SVC - When It's So Bad It's Good

[Deleted User][Deleted User] Joined: Posts: 0
Drama can be good but in most cases it isn't, if you don't like the game move on and don't spoil the fun for anyone else. We know it's faults and it's history so this isn't a "bash"thread but rather a thread for people who enjoy the game to share strats and discussion on it. Now that we have that clear let's move on with the thread:

System

A C Light Punch Hard Punch

B D Light Kick Hard Kick

The game is traditional 2D Design, 8-way movment.

ANYWHERE CANCELS

Anywhere cancels can only be used when you are in Maximum mode. They
have two distinct properties. One is that you can cancel almost any
normal attack into a certain special move. The other is that you can
cancel into those moves from certain other special moves.

Let's look at part of Ryo Sakazaki's moveslist:

f + A Hyouchuu Wari
f + B Joudan Uke
df + B Gedan Uke

qcf + P * Ko'ou Ken
qcf + K * Mouko Raijin Setsu
qcb + P * Kohou Shippuu Ken
hcb + K * Hien Shippuu Kyaku
f,b,f + P Zanretsu Ken
f,d,df + P * Kohou

The moves with stars (*) next to them are anywhere cancels. You
can cancel into them from just about any normal attack, even if
the attack hasn't come out yet, has missed entirely, or is not
cancelable. For instance, Ryo's far standing C isn't cancelable,
but you could anywhere cancel it into the Ko'ou Ken.

The only exception to this rule is that a mid-air punch, kick, or
command attack must hit or be blocked before it can be anywhere
canceled out of. You can't miss a jumping attack and then cancel
out of it.

Now look at the bottom of Ryo's moveslist:

anywhere cancel from Hyouchuu Wari, Kohou Shippuu Ken, (A) Kohou,
(C) Kohou (1st)

There's another listing that says "anywhere cancel from." You can
cancel from them into a move marked with a star. For example, you
could cancel from the 2nd hit of the (C) Kohou Shippuu Ken into the
Mouko Raijin Setsu. If a move hits more than once, but no hits
are listed, then you can anywhere cancel from it on any hit.

Note that you can't anywhere cancel a move into itself. Even though
the Kohou is both an anywhere cancel and an "anywhere cancel from"
move, that doesn't mean you can perform it repeatedly. However, a
combo such as (A) Kohou Shippuu Ken, Kohou, Hien Shippuu Kyaku would
be possible. There is one exception, which is Shiki's ability to
anywhere cancel her (C) Tenhourin into the mid-air Tenhourin.

When you perform either type of anywhere cancel, you lose a bit of
power from your Maximum gauge, which is already draining. This causes
Maximum mode to end sooner than it normally would. It also means that
performing a long series of anywhere cancels (such as Kyo doing
Aragami -> Dokugami over and over) will empty the Maximum gauge in a
matter of seconds.

Finally, note that any move with autoguard can be anywhere canceled
out of if you input the command during the autoguard. An example
would be: Kyo's Aragami -> (autoguard triggers) -> 75 Shiki Kai.

The exception is with Ryo's "Uke" moves and Hugo's "Parry" moves.
These can be canceled out of normally if the autoguard is triggered
(they aren't anywhere cancels). Hugo can anywhere cancel from his
parries into his f + A or f + B command attacks, though.

AUTOGUARD

Autoguard is a nifty little feature that has been a staple of KoF games
for some time now. Basically, your character will automatically "block"
an attack even while performing a move of their own. They don't go
into a blocking pose--instead a "block mark" appears on the screen, and
after a very brief pause, the move continues.

Like normal blocking, you still take block damage from using autoguard,
and your Guard Crush gauge will go down. However, you can anywhere
cancel out of your autoguard, which is a pretty useful feature. Unlike
normal blocking, autoguard affects only particular areas of the body.
Just because you can autoguard a standing attack doesn't mean a
crouching attack can be guarded against as well.

Some moves have more autoguard than others. For instance, there is a
brief period of autoguard during Kyo's Aragami, on his arm. However,
during Dan's Kyuukyoku Tenchi Gadou Zuki, his outstretched palm has
autoguard until he strikes, which takes a while.

BLOCKING

To block an attack, hold back or down-back when your opponent attacks
you. Holding back blocks "high" attacks, such as most standing moves,
crouching punches, jumping attacks, and overheads. Holding down-back
blocks "low" attacks, such as crouching kicks, slides, and sweeps.

