How to fix Mortal Kombat

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Comments

  • BleeperBleeper Joined: Posts: 122
    I heard Boon tried pitching MK vs SF to Capcom, and that's where that Shoto in MK:D came from. And Capcom was like LOL GTFO.

    I have no idea on the details of this, anyone that's more into MK know?

    They were kinda keen on the idea but there were dispute over who would own the iP. Boon's keen on the idea and there were talks but disputes of right and time delays really fucked over the chances. Ono said:

    "I?ve interviewed Mortal Kombat creator Ed Boon a number of times, and one time he mentioned that he?d like to see a Street Fighter vs. Mortal Kombat title. What do you think about some sort of collaboration like that?
    Yoshinori Ono: I think Street Fighter is a different type of game than Mortal Kombat. I think Mortal Kombat vs. Capcom could happen, but Mortal Kombat vs. Street Fighter, um. Question mark."
    http://www.dasgamer.com/das-interview-street-fighter-iv-producer-yoshinori-ono-part-1/2/
  • Hanzo_HasashiHanzo_Hasashi Primal Rage rules Joined: Posts: 1,444 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Question for the hardcore UMK3ers-
    In theory, would you guys be willing to play an independent game that plays like UMK3 in style, but doesn't feature MK characters because of copywrite issues? (maybe it could have "homages" kinda like how Sol=Ragna)

    I do, why not? Its like asking if I play mk why not SF or tekken?
  • EWAShockEWAShock (`~^.UMK3 Sucks.^~`) Joined: Posts: 835
    The most shocking thing I saw in this whole thread so far was

    "people who say umk3 is good obviously never played it online"

    Anyway, first and foremost the most important thing a new MK game needs is better animation flow and collision detection. The new games have been pretty awful when it comes to this and that's not to say collision was perfect in the 2D games. Animation wise the old games got better as they went but still kept the frame hacking as a way to maintain speed. The most common complaint is when things miss at point blank range (due to frame overlap or push box). The problem with animation flow is, at least in MKDA D and A, I always felt extremely restricted by the very mechanics of the games, and that being the animation mostly. That is key one, and two I guess. I would suggest the possibility of filming different actors for every character using motion detection and applying it to 3D models to give the characters a more realistic feel when they move and attack. The reason why different actors for everyone would be good is because it ensures variety and difference in style. They still feel like puppets and I would love to see some classic Richard Divisio histrionics thrown in here and there.

    Things I would bring back from old MK games, I would say most importantly bring it back to the standardized original MK button layout of two punches and two kicks, but expand variety between attacks without having it be a gimmick. Speed of attacks, maybe strength, character size, etc all are factors without needing to do anything else but make it more apparent. There were subtle differences between the characters in the 2D games (ie: best Round House, best Uppercut, best ducking LK), but there were plenty of palette swaps for people to complain about. Special moves alone being the main difference is not enough for most players, regardless of whether that difference is 15 - 18 spots on a tier list between palette swaps. There also needs to be a run button. Run worked essentially perfectly in MK3 but they ruined it in MK4 by allowing you to run in more situations than you could in MK3. The reason why you can't have a Foward Foward dash in MK is because of tapping moves, which also, need to stay.

    Bring back real juggles (not just performing a ground combo while your opponent is in the air). Selective canceling to specials like jabs and jump attacks. Some kind of jab canceling.

    Something I never want to see ever again, is that overhead smash bouncing launcher. I hate that thing. It makes me sick.

    Another thing to point out, is where do you draw the line between a good game being an accident, or a success based on time and collective effort? People say UMK3 was an accident, I have even said it at times, but not entirely in the same light as others. Here is my point: they started with MK, it was terrible, and there were several revisions of the game improving flaws which were based on feedback from players, or perhaps their own discoveries as well. Eventually we had a finished MK. MKII built upon all the errors of the first game, had its own revisions, and then settled into a finished MKII, but still not a complete fighting game. MK3 also continued to build upon the previous two MK games, so at this point, we're definitely beyond the realm of accident. These changes and suggestions were intentional, and might I add the violence was toned down under pressure from the industry but not only was it toned down, it was mocked within the game itself. This lends to the idea that they were no longer focusing on the violence. They added a dedicated button to increase the aggressiveness within the game. That's not an accident. They added chain combos which existed in one form or another in other fighting games, but not in the same gimmicked manner they did in MK3. MK3 itself, had a few revisions, corrected some major flaws, and again, we had a finalized version of MK3 which could never have been the first engine tweak for the game. It took years to get there and 3 complete versions of a game based on the same engine.

