoshi is actually JP 1 -> 2 -> 3 progression, to test this to the simple combo. EX Tatsu -> HP SRK -> FADC -> Otoshi. HP SRK hit's once making it JP 1 startoff

    Sakura
    Shoryuken MP:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK
    3: JP = 1 - CCSK
    4: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Not sure how you came to this conclusion, i mean after a LP SRK you can MP SRK, i've tried using various ways (EX TAtsu, HP SRK -> FADC -> MP SRK for example) & have been unable to hit 2 hits.
    Sakura
    Shoryken EX:
    1: JP = 0 - CCSK
    2: JP = 0 - CCSK
    3: JP = 0 - CCSK
    4: JP = 0 - CCSK
    5: JP = 0 - CCSK
    6: JP = 0 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    7: JP = 1 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)
    8: JP = 2 - CCSK - Knock Down (Standard)

    Last 3 hits are JP 1-2-3 not 0-1-2. To prove this, go to the corner, hit EX Tatsu, then do EX SRK, the first upper will hit once, the second will hit 3 times.

    ---

    & lastly i can say without a shadow of a doubt that you are spot on with Seths Head stomps & Dive kicks. Do 2 SRk's & you'll hit the three head stomps but not the dive kick. Do 3 SRK's & the stomps will never hit (unless you EX Tandem an EX SRK)

    Great overview, i'd suggest putting this in the general board so that possibly it can be stickied, this gives people a good deal to go off to find out what is possible & what isn't.

    Hope i helped :P
  • Bojador_ptBojador_pt Joined: Posts: 420
    Kich I know for a fact that you can juggle with a HP FB after a j.MP with Ryu. But if all non ex FB have JP=0 how is that possible? Also I think that you can have a full 8 hit ultra after a juggle ex FB that has JP=2. JC=2 + 6 = 8 =JP Ultra

    Confused...

    Edit: Also, you you catch your opp in the air with a FA you can juggle with HP srk but not with LP srk, so they must have different properties right?
    www.ptfighters.com

    Comunidade Portuguesa de Fighting Games
  • LordofUltimaLordofUltima MY MOVES R NOTHING Joined: Posts: 844
    Kich I know for a fact that you can juggle with a HP FB after a j.MP with Ryu. But if all non ex FB have JP=0 how is that possible? Also I think that you can have a full 8 hit ultra after a juggle ex FB that has JP=2. JC=2 + 6 = 8 =JP Ultra

    Confused...

    Edit: Also, you you catch your opp in the air with a FA you can juggle with HP srk but not with LP srk, so they must have different properties right?

    MP and HP SRK you can usually get people that are in juggle state, although the HP is more fool proof. The LP is a strange thing.
    ...yeah, but the summers are real nice in Washington.
  • Bojador_ptBojador_pt Joined: Posts: 420
    Yes I know but if you look at Kich data there's nothing that acounts for that. And when you do j.mp if you get only 1 hit you can juggle with lp srk and I think both mp and hp doesn't juggle in such scenario.

    Like I said, confused...
    www.ptfighters.com

    Comunidade Portuguesa de Fighting Games
  • LordofUltimaLordofUltima MY MOVES R NOTHING Joined: Posts: 844
    Yes I know but if you look at Kich data there's nothing that acounts for that. And when you do j.mp if you get only 1 hit you can juggle with lp srk and I think both mp and hp doesn't juggle in such scenario.

    Like I said, confused...

    I didn't even consider that this thread was about anyone other than Akuma's juggling abilities. Should have actually read the beginning of the post I suppose.
    ...yeah, but the summers are real nice in Washington.
  • akuma noobakuma noob Joined: Posts: 121
    resetting the juggle?

    ok ive been doing this in matches on xbox.......... lk tatsu>hpsrk>fadc>hphado , but when i get them in the corner with this i finish with a ex tatsu not for the damage obviously but in the hope they will sling shot back to the corner with a reset juggle counter for another srk is it even possible they keep going the wrong side of me when i do it so i never get to try the final srk
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174
    Is this still a work in progress? Because I see a lot of stuff that is wrong. I can tell you if you want, it's mainly about Honda.