When you block an attack, your character goes into "block stun," which
prevents them from reacting for a brief moment. However, a benefit of
this is that throws and some unblockable moves (i.e. Otoko Michi,
Midnight Bliss) will not connect while you are in block stun. The only
two exceptions are Serious Mr. Karate's Chou Ryuuko Ranbu and Shin
Gouki's Shungoku Satsu (yes, normal Gouki's will miss while this one
does not, for some reason).

Blocking too much contributes to loss of guard power and eventual
"Guard Crush," which is explained in a seperate section.

CANCELING

You can cancel into special move throws in SvC, even for the Capcom
characters. I've made a short list of throws that actually combo when
canceled into, as opposed to those that don't.

Crazy Iori Kuzukaze
Chun-Li (Tenshin Enbu will miss.)
Genjuro Gekka Zan
Geese Rashoumon
Hugo Ultra Throw, Moonsault Press, Gigas Breaker
(Meat Squasher will miss.)
Iori (Kuzukaze will miss.)
Kasumi Tatsumaki Souda
Mars People Roswell Vanish
Tabasa As Sent Proof, Meteor Fall
Shiki Mumyou

See each character's listing for a chart of which attacks are
cancelable.

CHARGE MOVES

There have been a number of complaints about inputting charge commands
in this game. The argument goes that you have to input the command
exactly or the move won't come out. This creates a problem if you're
charging db and want to use a "charge d,u" or "charge b,f" move.

A contributor suggests inputting the original command even if you've
already charged up. So, for Terry's Rising Tackle, you'd perform it
as (charge db,d,u + P) instead of (charge db,u + P). By incorporating
the original command (which is charge d,u + P), the move may come out
more often.

"me ^_^" had some interesting observations that I figured I'd quote:

"Also, as a side note, some people are saying that the Guile charge
motion may be corrected on some versions of the board. At the arcade
I play at, it seems to work from a db charge, but it does seem to
need a straight up to execute. I don't know for sure since the
joysticks are at an angle, and I still have a hell of a time to get
the move off consistently on that machine. The version of the board
my arcade uses also seems to have the changed damage of Ryu's Shin
Shouryuu Ken. On some machines, people are saying that the move
only does a third of one bar of damage. On the machine at my arcade,
it seems to do about the same damage as everyone else's Exceed --
about one full bar. I'm not sure about the accuracy of this
paragraph. It's just me comparing notes to things I've read."

COUNTER HITS

Counter hits occur when you strike your opponent as they're making an
attack (namely a command attack, special move, super move or Exceed).
You'll get a "Counter" message, and your attack will do more damage.
Some moves hit twice on a counter hit, like Choi's (B) Hien Zan.

Also, if a move counter hits an opponent who could not normally be
juggled, they can now be juggled. For example, Mars People's Slide
Head move is a knockdown attack. If you anywhere cancel into the
Area 801, it will miss. If the Slide Head counter hits, though, the
Area 801 will combo.

DASH CANCELING

The "f,f" frontstep (aka dash) can be canceled into a jump, throw,
command attack, special move, super move, or Exceed. You can even put
a dash into a move command and it will still come out. This applies
to both the normal f,f dash and the guard cancel f,f dash. Some
examples of how this works include:

f,f + B Inazuma Kakato Wari
hcf,f + B Kama Barai Geri
f,hcb + K Ultra Throw
f,f,b,f + P Zanretsu Ken
A,A,f,f,B,C Shungoku Satsu
f,f,hcf + P Haou Shikou Ken
f,f,d,df + K Power Dunk
qcf,f,qcf + P Shinkuu Hadou Ken
qcb,f,f + BC Rising Beat
qcb,hcf,f + BD Chou Hissatsu Shinobi Bachi
hcf,f,hcf + P Not Independence
hcb,f,hcb + P Yamidoukoku
Charge b,f,f,b,f + K Scarlet Mirage
qcf,f,df,d,db,b + AC Shingan Kazura Otoshi

Note that you can't combine a dash with a (charge b,f) move, so doing
something like (charge b,f,f + P) for Guile's Sonic Boom would be
impossible. Of course, there always has to be an exception, and in
this case, M. Bison can add a dash to either his Dash Straight or
Dash Upper by inputting (charge b,f,f + P / K).