    UMK3 added and fixed even more elements of the gameplay but did not change MK3's engine much at all perse. It's far less of a change than MK was to MKII and MKII to MK3. UMK3's own revisions focused on CPU issues and glitches. They had something here that didn't need much changing at all (obviously more is known 15 years later). There's no coincidence or accident that the MK game with the least actual and meaningful revisions was the best. Four years of massive player beta testing. Something like 20 total official revisions between the games. If all that time and effort went by and they didn't come out with a playable, competitive game, they would be the worst dev team on earth. Doesn't anyone else find it interesting that as soon as they moved to a new engine with MK4, everything went to Hell again? They refocused on the gore because they could display it with new graphics, screwed up much of what was good by UMK3 by merely mimicking the previous engine and not including everything that made it good, and then scrapped the concept altogether.

    There's a lot more I could get into, but their best bet is to hire some long time players with the experience and understanding to share their knowledge hands on, otherwise it's never going to happen. I have no faith in any company making MK into something good again on their own.
    www.kombatnetwork.com - 11 years of building the MK tournament scene
    testyourmight.com - the MK community
    www.ultimatemk.com - Your Source for UMK3 Competition
    Top 0.017% in ranked matches for UMK3 on XBLA
  • tatakitataki misplaced Joined: Posts: 7,703
    I do, why not? Its like asking if I play mk why not SF or tekken?

    Because SF and tekken are different in gameplay.
    I just wanted to know if it's purely the UMK3 gameplay you are after, or maybe you must have the whole MK experience attached to it?

    A lot of people on SRK are not narrow minded. We can see that 2d MK has unique gameplay, with UMK3 being its peak, but the ideas could still be executed better, so having a "spiritual sequel" of some sort sounds like a good idea. (And it sounds realistic too, after seeing what is happening now with the doujin game Monster)
    It's kinda like DOA series. The games had some original ideas at their core(for example canceling block stun into reversals), but were executed poorly.
    If Ed Boon is not to be trusted and the next MK will probably be some crappy 3d as well, then it's time for the community to make their own competitive MK, IMO.
    Fighting game tutorials, matches, and funny stuff:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/novriltataki
    Former account:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/playtowin
  • Kalyx triaDKalyx triaD Serious Business Joined: Posts: 3,179
    Nice, EWAShock, have you read my blog on my MK revision ideas? Like to know what you think.
    XBL: Kalyx triaD

    YouTube.com/Kalyx
  • Tim StaticTim Static Kid Thunder!! Joined: Posts: 4,635 mod
    The most shocking thing I saw in this whole thread so far was

    "people who say umk3 is good obviously never played it online"

    Anyway, first and foremost the most important thing a new MK game needs is better animation flow and collision detection. The new games have been pretty awful when it comes to this and that's not to say collision was perfect in the 2D games. Animation wise the old games got better as they went but still kept the frame hacking as a way to maintain speed. The most common complaint is when things miss at point blank range (due to frame overlap or push box). The problem with animation flow is, at least in MKDA D and A, I always felt extremely restricted by the very mechanics of the games, and that being the animation mostly. That is key one, and two I guess. I would suggest the possibility of filming different actors for every character using motion detection and applying it to 3D models to give the characters a more realistic feel when they move and attack. The reason why different actors for everyone would be good is because it ensures variety and difference in style. They still feel like puppets and I would love to see some classic Richard Divisio histrionics thrown in here and there.

    Things I would bring back from old MK games, I would say most importantly bring it back to the standardized original MK button layout of two punches and two kicks, but expand variety between attacks without having it be a gimmick. Speed of attacks, maybe strength, character size, etc all are factors without needing to do anything else but make it more apparent. There were subtle differences between the characters in the 2D games (ie: best Round House, best Uppercut, best ducking LK), but there were plenty of palette swaps for people to complain about. Special moves alone being the main difference is not enough for most players, regardless of whether that difference is 15 - 18 spots on a tier list between palette swaps. There also needs to be a run button. Run worked essentially perfectly in MK3 but they ruined it in MK4 by allowing you to run in more situations than you could in MK3. The reason why you can't have a Foward Foward dash in MK is because of tapping moves, which also, need to stay.