    But why is this in the Akuma section? This should be a sticky in the main SF4 section.
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

    "Combo Hunter", A Street Fighter V Season 2 Combo Video
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    Is this still a work in progress? Because I see a lot of stuff that is wrong. I can tell you if you want, it's mainly about Honda.

    But why is this in the Akuma section? This should be a sticky in the main SF4 section.

    Started as an akuma-only thing that I expanded into the whole cast. And yeah, PM me any incorrect data (preferably with a video) and I'll change it asap. Looking through some of the replies.

    Thank you pokey, huge update ^_^.
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • Pokey86Pokey86 Persistent Git Joined: Posts: 551
    Yes I know but if you look at Kich data there's nothing that acounts for that. And when you do j.mp if you get only 1 hit you can juggle with lp srk and I think both mp and hp doesn't juggle in such scenario.

    Like I said, confused...


    I think you're confused with Kich's Data

    In regards to Ryu J.MP Kich states
    1: JP = 0 - FKR - CCFK
    2: JP = 1 - CCSK

    JP = 0 means that the first hit of J.MP will not hit in a juggle state (After SRK -> FADC the enemy is in a basic juggle state of JP 1)

    FKR = Float Knockdown Reset, this is a rare charecteristic that, when it hits, it puts the enemy BACK in float state

    CCKF = Can Cause Float Knockdown, Float knockdown is when the enemy is in a juggle state but anything can hit.

    ---

    So he did explain it :P If all you hit is the second hit, then the enemy will act as if you hit both, hit the first & you can do what you want after.

    As for the SRK's, it's either a hitbox or active frame issue.



    Is this still a work in progress? Because I see a lot of stuff that is wrong. I can tell you if you want, it's mainly about Honda.

    But why is this in the Akuma section? This should be a sticky in the main SF4 section.

    Could you PM me as well, i'm eager to know any corrections, & yeah i had no idea why he did a full work up in the Akuma section, i thought he'd put it in the general board :P
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    Kich I know for a fact that you can juggle with a HP FB after a j.MP with Ryu. But if all non ex FB have JP=0 how is that possible? Also I think that you can have a full 8 hit ultra after a juggle ex FB that has JP=2. JC=2 + 6 = 8 =JP Ultra

    Confused...

    Edit: Also, you you catch your opp in the air with a FA you can juggle with HP srk but not with LP srk, so they must have different properties right?

    To the first part about j.mp, no--you can't. 2 hit j.mp doesn't let you do any normal fireball afterward, it -has- to be EX. If it's just the first hit, then yes, that works because the first hit puts them in float and in float state you can be hit by anything.

    As for the ultra juggle, you also can't. fp srk > ex hadou > ultra (FADC's respectively) is a 9 hit combo. 1 from the srk, 2 from the hadou, and 6 from the ultra. You can try that out yourself in training mode, you'll notice the ultra hits 6 times and then carries on through them.

    As for the lp srk and fp srk issue, depends on which stage of an FA you hit them with, at level 2 or higher, you can hit them with either lp or fp srk. Just tested this myself. They have the same properties.
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    Pokey-- When a character is initially knocked down, the JC is 0. SRK > FADC would be Juggle Count 0, not 1, since the initial knockdown doesn't add anything to the JC, nor does any attack that alters a player state.

    So the J.MP looks like this:
    The first hit connects, puts them in float state-- JC = 0 Float Knockdown
    The second hit connects, puts them in standard knockdown-- JC = 0 Standard Knockdown

    At this point, anything with a JP of 1 or greater will connect, but nothing of JP 0 will connect. This is why you can't SRK, normal hadouken, normal tatsu, or land a normal move on them afterwards, but the second hit of EX SRK, both hits of EX Hadouken, EX Tatsu, his Super, and his Ultra will all connect (permitting the possibility of landing them).
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • Pokey86Pokey86 Persistent Git Joined: Posts: 551
    This is still just confusion of my terminology to yours :P we know the same thing we're just explaining it differently... >_<

    I use JP 0 as float stun, purely because... Well, a Float juggle is still a juggle state, i'll remember in future, no need to confuse people further
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174
    This is one long PM, let me tell you.