Although the backstep is not cancelable, it, too, can be added to the
middle of a command, such as performing (hcb,b,hcb + P) for Gouki's
Messatsu Gou Hadou. This isn't really that effective, though, as
some character's backsteps last too long to incorporate a move
command.

EXCEEDS

Exceeds are like super moves, but they do NOT cost any levels to use,
nor do you have to be in Maximum Mode to use them. The only requirement
is that your name must be flashing. This occurs, when you lose your
first life bar (the yellow one), and only the red one is left.

The major catch with Exceeds is that you can only perform them once per
battle. That means that if you use an Exceed in Round 1, you cannot use
it in any other round.

GROOVE POWER GAUGE

The Groove Power Gauge starts off at Level 1 at the beginning of each
battle. It fills up as the following things occur:

- You take damage (from anything but normal throws).
- You perform a special move.
- You make an attack that hits (excluding supers or Exceeds).
- You make an attack that's blocked (excluding supers or Exceeds).
- Your opponent taunts you (this gives you 0.25 of a level).

You do not earn power for connecting with normal throws, supers, or
Exceeds. You do not earn power for using a throw escape, either.

The Groove Power Gauge will drain when the following things occur:

- You use an AB or CD throw that misses (costs 0.25 levels)
- You use the f,f Guard Cancel Frontstep (costs 0.20 levels)
- You use the BC Guard Cancel Frontstep (costs 0.60 levels)
- You use the CD Guard Cancel Attack (costs 1.00 levels)
- You use a Super move (costs 1.00 levels)

The amount listed for each move is approximate, not exact. Since
you can make missed throw attempts even without gauge energy, a
missed throw attempt in fact drains anything up to 0.25 total.

Once your Power Gauge reaches Level 3, it will automatically read
MAXIMUM, and you will be put into Maximum mode. See the section on
Maximum mode for more information.

It should be mentioned that although it's called the "Groove Power
Gauge," there are no "Grooves" in this game (as there are in CvS2).

GUARD CANCEL ATTACK

To perform the Guard Cancel Attack, press CD while you are blocking
against your opponent's attack. It costs 1.00 levels to do this.
When performed, your character does a preset attack that knocks an
opponent across the screen and onto their back. It does no damage,
but it will add 50% to your Guard Crush gauge. You can anywhere
cancel out of a Guard Cancel Attack if it hits or is blocked.

GUARD CANCEL FRONTSTEP

There are two ways to perform the Guard Cancel Frontstep. You can
either tap f,f while blocking, or else press BC while blocking.
Although it costs more power to use the BC version, this has the
obvious benefits of being easier to perform and leaving the joystick
free for you to input a command (such as a charge move, although
you can still perform b,f,b,f charge moves from the f,f GCFS--see
the section on dash canceling, above).

Although you are invincible during the beginning of the GCFS, you
lose that invincibility as he GCFS ends, or the moment you input
any command that would cancel the GCFS. After all, it is just
like a normal dash, so you can cancel it into other commands (like
a high jump or a special move).

GUARD CRUSH GAUGE

This is a small green bar located beneath your Life Gauge. It will
drain as you block attacks. When it is completely empty, the message
"Guard Crash!" will appear onscreen, and your character will reel back
for a moment, giving your opponent a chance to get a free hit. After
getting GC'd, though, your GC Gauge will go back to 100%, so you don't
have to worry about getting GC'd repeatedly.

The GC Gauge will refill over time if you do not block attacks. You
can also use the Guard Cancel Attack to add 50% to the gauge.

MAXIMUM MODE

When your Power Gauge reaches Level 3, you will go into Maximum Mode.
When this happens, the gauge reads "MAXIMUM" and flashes red and white.
It also begins to slowly drain.

The Maximum Gauge actually works a lot like your normal Power Gauge.
If you perform any move that drains gauge power (like a Super move,
or a Guard Cancel Attack, or a missed throw attempt), the gauge will
drain, However, it's actually more expensive to use "gauge power"
moves in Maximum mode than it does normally. For instance:

- An almost full Power Gauge nets you two Super moves with almost
a whole level of energy left.
- If you do two Super moves immediately after your Maximum Gauge
starts, you'll be left with about half a level of energy.

The same applies to other moves, like the GCFS and missed throw
attempts. They're slightly more expensive to use in Maximum Mode.

