The SRK Glossary - WIP

245

Comments

  • Demon JimDemon Jim I'm Cereal Joined: Posts: 4,158 mod
    This is more of a nitpick than anything, but CC (custom combo) originated in Alpha 2, not Alpha 3's V-ISM.

    Also:

    Priority: Determines whether an attack will beat, lose, or trade with another attack upon collision.
    Trade: Both players get hit with each other's attacks upon collision.
    Hitbox: The area/range of an attack or a character's body (which is sometimes called "hurtbox"). Example: (blue encompasses the area where the character can get hit and damaged by an attack. Red is for attacks).
    Air to Air: An aerial move commonly used to beat the opponent's aerial moves.
    Block String: A series of attacks that force the opponent to stay in blocking position. Used mainly for limiting their options, baiting responses, pushing them to the corner, etc.

    I've never heard the term "proration." That's commonly referred to as damage scaling.

    Everything this guy said.

    Chicken Wing - Another name for Fei Long's Dragon Arc Kick
    Unblockable
    Push Block
    Glitch
    Advanced Hyper Viper Beam (AHVB)
    Reset
    Money Match (MM)
    Just Defend
    Ranking Battle (RanBat) - I see the question of what's a ranbat all the time
    Crosshand(ed) - Playing on an arcade stick with your hands in a reversed position. Right hand is controlling the joystick and the left hand is pushing the buttons, this causes your arms to cross. Seth Killian is the only person I can think of that uses this method successfully.



    -DJ-
    Just like that.
    "...but when he gets there, at the end of the day, it's just corn flakes." - Christopher Walken
    Battle at the Border Tournament Director
  • otterotter CFN: otter- Joined: Posts: 4,652
    Great job guys! I have a couple notes if that is okay:

    -The definition of pushblock you have is correct. You wanted that confirmed. You may want to add the it negates chip damage for a short time, and leaves the user vulnerable if used in the air.

    -AVHB actually stands for "Air Hyper Viper Beam". The startup and especially recovery times of the HVB change drastically if its used in the air. It has nothing to do with whether or not you tiger knee the motion, or any other advanced method.

    -SF4 Sagat's overhead is toward+fierce, not toward+jab.
  • HBRDHBRD why Joined: Posts: 2,464
    Great job guys! I have a couple notes if that is okay:

    -The definition of pushblock you have is correct. You wanted that confirmed. You may want to add the it negates chip damage for a short time, and leaves the user vulnerable if used in the air.

    -AVHB actually stands for "Air Hyper Viper Beam". The startup and especially recovery times of the HVB change drastically if its used in the air. It has nothing to do with whether or not you tiger knee the motion, or any other advanced method.

    -SF4 Sagat's overhead is toward+fierce, not toward+jab.

    Thanks!
    Magnetomaniac: TEACH THIS GUY HOW TO PLAY CHUN AND RUFUS RESPECTIVELY
    Tarnish: OS is like the Coke Zero of strategy
    Abominablek: CvS1's menu theme was so gay I expected the Queer Eye guys to bust into my house and give me a makeover
  • Demon JimDemon Jim I'm Cereal Joined: Posts: 4,158 mod
    AVHB actually stands for "Air Hyper Viper Beam". The startup and especially recovery times of the HVB change drastically if its used in the air. It has nothing to do with whether or not you tiger knee the motion, or any other advanced method.

    My bad this would be correct. Air Hyper Viper Beam.

    A few things:

    When a just defend is performed a small amount of life is gained.

    Also for reset, it is more for resetting the damage scale.

    -DJ-
    Just like that.
    "...but when he gets there, at the end of the day, it's just corn flakes." - Christopher Walken
    Battle at the Border Tournament Director
  • booty clapperbooty clapper Grrrrrr Joined: Posts: 1,726
    In the Games section you should also add the following...

    TvC - Tatsunoko vs Capcom
    KOF - King of Fighters, i guess you can add like 98UM and the likes. Up to you.
    MBAA - Melty Blood Actress Again
    SSV - Samurai Shodown V

    Can't really think of any more off the top of my head, if anyone else can think of anymore abbreviations please add them.