    When someone is hit with a float knockdown move, doesn't that mean that their JC is -1? Because even moves with JP 0 can hit it?
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

    "Combo Hunter", A Street Fighter V Season 2 Combo Video
  • Pokey86Pokey86 Persistent Git Joined: Posts: 551
    ^^Yeah, that was why i kept it as JP-0 (as in, an aerial opponent is JP 0)

    Didn't want to get in to minuses, seemed silly :P

    But yeah, in Kich's style,i guess a float juggle is JP-1
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174
    And there I sent my PM. A whopping 6 pages in word XD

    Oh, and Vegas sky high claw doesn't knock down on ground hit. But Blankas d,u+K and b,f+K balls does.
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

    "Combo Hunter", A Street Fighter V Season 2 Combo Video
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    This is one long PM, let me tell you.

    When someone is hit with a float knockdown move, doesn't that mean that their JC is -1? Because even moves with JP 0 can hit it?

    That's certainly a way of thinking about it, yes, -1 is probably a bit easier to wrap your head around rather than the longer explanation of it.

    Reading your PM now. Will update what needs to be updated (thank you for providing some links). Thank you for contributing, this is exactly what I was hoping for when taking on the whole cast!

    Some things to clear up from your PM:
    - a FP.SRK from Akuma doesn't knock down until the second hit, so when used on the ground, you can connect lp and mp shaku's since after FADC'ing the 3rd hit, the JC is only 1.

    - I was able to finally juggle into his ex air tatsu. It's 0-1-2-3-4 for the 5 hits, just like Ryu's is. The problem is, it's very difficult to connect given that the first hit will whiff. When it does, it looks weird as hell. You suck them up into you and they get hit by the backswing of your leg then get thrown into your rotations. You almost have to jump past them to some extent.

    - Yes, Notable juggles are listed as follows: Disregards meter possibilities. It's shown as "Move" > "Everything that's able to juggle off of this move." That way it condenses space, rather than listing every complicated juggle scenario, just a brief list of what can actually juggle off of what.

    - Chun's EX SBK, unlike the tatsu's, actually knocks people down every hit. There's no way to land 3 in a row since the first 2 put the JC to 9 (the initial hit knocks down, the following 9 add to the JP, making a 10 hit combo).

    - Dhalsim's Ultra is CCSK - Knock Down (Float) -- which means, as you described, if they're not on the ground it'll cause standard knockdown, otherwise it will cause float knockdown.

    - I'd have to thoroughly test that Fei Long assumption, I'm far more inclined to believe that has to do with shady hitboxes rather than the second and forth hits randomly not being able to juggle like that.

    - Yes, the first hit of Gouken's EX Palm does -not- cause float knockdown. It doesn't knock down to begin with, so if they're in the air or in crumple 2, it'll standardly knock them down.

    - Added all of the accurate data you gave me (which was just about all of it). Some of the moves weren't included initially due to their inability to be juggled into, or my hasty assumption that you just couldn't juggle with them (Bison, is mainly whom I'm referring to). Updated the honda info as well as every other character you provided me info for.

    - Seth's EX Tanden Engine doesn't put them in a glitched stun state, it's just normal hit stun. I'm unsure of how you found that Lightning Kick data out, as afaik you can't FADC out of it? A video explaining what you wrote would be very useful, as as far as I knew, the whole attack is simply a combo to which the last hit causes standard knockdown. The rest of the hits don't knockdown, don't need JP, and is just hitting someone with an abundance of hit-stun.

    - In regards to Hard Knockdowns, I suppose I should be more clear about that. I was trying to write it in such a way that it just implied that...typically, anything that causes Hard Knockdown ends a juggle since most things that do are Super's, ultras, etc. but by no means does it actually do so. Just more often than not, that's the case. Realistically speaking, it's just a knockdown state in which the person can't tech the landing from and, again, as far as I know, can't go back to float or standard knockdown.

    I view the knockdowns as a hierarchy-- Float > Standard > Hard, once it hits one, it can't go back. There are no moves that put you from standard to float, just as there are no moves that put you from hard to standard. Updated the main page to reflect an easier understanding of Hard Knockdowns.
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174
    - Chun's EX SBK, unlike the tatsu's, actually knocks people down every hit. There's no way to land 3 in a row since the first 2 put the JC to 9 (the initial hit knocks down, the following 9 add to the JP, making a 10 hit combo).