    Bring back real juggles (not just performing a ground combo while your opponent is in the air). Selective canceling to specials like jabs and jump attacks. Some kind of jab canceling.

    Something I never want to see ever again, is that overhead smash bouncing launcher. I hate that thing. It makes me sick.

    Another thing to point out, is where do you draw the line between a good game being an accident, or a success based on time and collective effort? People say UMK3 was an accident, I have even said it at times, but not entirely in the same light as others. Here is my point: they started with MK, it was terrible, and there were several revisions of the game improving flaws which were based on feedback from players, or perhaps their own discoveries as well. Eventually we had a finished MK. MKII built upon all the errors of the first game, had its own revisions, and then settled into a finished MKII, but still not a complete fighting game. MK3 also continued to build upon the previous two MK games, so at this point, we're definitely beyond the realm of accident. These changes and suggestions were intentional, and might I add the violence was toned down under pressure from the industry but not only was it toned down, it was mocked within the game itself. This lends to the idea that they were no longer focusing on the violence. They added a dedicated button to increase the aggressiveness within the game. That's not an accident. They added chain combos which existed in one form or another in other fighting games, but not in the same gimmicked manner they did in MK3. MK3 itself, had a few revisions, corrected some major flaws, and again, we had a finalized version of MK3 which could never have been the first engine tweak for the game. It took years to get there and 3 complete versions of a game based on the same engine.

    UMK3 added and fixed even more elements of the gameplay but did not change MK3's engine much at all perse. It's far less of a change than MK was to MKII and MKII to MK3. UMK3's own revisions focused on CPU issues and glitches. They had something here that didn't need much changing at all (obviously more is known 15 years later). There's no coincidence or accident that the MK game with the least actual and meaningful revisions was the best. Four years of massive player beta testing. Something like 20 total official revisions between the games. If all that time and effort went by and they didn't come out with a playable, competitive game, they would be the worst dev team on earth. Doesn't anyone else find it interesting that as soon as they moved to a new engine with MK4, everything went to Hell again? They refocused on the gore because they could display it with new graphics, screwed up much of what was good by UMK3 by merely mimicking the previous engine and not including everything that made it good, and then scrapped the concept altogether.

    There's a lot more I could get into, but their best bet is to hire some long time players with the experience and understanding to share their knowledge hands on, otherwise it's never going to happen. I have no faith in any company making MK into something good again on their own.

    QFT.

    and so this is visable on the next page.
  • GosBroDansFanGosBroDansFan Joined: Posts: 379
    Because SF and tekken are different in gameplay.
    I just wanted to know if it's purely the UMK3 gameplay you are after, or maybe you must have the whole MK experience attached to it?

    A lot of people on SRK are not narrow minded. We can see that 2d MK has unique gameplay, with UMK3 being its peak, but the ideas could still be executed better, so having a "spiritual sequel" of some sort sounds like a good idea. (And it sounds realistic too, after seeing what is happening now with the doujin game Monster)
    It's kinda like DOA series. The games had some original ideas at their core(for example canceling block stun into reversals), but were executed poorly.
    If Ed Boon is not to be trusted and the next MK will probably be some crappy 3d as well, then it's time for the community to make their own competitive MK, IMO.

    I think a lot of the fans of UMK3 would be into something like this. And I don't think it'd be tremendously hard to reproduce the way UMK3's engine works. I started to do it and had the basics of it done but I haven't worked on it in a while since I don't have the time to render my own graphics and never found any reliable source for MK-styled character art. Usually when I ask around for people that might be interested, I get folks that really want to make a MUGEN-style mess with tons of fatalities and intentionally broken gameplay.

    EDIT: And when I say "MK-styled character art" I mean normal human proportion/range of motion.
  • Tim StaticTim Static Kid Thunder!! Joined: Posts: 4,635 mod
    Because SF and tekken are different in gameplay.
    I just wanted to know if it's purely the UMK3 gameplay you are after, or maybe you must have the whole MK experience attached to it?

    A lot of people on SRK are not narrow minded. We can see that 2d MK has unique gameplay, with UMK3 being its peak, but the ideas could still be executed better, so having a "spiritual sequel" of some sort sounds like a good idea. (And it sounds realistic too, after seeing what is happening now with the doujin game Monster)
    It's kinda like DOA series. The games had some original ideas at their core(for example canceling block stun into reversals), but were executed poorly.
    If Ed Boon is not to be trusted and the next MK will probably be some crappy 3d as well, then it's time for the community to make their own competitive MK, IMO.