    Also this index is coming along really well. Good work.
    #SNKPlaymore & #Alpha2 on efnet
  • Demon JimDemon Jim I'm Cereal Joined: Posts: 4,158 mod
    Games:
    GG /XX/#R/AC - Guilty Gear/XX/#Reload/Accent Core
    BB - Blazblu
    PF - Puzzle Fighter
    SC - Soul Calibur

    More words:
    Piano Tap
    Scraped (it's become a popular phrase now)
    Chain Combo
    Semi-Infinite
    Infinite
    Airthrow
    CPS1/2/3
    Supergun (some people don't know what a supergun is)
    Softban
    Macro

    Tournaments:
    EVO (Evolution)
    SBO (Super Battle Opera/Tougeki)
    FR (Final Round)
    MWC (Midwest Championships)
    SB (Seasons Beatings)

    I can't think of that many more that are as big as those, well that still exist.

    -DJ-
    Just like that.
    "...but when he gets there, at the end of the day, it's just corn flakes." - Christopher Walken
    Battle at the Border Tournament Director
  • Demon JimDemon Jim I'm Cereal Joined: Posts: 4,158 mod
    Roll Cancel (RC)

    How did we all miss this term? I guess you can add the word Roll too since that is also a basic term.

    Also the bold around Trade is messed up its missing the /

    -DJ-
    Just like that.
    "...but when he gets there, at the end of the day, it's just corn flakes." - Christopher Walken
    Battle at the Border Tournament Director
  • otterotter CFN: otter- Joined: Posts: 4,652
    Perhaps when you guys add terms, you could also provide the definition. The OP shouldnt be fully responsible.
  • HBRDHBRD why Joined: Posts: 2,464
    Yeah, especially since I don't really know what some of these things are. I think I got RCing right, maybe not though.
    Magnetomaniac: TEACH THIS GUY HOW TO PLAY CHUN AND RUFUS RESPECTIVELY
    Tarnish: OS is like the Coke Zero of strategy
    Abominablek: CvS1's menu theme was so gay I expected the Queer Eye guys to bust into my house and give me a makeover
  • booty clapperbooty clapper Grrrrrr Joined: Posts: 1,726
    Perhaps when you guys add terms, you could also provide the definition. The OP shouldnt be fully responsible.

    agree x2
    #SNKPlaymore & #Alpha2 on efnet
  • Demon JimDemon Jim I'm Cereal Joined: Posts: 4,158 mod
    Roll Cancel sounds about right. On roll though it exists in lots of games. I think all the vs games, snk, cvs, alpha, and 3S all have roll. Alphas roll command is weird B,DB,D+KK shit I can't remember if its 2 kicks or 1.

    I know what they are hard to explain. Here is a shot at 1 of them (feel free to change to make it sound better)
    Alpha Counter - a counter in the Alpha series and CvS2 (1?) in which a character uses one bar/level of meter in order to counter hit a blocked attack, Performed by hitting f + Same Strength P + K instantly following a blocked attack
    Charge Partition - ?? I have no idea how to word this SOMEBODY WITH KNOWELEDGE OF THIS HELP!!
    Charge Buffering - http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2009/sep/10/charge-buffering-street-fighter-4/


    Taken from an older post of mine.

    Supergun - An adapter used to connect an arcade board to a television set, console controllers can be used with the right setup.
    Softban - Something that is not banned but is extremely frowned upon in tournament play. EX: ST, Akuma is allowed in Japanese tournament play but is extremely frowned upon, USA he is banned.
    CPS1/2/3 - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CP_System, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CP_System_II, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CP_System_III (Capcom System, the different systems used in different arcade boards of Capcom games, only games of that CPS type can be played on that system)

    Everything with the word combo, has really good definitions just copy and paste http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combo_(gaming)

    The link contains:
    Combo
    Simple Combo
    2-1
    Auto Combo
    Chain Combo
    Super Combo
    Custom Combo
    Juggle Combo (same as Juggle)
    Air Combo

    -DJ-
    Just like that.
    "...but when he gets there, at the end of the day, it's just corn flakes." - Christopher Walken
    Battle at the Border Tournament Director
  • ilitiritilitirit Joined: Posts: 6,388
    I've added descriptions for some of the items:

    ~ = The notation for "immediately afterwards". It usually means the moves should be inputted very frames apart, but it varies by move and game. eg. Ken's Kara throw in SFIV is f.mk~lp+lk, pianoing the punches from low to high would be lp~mp~hp

    Absolute/Free guard = A game is said to have absolute guard if hits at your level (ie standing or crouching) are blocked automatically while you're in hitstun. eg. In SFIV, if you block the first hit of Metsu Shoryuken the game will automatically block the rest even if you push forward. Games with free guard require you to manually block regardless of whether you're not in blockstun.