    But i positioned myself so that the first one only did three hits, then the second one did five, then the third one whiffed completely. It shouldn't whiff as the LP should be 7, maybe the hits have 5,6,7,8,9 LP?
    - I'd have to thoroughly test that Fei Long assumption, I'm far more inclined to believe that has to do with shady hitboxes rather than the second and forth hits randomly not being able to juggle like that.

    I'm quite sure what I said is correct, because it's hits 2 and 4 that causes the rest of the ultra animation. Try doing flame kick FADC ultra, so that the 2nd hit "hits" the opponent.
    - Seth's EX Tanden Engine doesn't put them in a glitched stun state, it's just normal hit stun. I'm unsure of how you found that Lightning Kick data out, as afaik you can't FADC out of it? A video explaining what you wrote would be very useful, as as far as I knew, the whole attack is simply a combo to which the last hit causes standard knockdown. The rest of the hits don't knockdown, don't need JP, and is just hitting someone with an abundance of hit-stun.

    if you get hit by a projectile between the first and second hit of lightning legs, this weird state occurs. Here's an example (last combo), but because I cought him on the ground, he was just in a normal standing float, but with no control:
    I don't know exactly how the move works, but judgjing from the properties of the first and the last hit, my explanation makes sense.

    Try doing ex tanden on a state 2 crumpled opponent, then chain some c.LPs.

    I think this glitched standing float occurs from every move that grounds opponents, because someone told me they had the same problem when catching someone in the air with rufus super, then having him get hit by a projectile after the 2nd hit.
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

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  • Bojador_ptBojador_pt Joined: Posts: 420
    Thanks Kich and Pokey86. It makes sense now.

    BTW, nice to see this sticked...


    Cheers guys
    www.ptfighters.com

    Comunidade Portuguesa de Fighting Games
  • ilitiritilitirit Joined: Posts: 6,373
    But i positioned myself so that the first one only did three hits, then the second one did five, then the third one whiffed completely. It shouldn't whiff as the LP should be 7, maybe the hits have 5,6,7,8,9 LP?

    EX SBK's got funny hitboxes. A few Japanese players actually investigated this using Capcom's debugging kit (it enables you to view hitboxes) and they confirmed that even though you should get hit, sometimes the move whiffs. I've landed in the middle of one once as it started up and didn't get knocked down.
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174
    EX SBK's got funny hitboxes. A few Japanese players actually investigated this using Capcom's debugging kit (it enables you to view hitboxes) and they confirmed that even though you should get hit, sometimes the move whiffs. I've landed in the middle of one once as it started up and didn't get knocked down.

    Ok, then maybe that is the problem.

    But is there proof that it isn't JP 5,6,7,8,9?

    Btw, Yoga mummy (thats j.d.HP) causes CCSK.
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

    "Combo Hunter", A Street Fighter V Season 2 Combo Video
  • MienaikageMienaikage Mitarashi Dango: Data Devourer Joined: Posts: 263


    Now if only Ken could have 7 bars.
  • phoenixnlphoenixnl Joined: Posts: 640
    Just a small correction to the juggling possibilities of viper. Viper can juggle any in air opponent with LP and MP thunder knuckle.

    on a grounded opponent it doesn't juggle of course. On an opponent in juggle state it does work.

    Example of my own quite terrible replay online:

    I think in properties lp and mp Tk are actually identical to HP tk

    The combo in the video is:

    HP xx EX seismo HJC mp thunder knuckle, hp thunder knuckle.

    hp thunder knuckle can be replaced by Ultra or EX burning kick (up to 3 hits).

    On a Focus attack hit, if you wait till opponent is on his knees and you do MP/LP TK (and probably also HP TK) the enemy goes into juggle state, and you can combo into ultra in the corner. If someone jumps up, and you 'anti-air' with LP or MP TK they go into juggle state, after which you can connect ultra as well.
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174
    Just a small correction to the juggling possibilities of viper. Viper can juggle any in air opponent with LP and MP thunder knuckle.

    on a grounded opponent it doesn't juggle of course. On an opponent in juggle state it does work.