    Its strictly the gameplay. UMk3 was the one time it was done right, and then never repeated.

    But no, it wouldnt have to be tied to MK, but it was the gore and shit that drew us in at first. The fact the gameplay was different than most fighters kept us coming. Dont get me wrong, us MK players play other things, but UMK3 is special. The game IS good enough to be played at EVO or other big time tournaments.
  • EWAShockEWAShock (`~^.UMK3 Sucks.^~`) Joined: Posts: 835
    I think a lot of the fans of UMK3 would be into something like this. And I don't think it'd be tremendously hard to reproduce the way UMK3's engine works. I started to do it and had the basics of it done but I haven't worked on it in a while since I don't have the time to render my own graphics and never found any reliable source for MK-styled character art. Usually when I ask around for people that might be interested, I get folks that really want to make a MUGEN-style mess with tons of fatalities and intentionally broken gameplay.

    The key is to make it not feel like any other MK knock off though. That's probably lurking in the backs of everyone's mind when they hear MK type game. They need to be assured the creators know what they are doing, otherwise I think most would be on board.

    and Kalyx triaD I haven't read it yet, I will tonight.
    www.kombatnetwork.com - 11 years of building the MK tournament scene
    testyourmight.com - the MK community
    www.ultimatemk.com - Your Source for UMK3 Competition
    Top 0.017% in ranked matches for UMK3 on XBLA
  • tatakitataki misplaced Joined: Posts: 7,703

    EDIT: And when I say "MK-styled character art" I mean normal human proportion/range of motion.

    But isn't that one of its drawbacks? Everyone having the same normals with (almost?) the same hitboxes?
    On the other hand, you can always give the characters different weapons or something to force diversity while still preserving realistic human proportions.
    Fighting game tutorials, matches, and funny stuff:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/novriltataki
    Former account:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/playtowin
  • time_attacktime_attack Joined: Posts: 163
    outsource to dimps/
  • EWAShockEWAShock (`~^.UMK3 Sucks.^~`) Joined: Posts: 835
    But isn't that one of its drawbacks? Everyone having the same normals with (almost?) the same hitboxes?
    On the other hand, you can always give the characters different weapons or something to force diversity while still preserving realistic human proportions.

    The differences may be small, but they definitely all have different hitboxes, and vulnerabilities due to frame size, except of course for the palette swaps, in which case specials make up the difference. For example, Human Smoke, is insanely better than Classic Sub-zero, and still better than Ermac due to his air throw, even though Ermac has more damaging punishers. The fact that H Smoke has a guaranteed 50%+ off a knee lift is also important, Ermac doesn't, close, but not close enough. I can break 50% with Ermac on about half the cast in that situation, and even still it's a lot of work but even with that, Smoke has the advantage. The differences, in scale, are essentially like it would be person to person in real life, and the people who play MK understand and maybe even enjoy that. I think strength, speed, arsenal, etc, is better variety than just adding weapons. Weapons made their way into MK gradually as well, but MK4 really hurt the gameplay with its style.
    www.kombatnetwork.com - 11 years of building the MK tournament scene
    testyourmight.com - the MK community
    www.ultimatemk.com - Your Source for UMK3 Competition
    Top 0.017% in ranked matches for UMK3 on XBLA
  • Smashbro29Smashbro29 Waiting for the new Framemeister... Joined: Posts: 7,199
    Is it really worth saving?

    Even the good games weren't half as good as SF and the story universe and characters aren't exactly groundbreaking.
  • nk4enk4e Trying to adapt... Joined: Posts: 680
    Is it really worth saving?

    Even the good games weren't half as good as SF and the story universe and characters aren't exactly groundbreaking.

    examples?
    "The ultimate skill is to take up a position where you are formless.... Those who are able to adapt and change in accord with the enemy and achieve victor are called divine...."-Sun Tzu
    Thank Lolerskates for the Avatar!
  • EWAShockEWAShock (`~^.UMK3 Sucks.^~`) Joined: Posts: 835
    I really wish people who aren't going to add to input of value would just stay out of the thread.
    www.kombatnetwork.com - 11 years of building the MK tournament scene
    testyourmight.com - the MK community
    www.ultimatemk.com - Your Source for UMK3 Competition
    Top 0.017% in ranked matches for UMK3 on XBLA
  • Black ShroudBlack Shroud Spirits Society Joined: Posts: 1,167
    Is it really worth saving?