However, there are two really nice benefits to the Maximum Gauge.
One is that you can use a move that costs gauge power even if you
don't have enough power left! So in our above example, you could
still perform a third Super move even with just the tiny bit of
remaining power. Obviously the Maximum Gauge will revert to normal
afterwards.

Which brings us to the next point. Once the gauge is empty, it fills
back up to Level 2, and then you have to earn gauge power normally.
If you refill it to Level 3, you'll go back into Maximum Mode.

There are two other features of Maximum Mode; you can use anywhere
cancels and super cancels during this time. These are explained in
seperate sections.

SUPER CANCELS

A super cancel is when you cancel a certain move into a Super move
or Exceed. You can only do this while in Maximum mode, and only certain
moves can be used as super cancels. Note that while you still lose
power if you super cancel into a Super move, the cancel itself doesn't
cost any power to use (unlike an anywhere cancel).

For example, here's part of Ryo's moveslist again:

super cancel Kohou Shippuu Ken, (A) Kohou, (C) Kohou (1st)

Any of these moves can be supercanceled into his supers, which are
the Haou Shoukou Ken, Ryuuko Ranbu, and his Exceed, the Tenchi Haou
Ken.

SUPER MOVES

[ SUPER MOVE STRENGTH ]

Super moves are only usable when you have at least one level of power,
or when you are in Maximum Mode. What some players may find odd is
that some super moves do more hits and damage depending on the buttons
used, while others don't. This is probably most unfamiliar to Capcom
fans who are used to the "one level equals a certain strength" formula
used in many of the SF games.

So why use a weaker version of a move as long as it costs the same
amount as the stronger version? Beats me.

[ BUTTON PRESS MOVES ]

In previous games, you could cancel "button press" moves (like Gouki's
Shungoku Satsu or Demitri's Midnight Pleasure) from any attack, even
uncancelable ones. Now it seems as if they will only cancel out of
certain attacks, such as:

Dan standing A, stand near C, stand far C, crouching C
Demitri near B
(Shin) Gouki standing B
Zero standing B

The most obvious example of how this affects the game is with Demitri,
since his far standing B occurs naturally if you perform his button
press super from afar, preventing the move from coming out unless you
delay the last D press or press it again.

An alternative method to get around this is to get into another state,
such as during a jump, backstep, or attack. Then, begin the presses
so that they coincide with the return to your neutral state.

SVC Threads

http://www.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=75568&daysprune=-1

http://www.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=170765&daysprune=-1

Vids

image

image

image

High level footage or deep discussion on the game is hard to come by, plz contribute and get in as much info as possible. Alright guys that should do to get things started, keep it civil and let's have a good time.

P.S.

Credit to Kao Megura and his awesome info.
"What one person sees as degrading and disgusting and bad for women might make some women feel empowered and beautiful and strong."
- Sasha Grey
«1345

Comments

  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    No, no, no....no. EVO, don't do this. At least make this in the KOF section, damn.

    BTW that stuff is copied verbatim from Kao Megura's FAQ so I hope you credited him.

    And don't link that stupid thread; it doesn't help at all.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Joined: Posts: 0
    I know, a bold move but if it gets to messy we can move it...let's just test the waters and see how it takes.
    "What one person sees as degrading and disgusting and bad for women might make some women feel empowered and beautiful and strong."
    - Sasha Grey
  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    At least remove the links to romfinite's dumb thread.

    I'll link some matches.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Joined: Posts: 0
    The sad thing is, as much as rom infinities thread turned out to be BS there was decent info and links in the thread lol. Info on this game is nearly impossible so I had to take the good with the bad....even if the bad overwhealms the good lol.
    "What one person sees as degrading and disgusting and bad for women might make some women feel empowered and beautiful and strong."
    - Sasha Grey
  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    Then just post the good info and links here. Did you ever consider that?

    Seriously this a waste of time; you'll get nowhere making this thread here and you know how I know? Because everytime someone else made a SvC thread in the past it turned to shit and either got closed or mercifully pushed to the archives.