    Example of my own quite terrible replay online:

    I think in properties lp and mp Tk are actually identical to HP tk

    The combo in the video is:

    HP xx EX seismo HJC mp thunder knuckle, hp thunder knuckle.

    hp thunder knuckle can be replaced by Ultra or EX burning kick (up to 3 hits).

    On a Focus attack hit, if you wait till opponent is on his knees and you do MP/LP TK (and probably also HP TK) the enemy goes into juggle state, and you can combo into ultra in the corner. If someone jumps up, and you 'anti-air' with LP or MP TK they go into juggle state, after which you can connect ultra as well.
    You seem to have misunderstood his system a little. Seismo causes float juggle, where any move can hit. So when you connect with MK TK, the JC is still 0, because they went from float knockdown to standard knockdown. Now, MP/LP TK have a JP of 0, so they can't connect, but Ultra/HP TK with a JP of 1 can.

    Putting it simple, there's a lot of times you can hit with HP TK, but not LP/MP TK, so it's a better juggling tool.
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

    "Combo Hunter", A Street Fighter V Season 2 Combo Video
  • Pokey86Pokey86 Persistent Git Joined: Posts: 551
    ^^I'm guessing we can expect this alot...^^^


    I'm goiong to make a thorough video, soon. Displaying the key differences between juggle states & the float states.

    Sadly, through no fault of there own (Bare in mind, you Kich & myself have probably been fucking about with this stuff for quite a while.

    & i'd like to know how in that vid Ken went from an EX SRK to that did 2 hits after his Super (I'm guessing it relates to the hits of the Super) then a full Ultra, i'm very skeptical.
  • Smileymike101Smileymike101 Joined: Posts: 1,139
    Kich,you stated that vegas ultra haf infinite juggle.How did you test this?Did you manage to juggle into it?
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174
    infinite = there's no way to make it whiff because of juggle limit. The only combos that I know of into Vegas ultra is FA and df.HK, and any move can hit out of those.
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

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  • Smileymike101Smileymike101 Joined: Posts: 1,139
    Well if you do Scarlet terror then ultra,ultra magically wiffs through them,which i would call as NOT inifite juggle.

    Regarding fei long's ultra,are you sure you can hit with hits 2 and 4?Because if you do antiair LVL3 focus attack which puts themin floating stance, and quiqly do ultra,the 2nd hit goes cleanly through them but doesnt hit,which suggests it not being able to hit airborne opponents, or just how the last hit of cammys ultra cannot trigger the cutscnene on airborne opponent even if he is in float stance.
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    Just a small correction to the juggling possibilities of viper. Viper can juggle any in air opponent with LP and MP thunder knuckle.

    on a grounded opponent it doesn't juggle of course. On an opponent in juggle state it does work.

    Example of my own quite terrible replay online:

    I think in properties lp and mp Tk are actually identical to HP tk

    The combo in the video is:

    HP xx EX seismo HJC mp thunder knuckle, hp thunder knuckle.

    hp thunder knuckle can be replaced by Ultra or EX burning kick (up to 3 hits).

    On a Focus attack hit, if you wait till opponent is on his knees and you do MP/LP TK (and probably also HP TK) the enemy goes into juggle state, and you can combo into ultra in the corner. If someone jumps up, and you 'anti-air' with LP or MP TK they go into juggle state, after which you can connect ultra as well.

    This is all taken into account. Seismo puts people in Float Knockdown, to which anything will be able to juggle them. The video you showed me is you connecting a mp TK on an opponent in float state, you could have just as easily punch or kicked them.

    "Juggle State" is a very vague phrase, since there's several different juggle states. Anyone that's knocked down is in a juggle-able state, it's a matter of whether or not your character has a move that can A: continue the juggle and B: is in range to be able to connect it.
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    ^^I'm guessing we can expect this alot...^^^


    I'm goiong to make a thorough video, soon. Displaying the key differences between juggle states & the float states.

    Sadly, through no fault of there own (Bare in mind, you Kich & myself have probably been fucking about with this stuff for quite a while.

    & i'd like to know how in that vid Ken went from an EX SRK to that did 2 hits after his Super (I'm guessing it relates to the hits of the Super) then a full Ultra, i'm very skeptical.

    Here's how it happens.

    Counter hit FP SRK puts them in float, Ken's super keeps people in Float State if they're already in it on impact.