    Even the good games weren't half as good as SF and the story universe and characters aren't exactly groundbreaking.
    Is SF's storyline really worth saving?

    Because even SFA's storyline wasn't half as good as MK's, not to mention SF story universe and characters aren't exactly groundbreaking.
    :D
    [ Samurai Shodown Spirits Society ] at [ http://spirits.kaillera.ru ]
    [ Ten Chi Kai Byaku ] at [ http://spirits.kaillera.ru/tckb/ ]
  • Bob SagatBob Sagat Akuma Thurman Joined: Posts: 1,547
    EDIT: And when I say "MK-styled character art" I mean normal human proportion/range of motion.
    But isn't that one of its drawbacks? Everyone having the same normals with (almost?) the same hitboxes?
    On the other hand, you can always give the characters different weapons or something to force diversity while still preserving realistic human proportions.

    I don't think the proportions are to blame for that, it's more that everybody, well, has the exact same normals. Same sweeps, same punches, etc. You can still change up the normals with realistic proportions.
    That said, of course there's also short and tall, etc people in the world if they wanna diversify the characters. Realistic proportions doesn't have to mean everybody's the same.
    Roald Dhalsim
  • BleeperBleeper Joined: Posts: 122
    There's a lot more I could get into, but their best bet is to hire some long time players with the experience and understanding to share their knowledge hands on, otherwise it's never going to happen. I have no faith in any company making MK into something good again on their own.

    A friend of mien told me that Midway brought a whole host pf players from games like SF and Tekken to beta test a MK game. However, the changes they suggested did not agree to well with Ed Boon so he fired them and made the game he wanted to make. I just hope shit like QTEs never make their way to a fighting game ever again.
  • ShotgunSteveShotgunSteve Goes by Henners Joined: Posts: 575
    A friend of mien told me that Midway brought a whole host pf players from games like SF and Tekken to beta test a MK game. However, the changes they suggested did not agree to well with Ed Boon so he fired them and made the game he wanted to make. I just hope shit like QTEs never make their way to a fighting game ever again.

    QTE is why I never even bothered with MK vs DC
  • AzuroAzuro C L E B O Y Z Joined: Posts: 1,132
    Awesome Idea
    I'd love to see them improve on the MKDC engine, but this would probably be even better.

    I only disagree on going back to the old-school layout. Not for comfort reasons, but because I don't want to see a game where if you wanna play it on stick you HAVE to get a whole new stick meant for its control scheme. That turns off way more people than you may realize.

    I understand it's one of the things that makes MK, and I'd most likely end up getting a stick made for MK9 if it used the old layout. I just wouldn't want that factor to alienate people who would be otherwise interested in picking up the game.
    www.testyourmight.com
  • Tim StaticTim Static Kid Thunder!! Joined: Posts: 4,635 mod
    I'd love to see them improve on the MKDC engine, but this would probably be even better.

    I only disagree on going back to the old-school layout. Not for comfort reasons, but because I don't want to see a game where if you wanna play it on stick you HAVE to get a whole new stick meant for its control scheme. That turns off way more people than you may realize.

    I understand it's one of the things that makes MK, and I'd most likely end up getting a stick made for MK9 if it used the old layout. I just wouldn't want that factor to alienate people who would be otherwise interested in picking up the game.

    But why not?

    SFIV brought arcade sticks back to the forefront, and its not like most of these people buying up those TE's and SE's already had one.

    Make a game worthy of it, and they will make there own and even buy from people who do make them (like AIAB

    But in terms of saving whatever might be left and to bring the "crowds back to MK", the series is defnitely in need of a return to roots. and i dont mean more blood and cool fatalities either.
  • AzuroAzuro C L E B O Y Z Joined: Posts: 1,132
    But why not?
    I'm definitely not a cheap bastard.

    But you'd be surprised how many others are. :rofl:

    That's all.
    www.testyourmight.com
  • Tim StaticTim Static Kid Thunder!! Joined: Posts: 4,635 mod
    I'm definitely not a cheap bastard.

    But you'd be surprised how many others are. :rofl:

    That's all.

    Just who are you anyways? :wink:

    Yea, but those TE's sell like crazy still, so i wouldnt just count that out on price.