    Put it in the KOF subforum where positive contributions are more likely.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Joined: Posts: 0
    Yeah i suppose you are right, I had some childish idea that it might work out this time but the more I think about it...it will turn ugly lol. I'll get it moved right away, good plan mate.
    "What one person sees as degrading and disgusting and bad for women might make some women feel empowered and beautiful and strong."
    - Sasha Grey
  • SweetJohnnyVSweetJohnnyV Streets ahead! Joined: Posts: 1,981 mod
    Ya know what? Everyone loves to hate on this game, but I thought it was a lot of fun! In fact, to be honest, I think there's WAY more dumb shit in SF4 than there is in this game. Fuck the haters. SvC is a fun game!
  • DropOffDropOff @NharlieCash Joined: Posts: 535
    Come on, a dedicated thread to an old game with no recent tier list? How long have you been on srk?

    Last I remembered though Zero was god tier because of his stupid infinite.
    It's fine
  • Spooty WhiteboySpooty Whiteboy I must break you! Joined: Posts: 2,772
    Come on, a dedicated thread to an old game with no recent tier list? How long have you been on srk?

    Last I remembered though Zero was god tier because of his stupid infinite.

    Zero and Geese both have stupid infinites.

    Stupid game is fun though. I really liked it.
    Live Tag: Spootz
    PSN: SPTwhte

    "There's a complicated answer to that question. You see, I think we could all know Batman in our hearts, if we just intensely and obsessively study all of his comics, tv shows, movies...and..
    No. I don't really know Batman." - Dr. McNinja
  • SweetJohnnyVSweetJohnnyV Streets ahead! Joined: Posts: 1,981 mod
    Last I remembered though Zero was god tier because of his stupid infinite.

    If people treated this game like every other game and banned all the retarded boss unlockable characters, Zero, Geese, etc wouldn't be an issue and wouldn't ruin the game.
  • fiolfiol Joined: Posts: 1,419
    cut

    you may check this link out:

    http://kofunion.net/update/spec/SVC/svc.htm

    System Infos and Chars Infos (with combos)

    Here some Casual Matches from Asia (Japan I think) dated 2003:

    image
    image
    image
    image

    etc....--> http://www.youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    Lowpstore.com (the best place for arcade stick and stuff) Check it out!
  • Stuart HaydenStuart Hayden Outspoken User. Joined: Posts: 11,639
    If you don't play with any of the hidden characters the game is fun as hell. I usually used Iori or Tessa.
    R.I.P Seth Michael Hayden
    R.I.P Troy Lane Rogers

    Fuck Dan Marino
    Fuck $RK

    www.breakdancingrobot.com
  • DropOffDropOff @NharlieCash Joined: Posts: 535
    I remember like 1000 years ago when this game was knew some fool was up in the initial thread claiming he was gonna merk everyone with Dan in this game and "show everyone" I don't think I was a member at the time but shit was pretty funny, does anyone know any actual strats for dan in this game, his moves are animated kinda cool in svc
    It's fine
  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    If people treated this game like every other game and banned all the retarded boss unlockable characters, Zero, Geese, etc wouldn't be an issue and wouldn't ruin the game.

    Don't listen to Spooty Whiteboy. That is all.
    Last I remembered though Zero was god tier because of his stupid infinite.

    You know there's one thing worse than people who flame the game, and that's people who talk about the game and don't know what they're talking about.

    Seriously, if you don't know what you're talking about than just ask questions, or don't say anything at all.

    Moar links:

    * image
    * image
    * image
    * image
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • SweetJohnnyVSweetJohnnyV Streets ahead! Joined: Posts: 1,981 mod
    Don't listen to Spooty Whiteboy. That is all.

    Charles who now?
  • raymkraymk Joined: Posts: 350
    Don't listen to Spooty Whiteboy. That is all.



    You know there's one thing worse than people who flame the game, and that's people who talk about the game and don't know what they're talking about.

    Seriously, if you don't know what you're talking about than just ask questions, or don't say anything at all.

    * image
    i've heard from some people that have played the game and well i have seen some vids of how zero was that way. most of the secret cast was broken which most already know anyway. Even though this game has its issues its still fun and i've enjoy it more than capcom's first attempt at cvs. if snk gives it another shot i'm sure they can get it right:bgrin:
  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    It might help to link those vids or tell us who these "people" are you've spoken to.

    Yeah, I'm asking because I know you can't provide them.

    You're right though a lot of the characters are strong and the game has a lot of issues. Problem is, a lot of people don't REALLY know what those issues are; they just say they do and your post is no exception. I agree a remixed SvC would be a lot better though and I'd say its def better than CvS1.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • raymkraymk Joined: Posts: 350
    [QUOTE=Tech Romancer;8574192]It might help to link those vids or tell us who these "people" are you've spoken to.