    Since they're still in float, the initial 2 hits of Ken's EX SRK also keep them in float state (All this is already recorded, except maybe about his super, in my data), since even after all of that they're still in float state, Ken's ultra will fully connect.

    Ken with infinite meter = juggle god.
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174
    Well if you do Scarlet terror then ultra,ultra magically wiffs through them,which i would call as NOT inifite juggle.

    Ultra sometimes look like it will hit, but it won't.
    Regarding fei long's ultra,are you sure you can hit with hits 2 and 4?Because if you do antiair LVL3 focus attack which puts themin floating stance, and quiqly do ultra,the 2nd hit goes cleanly through them but doesnt hit,which suggests it not being able to hit airborne opponents, or just how the last hit of cammys ultra cannot trigger the cutscnene on airborne opponent even if he is in float stance.

    You can't. I've already mentioned this. And with cammy, I'm quite sure it's the last hit before the cannon spike that triggers the rest of the ultra.

    Btw, you still have standard knockdown on rufus far s.HK, its float on the ground, and standard in the air.

    And speaking of Rufus, the HK finish of his messiah kick has CCSK, not CCHK.
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

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  • Pokey86Pokey86 Persistent Git Joined: Posts: 551
    - Yes, the first hit of Gouken's EX Palm does -not- cause float knockdown. It doesn't knock down to begin with, so if they're in the air or in crumple 2, it'll standardly knock them down.

    If hit in the air, the first hit of his EX palm does cause float state, the second hit then hits making it JP0 (In your terminology, Kich), to prove this, simply do Back throw -> EX Palm -> FADC (After first hit)-> Ultra

    Also in regards to his super i imagine it has ascending JP rather than full infinite. To test this, do J.MP x 2 then Super, it's incredibly hard to hit any extra hits.

    ---

    It's pretty clear now that in SFIV the developers are just choosing what effects a particular move has, as to whether it hits air or not, there clearly isn't a set methodology to it.To many variations to basepoint that, because a move does standard stun on a standing opponent that it won't/will, Reset/Standard/Float juggle them.

    I'd have guessed after people saw that SRK's hitting full in air & not resetting the opponent on the stun hits (Akuma/Kens MP first hit for example)

    But in terms of air hits, am i wrong in saying there really is only 4 states the enemy can go? Untechable knockdown (ex: Akuma Palm) Reset (Sakuras lol Super) Standard Knockdown (LP SRK, from shotos) & Float knockdown (Gouken Projectiles)
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174
    If hit in the air, the first hit of his EX palm does cause float state, the second hit then hits making it JP0 (In your terminology, Kich), to prove this, simply do Back throw -> EX Palm -> FADC (After first hit)-> Ultra

    Also in regards to his super i imagine it has ascending JP rather than full infinite. To test this, do J.MP x 2 then Super, it's incredibly hard to hit any extra hits.

    ---

    It's pretty clear now that in SFIV the developers are just choosing what effects a particular move has, as to whether it hits air or not, there clearly isn't a set methodology to it.To many variations to basepoint that, because a move does standard stun on a standing opponent that it won't/will, Reset/Standard/Float juggle them.

    I'd have guessed after people saw that SRK's hitting full in air & not resetting the opponent on the stun hits (Akuma/Kens MP first hit for example)

    But in terms of air hits, am i wrong in saying there really is only 4 states the enemy can go? Untechable knockdown (ex: Akuma Palm) Reset (Sakuras lol Super) Standard Knockdown (LP SRK, from shotos) & Float knockdown (Gouken Projectiles)

    untechable standard knockdown from some supers/ultras :3
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

    "Combo Hunter", A Street Fighter V Season 2 Combo Video
  • Pokey86Pokey86 Persistent Git Joined: Posts: 551
    untechable standard knockdown from some supers/ultras :3



    ... Fine.... One upme why don't you


    :P
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    The Lightning Legs situation isn't necessarily a unique player state. All it is is that the move, once it connects, forces the rest of the animation on your opponent. Notice how Akuma violently convulses then gets launched--those are the kicks "connecting".

    So what it means is that the hit stun of that move is independent of the kicks, and only the initial hit matters.
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174
    Yes, that's why I listed hits 2-16 as "no hitstun". The 17th hit results in a different knockback arc than the one seen in the video. In the video, he is still on the ground when he is flying through the air.