    Besides, hard core MK fans have been playing most of those older MK's for free for years! lmao
  • tatakitataki misplaced Joined: Posts: 7,703
    I don't think the proportions are to blame for that, it's more that everybody, well, has the exact same normals. Same sweeps, same punches, etc. You can still change up the normals with realistic proportions.
    That said, of course there's also short and tall, etc people in the world if they wanna diversify the characters. Realistic proportions doesn't have to mean everybody's the same.

    I agree. If you were to make a spiritual sequel, give everyone normals that even look different.

    Is it just me or that are kinda like subzero and scorpion of steroids?
    All I want now is a modern shape shifter like shang tsung in a fighting game.
    Fighting game tutorials, matches, and funny stuff:
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  • Black ShroudBlack Shroud Spirits Society Joined: Posts: 1,167
    All I want now is a modern shape shifter like shang tsung in a fighting game.

    Samurai Shodown has one (because it has everything, lol)
    [ Samurai Shodown Spirits Society ] at [ http://spirits.kaillera.ru ]
    [ Ten Chi Kai Byaku ] at [ http://spirits.kaillera.ru/tckb/ ]
  • Hanzo_HasashiHanzo_Hasashi Primal Rage rules Joined: Posts: 1,444 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Kinda off topic but worth mentioning to give a bit of "credibility" to MK.

    Watch this:



    Its a match from a recent MK Trilogy N64 tournament on Dominican Republic. Probably the VERY BEST MKT n64 players worlwide unless proved wrong. Even with that ass broken MKT engine (wich I love) the game can be mad fun at high level.

    Watch it and behold, pure madness, sick blocking and godlike reflexes. These guys are too good.

    EDIT:

    The next 2 parts:





    I wish I could travel there to play andget my ass whooped =(
  • Kalyx triaDKalyx triaD Serious Business Joined: Posts: 3,179
    That's pretty sick.
    XBL: Kalyx triaD

    YouTube.com/Kalyx
  • ShotgunSteveShotgunSteve Goes by Henners Joined: Posts: 575
    I'd love to see them improve on the MKDC engine, but this would probably be even better.

    I only disagree on going back to the old-school layout. Not for comfort reasons, but because I don't want to see a game where if you wanna play it on stick you HAVE to get a whole new stick meant for its control scheme. That turns off way more people than you may realize.

    I understand it's one of the things that makes MK, and I'd most likely end up getting a stick made for MK9 if it used the old layout. I just wouldn't want that factor to alienate people who would be otherwise interested in picking up the game.

    I UMK3 on the same stick I play SF with. American Layout, Sanwa parts (I have another with HAPP/iL parts). layout is like this

    HP HK R
    LP LK B

    my stick is wired for

    X Y LT
    A B RT

    It feels pretty natural to me as a layout. Sticks wouldn't be a problem if Midway let people customize their controls, for god sakes WHY NOT. Blah.

    Question, i can't find it on the UltimateMK.com, concencus on Trilogy? I have a feeling it's avoided besides to make exploit videos - what about it is not liked?
  • k4polok4polo Your Lethal Assassin Joined: Posts: 4,723
    IDK, I think the old school MK are more competitive than the new schools ones. I think MK2 is the most competitive of the MKs. UMK3 isn't too bad though.
    "Where there is light, there's a shadow"
    SFV: Nash, Cammy, Urien
    Injustice 2: Poison Ivy, Super Girl, Wonder Women
  • ShotgunSteveShotgunSteve Goes by Henners Joined: Posts: 575
    IDK, I think the old school MK are more competitive than the new schools ones. I think MK2 is the most competitive of the MKs. UMK3 isn't too bad though.

    I really enjoy MK2, but it appears the MK community feels Umk3 > MK2 in terms of competition viability.
  • Hanzo_HasashiHanzo_Hasashi Primal Rage rules Joined: Posts: 1,444 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    I love MK II pacing overall. Lots of footsies and spacing. If you get nervous you could get killed in seconds. Jax and Mileena ruin the game to some exent IN MY OPINION. MK I is fun if you ban Sonya completely (yeah that hard is) lol.

    UMK3 and MKT n64 are my personal favs in that order.