    Hit pause = The slight pause that occurs in some games when moves/projectiles hit the opponent

    Juggle = A combo that connects while the opponent is off the ground.

    Cancel = To cancel the animation and or properties of one move by using a another.

    Chain = A chain is a series of normal moves where the recovery of each move is canceled into the startup of it's successor, thereby creating a combo.

    CPS1 cancels = A type of cancel exclusive to SF2 games which ran on Capcom's CPS1 hardware (WW, CE, HF) that allowed you to cancel chainable kicks into any punch. The trick was to start with a light chainable kick, and then switch stance from high to low (or vice versa, depending on which move you started the combo with) and press the same kick + any punch. eg. c.lk xx s.lk + s.fp. This was a powerful technique because the punch maintained combo potential so it could be cancelled into a special move (In SF2, CPS1 chains ending in a special usually dizzied the opponent)

    Renda cancel aka Renda kara cancel aka Chain Cancel = A technique used primarily in SSF2T to extend a chain combo into special combo (usually Super). In SF2, you could not combo into a special move after a chain combo. You can bypass this limitation though by starting a chain combo with crouching attacks and then kara-cancelling a standing chainable move into a special. eg. To combo into Ken's Super from two shorts: c.lk xx c.lk [df f d df] xx f.lk~p. SFIV's Chun Li's c.lk c.lk into EX legs is also apparently a renda cancel.

    Kumite = An organized battle were 1 player squares off against a number of other opponents (usually 5 or more)

    Gachi aka Taiman Gachi = A long series of matches (usually 10+) between two players

    Feel free to correct any mistakes/oversights


    A note on the vortex:
    I think the key concept which is missing from the description is that each mixup option resets the vortex if it is landed successfully. Without that aspect it wouldn't be a vortex, just a plain mixup.
  • LaughinghyenaLaughinghyena Always Laughing Joined: Posts: 479
    How about boxers turn around punch?

    Well thats the only way that TAP(turn around punch) will work. The move comes out of a negative edge input.
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  • otterotter CFN: otter- Joined: Posts: 4,652
    Here are a few that new players may be looking for:

    Focus Attack - A SF4 exclusive command done by hitting Strong (medium punch) and forward (medium kick) at one time. You may absorb one attack to make its damage temporary, but the Revenge meter gained is permanent. Hold down the buttons to charge up the attack, which will activate via Negative Edge. Maximize it's power at level 3 to make the attack unblockable.

    Focus Cancel - A SF4 exclusive command done by performing a Focus Attack during the animation of another attack. not all moves are eligible for Focus Canceling, and certain normal and special moves are chosen arbitrarily. Requires two ex bars.

    Focus Attack Dash Cancel (FADC) - A SF4 exclusive command done by performing a Focus Cancel and immediately dashing to sometimes gain massive frame advantage and juggling opportunities. Similar to Roman Canceling (Guilty Gear) and Rapid Canceling (BlazBlue) except for the fact that you must dash in either direction before reaching a neutral state.

    Saving Attack - A Japanese name for Focus Attack. Some Western arcade players use this term from when there was no English version in existence.

    If these are too long winded, just do some editing :)
  • Sh0ryu_Repp4Sh0ryu_Repp4 Know Thyself. Joined: Posts: 675
    thnx for this thread, i had alot of basic terms down already but i found alot here i had heard and didn't know or wasn't sure of, thnx for the great work!
    "You Can't Fly Over Snake Way" - King Kai
  • Truest StrikeTruest Strike The Power Cosmic Joined: Posts: 444
    @HBRD

    Is it alright if I use this same information but in another site? I'll post your name and everything for due credit.
  • HBRDHBRD why Joined: Posts: 2,464
    @HBRD