    Yeah, I'm asking because I know you can't provide them.

    You're right though a lot of the characters are strong and the game has a lot of issues. Problem is, a lot of people don't REALLY know what those issues are; they just say they do and your post is no exception. I agree a remixed SvC would be a lot better though and I'd say its def better than CvS1.[/QUOTE]

    ha your a slick one aren't you lol. i'm sure i could find them given time but then you'd probably say they aren't credible are something then begins a heated argurement were neither of us gets anywhere, so i'll just save my time and yours.

    Well there wasn't to big of a scene for most to go on so the only thing you could rely on was tier listings. With the tiers that do excist zero is one of the top along with geese and from the time i did play i could tell that geese was a broken pile of crap.
  • Spooty WhiteboySpooty Whiteboy I must break you! Joined: Posts: 2,772
    It might help to link those vids or tell us who these "people" are you've spoken to.

    Yeah, I'm asking because I know you can't provide them.

    You're right though a lot of the characters are strong and the game has a lot of issues. Problem is, a lot of people don't REALLY know what those issues are; they just say they do and your post is no exception. I agree a remixed SvC would be a lot better though and I'd say its def better than CvS1.

    If you ask me. The Guard Cancel Dash is what breaks the game more than anything else. And most of the cast can be very stupid, not just the hidden characters.

    But I was told not to listen to me...
    Live Tag: Spootz
    PSN: SPTwhte

    "There's a complicated answer to that question. You see, I think we could all know Batman in our hearts, if we just intensely and obsessively study all of his comics, tv shows, movies...and..
    No. I don't really know Batman." - Dr. McNinja
  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    Guard Cancel dash is a problem, but at the same time a lot of people overemphasize it. For example a lot of people say it can punish everything and this just isn't true. Like people's LP and LKs, its very difficult (almost impossible) to GC those. Also realize that it takes meter (more or less depending on using 6,6 or the command version) and you can bait them as well. In a new version of SvC, I would make them cost 2 bars; be a non-issue then. Also stuff like the throw range and whiffing throws costing meter is supposed to keep that in check to a degree (doesn't always work).

    Yeah, a lot of characters have good shit.
    snip

    What? I didn't ask for your piss-poor explanation. If you have vids, link them. If you posses credible sources, link them.

    But you don't.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • NAPNAP Joined: Posts: 1,812
    I've been a member at neo-geo.com for a while now and remember the massive hype this game got before it was released and then the massive disappointment after its release, haha.

    That said, this game is still kind of fun. I haven't played anything but the Xbox version though, are there any significant changes between it and the arcade release?

    Its been a while since I played so correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't there an issue with Guile where he couldn't charge down-back? Like if you wanted to throw a Sonic Boom you had to hold back? And the same thing with a Flash Kick?
  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    Other than the fucked up command input (It refused to let me pull of stuff like rekkas and similarly command supers off, as well as GC) its about the same; but I think they changed a few minor properties like some stuff on Earthquake (his fart projectile I think it was). Other than that, not really.

    I use the PS2 import version now and that is arcade perfect.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • Branh0913Branh0913 PSN: branh0913 xbl:Tightest Titan Joined: Posts: 3,570
    Ya know what? Everyone loves to hate on this game, but I thought it was a lot of fun! In fact, to be honest, I think there's WAY more dumb shit in SF4 than there is in this game. Fuck the haters. SvC is a fun game!