    If you hit them on the ground, they're in normal hitstun, but when you hit them in the air, they're in a weird state between airborne and standing.
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

    "Combo Hunter", A Street Fighter V Season 2 Combo Video
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126
    Yes, that's why I listed hits 2-16 as "no hitstun". The 17th hit results in a different knockback arc than the one seen in the video. In the video, he is still on the ground when he is flying through the air.

    If you hit them on the ground, they're in normal hitstun, but when you hit them in the air, they're in a weird state between airborne and standing.

    Does he actually fall to the ground if you do nothing at that point?
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174
    Does he actually fall to the ground if you do nothing at that point?

    Yes. Experiment with it a little yourself, you can see the set-up in that video.
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

    "Combo Hunter", A Street Fighter V Season 2 Combo Video
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174

    0:12, LP snake strike has 5 hits? I had no idea.
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

    "Combo Hunter", A Street Fighter V Season 2 Combo Video
  • KichKich Joined: Posts: 1,126

    0:12, LP snake strike has 5 hits? I had no idea.

    Hey, I'm back. Anyways, I never knew about this. I tried very, very hard to get his snake strike to hit more than 3 times in the air and never could. I suppose for completions sake I could alter it but, quite frankly, if those hits never connect in a situation in which you'd be using the move the juggle, it doesn't particularly matter to the point of this thread.
    If hit in the air, the first hit of his EX palm does cause float state, the second hit then hits making it JP0 (In your terminology, Kich), to prove this, simply do Back throw -> EX Palm -> FADC (After first hit)-> Ultra

    Also in regards to his super i imagine it has ascending JP rather than full infinite. To test this, do J.MP x 2 then Super, it's incredibly hard to hit any extra hits.

    ---

    It's pretty clear now that in SFIV the developers are just choosing what effects a particular move has, as to whether it hits air or not, there clearly isn't a set methodology to it.To many variations to basepoint that, because a move does standard stun on a standing opponent that it won't/will, Reset/Standard/Float juggle them.

    I'd have guessed after people saw that SRK's hitting full in air & not resetting the opponent on the stun hits (Akuma/Kens MP first hit for example)

    But in terms of air hits, am i wrong in saying there really is only 4 states the enemy can go? Untechable knockdown (ex: Akuma Palm) Reset (Sakuras lol Super) Standard Knockdown (LP SRK, from shotos) & Float knockdown (Gouken Projectiles)

    This is all correct. My intention with saying that gouken's palm didn't knockdown was that (again, being knee deep in my jargon) the move itself doesn't actually have a knockdown property. It has the potential to knockdown, but only if they're in the air or some similar situation. On a normal, grounded opponent the move won't knock down though.
    Well if you do Scarlet terror then ultra,ultra magically wiffs through them,which i would call as NOT inifite juggle.

    Regarding fei long's ultra,are you sure you can hit with hits 2 and 4?Because if you do antiair LVL3 focus attack which puts themin floating stance, and quiqly do ultra,the 2nd hit goes cleanly through them but doesnt hit,which suggests it not being able to hit airborne opponents, or just how the last hit of cammys ultra cannot trigger the cutscnene on airborne opponent even if he is in float stance.

    I'll make this correction. Vega's ultra has a JP of 0, as a lk ST > ultra (which apparently should connect from the looks of it) doesn't connect.

    -- In regards to a PM sent to me. Someone showed me that Ken's light kick tatsumaki is actually quite broken. It's the only move in the game who's knockdown actually adds to the JC. Easiest to try on dhalsim but, as he's falling, lk.tatsu him so that the spin kick (not the knee) connects, then try and super / EX SRK, super whiffs and only the last hit of EX SRK connects. However, if you then repeat this situation and only hit them with the knee, the super connects as if you had just hit them with a hadouken out of the air or something similar.

    I wrote my theory of the situation in his section under that move. Juggle thread fully updated with all relevant data.
    I hit confirm with standing fierce punch.
  • DooplissDoopliss Joined: Posts: 3,174


    This video proves some stuff I posted in my PM.
    Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

    "Combo Hunter", A Street Fighter V Season 2 Combo Video
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