    Is it alright if I use this same information but in another site? I'll post your name and everything for due credit.
    Sure, but remember it's changing pretty much daily.
    Magnetomaniac: TEACH THIS GUY HOW TO PLAY CHUN AND RUFUS RESPECTIVELY
    Tarnish: OS is like the Coke Zero of strategy
    Abominablek: CvS1's menu theme was so gay I expected the Queer Eye guys to bust into my house and give me a makeover
  • Truest StrikeTruest Strike The Power Cosmic Joined: Posts: 444
    Cool, and thanks. I'll keep up with it.
  • prorookprorook Joined: Posts: 475
    I dunno about the reset definition. I always thought that a reset was a pause in a combo that will reset damage scaling. Like a balrog combo in sf4... j.FP,jab,jab,short,ex-dash punch,jab,short,headbutt,ultra = 450ish dmg
    but... j.fp,jab,jab,short,ex-dash punch,jab,short,overhead(reset),short,headbutt,ultra = 700ish dmg
    kaybar akayaye ky-jelly
  • ilitiritilitirit Joined: Posts: 6,388
    I dunno about the reset definition. I always thought that a reset was a pause in a combo that will reset damage scaling
    People refer to different techniques as resets these days.

    You can use a move that knocks them out of a juggle state so that they land on their feet for the purposes of performing a mixup when they recover. This is usuallly known as resetting the opponent. The entire string of moves and a followup is sometimes called a reset mixup (see Sabre vs Valle @ Evo 2K9)

    Another type of reset is using a technique that breaks the combo, but causes them to get by your next move (because they blocked wrong way) so that the damage scaling resets while leaving you in a position to start a new combo (this is what you're referring to)

    Stopping a combo midway and throwing the opponent for unscaled damage is also sometimes called a reset.
  • nochilinopitynochilinopity Joined: Posts: 62
    What we need is lingo definitions

    Pringles - crap defense
    Getting peed on/R.Kelly'd - getting perfected
    Churning butter - spinning the joystick in circles (for SPDs)
    Buttery - Ex moves
    Free - Easy win
    Salty/Morton's - Feeling crappy after a loss
    You no scare I no scare - Willingness to throw out random uppercuts to show your opponent they can come at any time (via Chris Hu)
    So less - Something not worth the time/money (via Chris Hu)

    etc. etc. etc.
  • IjiwaruIjiwaru SLUT CRUSHER Joined: Posts: 185
    Akuma needs to be in the dive kick list!

    ... I'm just a fanboy like that lol
  • HBRDHBRD why Joined: Posts: 2,464
    Akuma needs to be in the dive kick list!

    ... I'm just a fanboy like that lol
    His dive kick isn't a dive kick like Rufus, Yun, MB F-Nanaya, etc.
    Magnetomaniac: TEACH THIS GUY HOW TO PLAY CHUN AND RUFUS RESPECTIVELY
    Tarnish: OS is like the Coke Zero of strategy
    Abominablek: CvS1's menu theme was so gay I expected the Queer Eye guys to bust into my house and give me a makeover
  • IjiwaruIjiwaru SLUT CRUSHER Joined: Posts: 185
    The term dive kick is used to describe his own down + MK aerial move... in fact, Akuma's came in first, so you have to say Rufus, and Yun's dive kick's are following Akuma's trend.

    In the definition, it doesn't necessarily have to be used to deal pressure, it's more of a "Special aerial attack that propels your character to the ground." or something like that
  • deadfrogdeadfrog Joined: Joined: Posts: 6,787
    I think that, as soon as you start talking about definitions to help establish some community guidelines, and especially when you delve into short-hand notation, it's critical to address the problem of potential sources of confusion in terms of vagueness and ambiguity and unclarity. Everyone has their own little personal quirks when writing short-hand, but there are a few things I feel are worth bringing up. This post is just a scrappy list of things I've noticed.




    - When referring to hp and hk, I believe the names "hard punch" and "hard kick" are used more than "heavy punch" and "heavy kick." Of course this is a really trivial issue anyway; I've definitely heard all sorts of people call them either one, and they're not even the official names either. It's just good to be aware that both names exist commonly.


    - Usually button abbreviations are written in lower case letters (hk is for roundhouse, the heavy kick), in order to save capital letters for special move names (HK is for hurrcane kick). This is handy for when people want to write things like "mp DP" for a strong (medium) dragon punch. This also helps people more easily differentiate between say... doing an old-school tiger knee joystick motion (tk) and performing an actual tiger knee with Sagat (TK).


    - I think that an emphasis be made on the importance of using the full cr._ and cl._ abbreviations instead of using "c."
    For reference, if anyone is new to these...
    st.hp = standing fierce (hard punch)
    cl.hp = close fierce (hard punch)
    cr.hp = crouching fierce (hard punch)
    Of course any other button (lp mp lk mk hk) can be substituted in: st.lk is a standing short (light kick) and cr.hk is a crouching roundhouse (hard kick).