    Ninja edit: I have yet to see a true HIGH level match of MKD, MKA, MKDC offline and MKDA. From MK4 I have seen it all. but for those "new" 3d games... Im still waiting...
  • ShotgunSteveShotgunSteve Goes by Henners Joined: Posts: 575
    UMK3 I've been playiong online lately feel free to add me on XBLA anyone. I'd like to learn more!
  • Tim StaticTim Static Kid Thunder!! Joined: Posts: 4,635 mod
    I UMK3 on the same stick I play SF with. American Layout, Sanwa parts (I have another with HAPP/iL parts). layout is like this

    HP HK R
    LP LK B

    my stick is wired for

    X Y LT
    A B RT

    It feels pretty natural to me as a layout. Sticks wouldn't be a problem if Midway let people customize their controls, for god sakes WHY NOT. Blah.

    Question, i can't find it on the UltimateMK.com, concencus on Trilogy? I have a feeling it's avoided besides to make exploit videos - what about it is not liked?

    wink, wink :wgrin:
  • BleeperBleeper Joined: Posts: 122
    Kinda off topic but worth mentioning to give a bit of "credibility" to MK.

    Watch this:



    Its a match from a recent MK Trilogy N64 tournament on Dominican Republic. Probably the VERY BEST MKT n64 players worlwide unless proved wrong. Even with that ass broken MKT engine (wich I love) the game can be mad fun at high level.

    Watch it and behold, pure madness, sick blocking and godlike reflexes. These guys are too good.

    EDIT:

    The next 2 parts:





    I wish I could travel there to play andget my ass whooped =(

    it actually looks like a serious game. Colour me surprised.
  • tatakitataki misplaced Joined: Posts: 7,703

    Oh wow I totally forgot about MK's funny layout.
    Fighting game tutorials, matches, and funny stuff:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/novriltataki
    Former account:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/playtowin
  • Smashbro29Smashbro29 Waiting for the new Framemeister... Joined: Posts: 7,199
    Is SF's storyline really worth saving?

    Because even SFA's storyline wasn't half as good as MK's, not to mention SF story universe and characters aren't exactly groundbreaking.
    :D

    I suppose you're right, I was outta line, however SF's story is still relevant because the new games are good, MK not so much.
  • ShotgunSteveShotgunSteve Goes by Henners Joined: Posts: 575

    nice. it's all preference though, i didn't play MK in the arcades except the very first time I played it. Playing it on a SF type layout for me is more comfortable.
  • GosBroDansFanGosBroDansFan Joined: Posts: 379
    I don't think the proportions are to blame for that, it's more that everybody, well, has the exact same normals. Same sweeps, same punches, etc. You can still change up the normals with realistic proportions.
    That said, of course there's also short and tall, etc people in the world if they wanna diversify the characters. Realistic proportions doesn't have to mean everybody's the same.

    That would be true if everybody had the exact same normals. Luckily they don't. As was said, pallet swaps share normals and I'd rather not have pallet swaps at all personally, but as you play UMK3 you figure out who has the more and less useful normals. Sonya's D+LK, Kano's sweep, Liu's kick, Shang's Uppercut, etc. Throughout the game there are differences in the moves. Enough differences that it is incorrect to say everybody has the same. They just aren't always apparent if you don't know the game well.

    I think adding more variety to the moves could be interesting, but keeping normal human proportions and allowing there to be subtle differences as opposed to only having blaringly obvious ones makes the game more interesting to me, which is why I'd like to see the engine resurrected in a new game developed by the community to retain everything great and nothing worthless about UMK3.
  • Tim StaticTim Static Kid Thunder!! Joined: Posts: 4,635 mod
    Thank goodness for Shock and Dreemer :wgrin:
  • YieArKungFuYieArKungFu c.FP > you Joined: Posts: 240
    Why is everyone so obsessed with "fixing" Mortal Kombat. Face it, I loved Mortal Kombat up until UMK3 but damn. The series has been around since what 92 and has produced two "good" games, I wouldn't even say great. I mean you take out the violence and the fatalities and the graphics that were cutting edge at the time and Mortal Kombat would be forgotten like every other fighting game that came out in the mid 90's. Meanwhile what the mid 90's were to crappy fighting games, 2008-now are to good fighting games. MK2 and UMK3 are nostalgia that are fun to play every once in a while but in the end the underlying mechanics were never solid. I guess to answer your question the best way to "fix" Mortal Kombat is to make a game that is nothing like Mortal Kombat but at that point why not just make original characters and make something fresh. It'd be like restoring a dilapidated house. For the amount of work you put in you could build a new house that would be way better.
    TonFun is top teir.
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