    - I've seen some people write "fp" for "fierce punch" which is not too bad but should probably be avoided. I have, however, seen some people write fk for "fierce kick." Without enough context it can sometimes be vague as to whether they mean that button or something else like "flash kick" or "fierce [tiger] knee" or what.


    - The word "forward," can mean forward kick (medium kick) or the towards-your-opponent direction on the joystick. Usually I just hear people say "medium kick" or "towards" to avoid that ambiguity.
  • deadfrogdeadfrog Joined: Joined: Posts: 6,787
    The word "reset" can be used for all sorts of things.

    1. Usually, it means when an attacker deliberately halts a combo early (ie. does not complete all of the possible hits, thus sacrificing additional guaranteed damage) in order to set up the opponent for follow-up attack that is very tricky to block, granting himself a golden opportunity to start a new combo (a chance to start dealing big damage again, which can be especially important in a game where longer combos have their damage severely scaled down).

    Note that it's really futile to try and define THE RESET as one particular thing, even if the "air flip out" type of thing is prevalent in many of the still-popular Capcom fighting games. The nature of resets, and in particular why it is so hard for the opponent to avoid the intended follow-up attack, can be completely different from game to game and from character to character and even from type to type. The goal is generally either to take your opponent completely off-guard with a very unorthodox situation, or to force them into a mix-up that is extremely difficult to read, with some of the more common methods being: switching sides with an opponent very quickly (MVC2 Magneto airdash madness), making them have to guess with very vague positioning whether you are switching sides or not (SF4 Sakura EX tatsu launches), or suddenly doing something unblockable in their face when they'll probably want to block (3S Akuma kara demon setups).

    (Even things as simple as Ryu doing a jump attack then his overhead punch, or Blanka doing anything xx towards hop, or anyone doing a cr.lk into a throw, could technically be considered very primitive resets, but we usually already have better terms for those kinds of basic things anyway.)

    I know that narrow definitions are easier to explain, but the sheer variety of things that we consider to be resets necessitates a wide definition.



    2. Sometimes when we use the word "reset" we mean that the video game console was literally reset. This could be a spectator accident or a technical failure, but on some systems and titles (anything on the Dreamcast, or SFAC on the PS2 for example) you can hold down the right buttons on your controller to restart the game. In competitive play, depending on the rules of an event and/or the graciousness of your opponent, this could cost you the round or the game or even the whole match. Resetting the console during a match on purpose is considered very poor sportsmanship; it's basically the in-person/offline/real-life equivalent of ragequitting.



    3. The most uncommon use of the word "reset" is in the context of tournament bracket stuff. In a double elimination bracket, the format most popular in North American tournaments, nearly all matches are only one set long. However, the grand finals match has the potential of being TWO. In the first set of the grand finals match (the very last two players, to determine 1st and 2nd place), if the winners' bracket player wins, then the losers' bracket player has now lost twice and is eliminated which puts him in 2nd place, ending the match and leaving the winners' bracket player as the 1st place winner of the tournament: he is said to be "undefeated."

    However, if the losers' bracket player wins that first set, (in essence he has now sent the winners' bracket player to the losers' bracket as well), we say that the match has been "RESET." They then must play a second set to determine who is 1st and who is 2nd. If the player originally from losers' bracket also wins the second set, he takes 1st place and the victory is said to be an "upset." If the player originally from winners' bracket does win the second set, he does take 1st place and his victory is said to be... uhmm... something, I can't remember the proper term. "Comeback" maybe.


    Just some tournament format terminology, since this should be touched upon anyway:
    Best X out of 2X-1 rounds is one game.
    Best X out of 2X-1 games is one set.
    Usually one set is one match so people often say that best X out of 2X-1 games is one match.
    In our tournaments, the only exception to "one set is one match" is that above exception, where the grand finals match can be either one or two sets, depending on who wins the first set.

    I've actually been slowly but surely building a massive guide to tournament formats and whenever I finally finish I'll make a new thread for it. It is staggeringly complete in its detail and will probably be one of those long and intimidating things that contains everything but nobody will actually want to read, hahaha.
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 36,731 mod
    Shortcut/input leniency should be defined. I've met too many people who think that this means that the game actually has a set of motion inputs that will trigger a move (outside of the moves classic input) and not a result of the leniency given to some of a moves inputs.
  • deadfrogdeadfrog Joined: Joined: Posts: 6,787
    Just wanted to mention that fighting game communities centered around other games may employ similar terms to ours but they may mean different things.

    EXAMPLE 1:
    To a 3D player (Tekken, VF, Soul) a low attack is one that must be crouch blocked and a high attack is one that can either be blocked standing or ducked under with a crouch (passes harmlessly overtop). In general, this is the same for 2D fighting game players. However, when 2D players say "mid attack," we mean an attack that can be blocked high or low, but cannot be ducked under. When 3D players say "mid attack," they mean an attack that must be blocked high and will hit a crouching opponent even if they are in crouch block. The term that 2D players say for this same thing is "overhead attack." As far as I'm aware, 3D players don't have a specific term for a 2D "mid" that I'm aware of... I think they usually say someting like high-low but I'm not completely sure.

    EXAMPLE 2:
    Uuuusually, when a 2D player says "tech," he means softening or breaking a throw (depending on the game). When a 3D player says "tech," he means tech rolling which is a defensive maneuver while getting up. What's even more confusing is that the Japanese word "ukemi" for Tekken players also means tech rolling, but for Virtua Fighter it means breaking throw attempts!




    Of course, every game will have its own unique style of short-hand notation, but certain symbols and syntaxes are sometimes re-defined or re-used. This can confuse people who are branching out and exploring other games. For example, the "~" symbol means different things depending on who you ask. I don't remember any of those things though, haha.




    New term: "abare"
    I'm just going to directly quote an excerpt from an awesome post that Koogy made to help SF players get into BlazBlue.
    abare: "converting random hits into big damage"

    Guilty Gear also focuses on Abare, which is the concept of, say... Ryu hitting someone with a max range crouching forward. In most SF games, the most you'll get is a fireball / super. However, imagine you could cancel it the fireball (again) and go into a huge air combo. Converting that tiny hit into a much bigger combo is a huge deal. However, Guilty Gear lets you do many different ways. Sometimes though a perfect anti-air, you get a 15% combo. A perfect risky attack may lead to a counterhit, giving the attack ground bounce abilities, wall bounce abilities, wall stick, etc. Playing strong footsies with characters can lead to counterhits that lead to 50% damage.
    This actually isn't completely new to Capcom fighting games; I believe that Marvel players have long been using the word "conversion" for this same thing.
  • 4r54r5 FIGHTAN VIDYA GAEMS Joined: Posts: 2,579
    Namco uses the term special-mid for moves that are blockable standing and crouching.

    I'm not sure if Virtua Fighter even distinguishes such moves. If I remember correctly, I was in training mode with a friend and we found a mid hitting move that could be blocked crouching or standing. And the training mode hit indicator still labeled it as a mid like any other.
    Location: Maryland
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  • deadfrogdeadfrog Joined: Joined: Posts: 6,787
    ^ they should call them "fuzzies" :lol:
  • M1tchapaloozaM1tchapalooza Given Them that Mac N Cheese Joined: Posts: 342
    what is a round robin?
    SG: Painwheel/Cerebella/Double
    SSF4AE: Balrog/Cody
    UMVC3: Zero/Vergil/Hawkeye
  • 4r54r5 FIGHTAN VIDYA GAEMS Joined: Posts: 2,579
    Location: Maryland
    PSN: fourer5 // XBL: fourerfive
    www.youtube.com/user/fourerfive
  • M1tchapaloozaM1tchapalooza Given Them that Mac N Cheese Joined: Posts: 342
    thanks^
    SG: Painwheel/Cerebella/Double
    SSF4AE: Balrog/Cody
    UMVC3: Zero/Vergil/Hawkeye
  • zafo999zafo999 BIDEO JAMES Joined: Posts: 166
    I may be nitpicking a bit here, but I'm not sure if it's quite right to refer to footsies as a "playstyle" so much as a basic element of fighting game strategy. I might suggest Maj's definition of footsies instead:

    "A subset of zoning focusing primarily on close range normals, where the most common goals are to knock the opponent down and set up crossup opportunities."
  • BurnYourEgoBurnYourEgo Ishikawa don't care about your weeabullshit avatar. Joined: Posts: 1,997
    I may be nitpicking a bit here, but I'm not sure if it's quite right to refer to footsies as a "playstyle" so much as a basic element of fighting game strategy. I might suggest Maj's definition of footsies instead:

    "A subset of zoning focusing primarily on close range normals, where the most common goals are to knock the opponent down and set up crossup opportunities."

    While I agree with the first portion of your comment completely, in the sense that somebody can be heavy on footsies in their gameplay style it's not a playstyle unto itself, I don't think maj's definition covers the whole essence of footsies. A large part of the footsies is the poke/counter poke element to set up basic combos. A simple example being a shoto using their cr. mk to hit the recovery of another shoto's cr. medium kick and and then cancel to fireball. Hence the "footsie" moniker; sticking a foot out in an effort to touch the other person's foot. The goal here is not to always, or even primarily, knock down and set up cross-ups but rather for certain characters (Ryu or Dhalsim vs Honda) to control space through simple counter poke based combos into moves with solid push back. I would certainly agree with a hybrid definition of Maj's and the current one in the thread.
    Steam: BurnYourEgo: Terribly playing KOFXIII and Xrd, want to learn Skullgirls
    Fightcade:Bathtub_Leviathan: ST, maybe 3s
  • deadfrogdeadfrog Joined: Joined: Posts: 6,787
    I may be nitpicking a bit here, but I'm not sure if it's quite right to refer to footsies as a "playstyle" so much as a basic element of fighting game strategy.
    Yes yes yes yes, good call.

    It is absolutely not a playstyle in of itself; I think this is the most common misconception that new players have about it. Footsies are an essential component of most match-ups in most 2D fighting games. In high level SF, where both players understand disadvantageous situations and how to avoid them, footsies become the necessary transition between virtually all offense and defense. As such, it's not something that you can choose to use or not to use ("I am that kind of player" or "I am not that kind of player"), it's something that you need to do to win and you are doing if you are winning. You just don't get lucky against fundamentally sound players. You can't just "randomly" squirm out of their plan of attack and you can't just "randomly" force your plan of attack onto them; you have to earn it first, and that happens through footsies.


    BurnYourEgo: I'd agree. Sometimes your goal when you play footsies isn't necessarily to set up something greater; sometimes your "goal" is just to out-footsie them. On the topic of greater goals, another example of a very common objective is to corner your opponent. Heck, sometimes all you want to do is distract him enough that he won't anti-air your next jump-in.

    Actually, some very strong footsies players will be looking not only to read your footsies themselves, but also to determine through them what your ultimate intentions are with them, ie. see what you're using your footsies to try and accomplish. By watching your footsies, they are figuring out why youre playing footsies. I would imagine that their figuring this out makes your footsies more predictable/manageable to them, and makes it easier for them to develop and employ a (general) counter-strategy against you that shuts down your entire game plan.
  • zafo999zafo999 BIDEO JAMES Joined: Posts: 166
    Good points all around. I see what you mean about Maj's definition, BurnYourEgo. Insisting upon the "most common goals" seems to be the problem, as that can vary from player to player, matchup to matchup, and even game to game. I'm trying to come up with a better definition, but I'm at work right now and my attention is divided. I'll take a crack at it later.
  • HNIC MikeHNIC Mike Joined: Posts: 10,351
    any place where i can find walk speeds for sf4 characters?

    and are there any specific places i can look for the correct way to tech throws?
  • HBRDHBRD why Joined: Posts: 2,464
    any place where i can find walk speeds for sf4 characters?

    and are there any specific places i can look for the correct way to tech throws?
    Speeds: http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2008/oct/05/stamina-stun-dash-and-jump-rankings-street-fighter-4/

    That has info on dashes and jumps but not walk speeds. I've seen it before, I think it was on Eventhubs somewhere.

    As for throw techs, you just hit LP+LK. Throws have a 3 frame startup iirc. Gouken's back throw has a 5 frame startup and Ken's kara throw is like 8 I think? So if you are mashing out an Option Select tech you might whiff it and get punished by the longer startup on Gouken's or Ken's. An Option Select Throw Tech is done by pressing down+LP+LK while the opponent has you in a block string. If they keep attacking, you do nothing. If they stop, your crouching short will come out. If they try to throw you, you'll tech it. The game selects the best option based on the input, but since the input can be used for multiple things it decides based on the situation.
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  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Thanks so much for this, I posted a freaking redundent thread, this will teach me to actually read the forum before i actually ask something from it...
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