    Umm, you can infinite someone just by blocking one of their pokes. I'm not the greatest SFIV player in the world, but I don't think there are thing like that in the game. Attempting to attack ANYONE with meter means losing 50% life or sometimes death in SVC. I wish there were high level vds of Chaos. I still have yet toi see any that even remotely displays the level of retardation that can happen in SVC
    M.O.D.O.K Avengers - Minister Of Defense
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  • Sephiroth73003Sephiroth73003 Joined: Posts: 4,236
    I always thought geese and zero seemed like the best characters. Zero's j. sword attack had some nasty crossup potential and his fireball was almost a command boom. It was fun as long as you didn't take it to seriously as than shit like Zero's bomb and retardedly high damage maximum combo's might get to you. Honestly I played violent ken and zero most of the time and had a blast but zero could be really stupid largely because of that fireball imo but he had other stuff also.
    SF3: Makoto and Ken
  • TizocTizoc Joined: Posts: 11,406
    Ya know what...I'd like to see some Dan matches; are there any online by any chance?
    "You have to be a badass if you ride a giant seahorse." -Grant Morrison on why Aquaman is badass
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  • NocturnalNocturnal SNK Supporter Joined: Posts: 2,977 mod
    Even though most didn't enjoy this game much I actually enjoyed it and had comp for this game around it's release. I was in Hong Kong around the time it hit and everyone was playing it there. Good times. My main was Chun then I would switch Hugo if I got bored of using her. I would use most of the cast from time to time. I never really enjoyed using the hidden characters much maybe besides Mars People. Geese is pretty is pretty simple to use and his combos do crazy damage. So even without his infinite he is still pretty darn good. I actually have some xbox live replays of good people I played online. I'll have to take a look at those again and see if I can record them. Even though this game could use some tweaks here and there it's still fun to play every once in a while. I would have to agree though having soft ban the hidden characters the game becomes playable.
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  • raymkraymk Joined: Posts: 350
    Guard Cancel dash is a problem, but at the same time a lot of people overemphasize it.
    Yeah, a lot of characters have good shit.

    What? I didn't ask for your piss-poor explanation. If you have vids, link them. If you posses credible sources, link them.

    But you don't.
    yeah but i gave it and that's what your going to have to work with, i don't have the time right now as i implied. I' ll get to it sooner or later.
    Anyway the guard cancel is what's breaks the game IMO,and i guess it doesn't help that the game is based off kof 96 either. The GC was an interesting edition to the game and is what made it fun for me. Maybe the next time snk has there chance at the vs series they can use the kof XI format.
    ^i would love to see some high level dan vids also i always thought this was the best dan even if he is bottom of the barrel.
  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    You didn't give me anything to work with; and I'm going to just proceed to dismiss your opinion like I should have from the beginning.

    Fiol and I already linked high level match vids; I guess you guys just posted instead of reading the the thread.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • Branh0913Branh0913 PSN: branh0913 xbl:Tightest Titan Joined: Posts: 3,570
    Any vid where people do not abuse GCFS is not a high level vid. Seriously, that is so abusable, it makes any level of offense totally pointless. You basically have to stick to moves like jabs to properly bait them out. And it's even worse when you get ROB Iori who has a fast dash a really really good jump. I think Goentiz can bait them out, but I've never seen a Goenitz player who plays him lame enough.
    M.O.D.O.K Avengers - Minister Of Defense
    The Turtle Master, but my name ain't Splinter
    Hitting down/back so fast, you think I was using macros
  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    First off there is plenty of GFCS use in those matches which tells me and everyone you didn't watch them or you choose to ignore it. Also, yeah GCFS is totally free and you can use it non-stop. Also its available at any point during blockstun. [/sarcasm]

    ....

    Stop the theory fighter and enjoy the matches. Its very easy to sit on the sidelines and say "oh well, he should have done that". As far I as I know, you nor many people play the game. And now you call yourself criticizing high level matches? You realize how silly that is, right?

    Surely you can do better, right? No of course not. Now as far as know the problems of the game are easy to point out. This thread is mainly for those that want to learn, already play the game and have a positive interest. I know for a fact you hate the game and don't play it. So...why you here? The thread wasn't made to hear your disgust over it.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • PreppyPreppy act like you're used to it Joined: Posts: 13,629 admin
    I played this game "opening weekend" and was horrified at the messed up command input and the drunken hitboxes.

    That being said, I still love this game with all my black little heart. I'm as proud of my top ten finish in the only WC SvC tournament I know of (NCR3) as I am anything I've done in gaming. :love:

    http://zachd.com/mvc2 : My giant archive of fighting game videos, centered around MvC2.
    "If you don't feel like killing yourself every time you lose you will never be good. Apologyman is going to be a monster someday as long as he keeps staying miserable." --Brightside6382

    MvC2 for Xbox One/PS4 pls

  • Branh0913Branh0913 PSN: branh0913 xbl:Tightest Titan Joined: Posts: 3,570
    First off there is plenty of GFCS use in those matches which tells me and everyone you didn't watch them or you choose to ignore it. Also, yeah GCFS is totally free and you can use it non-stop. Also its available at any point during blockstun. [/sarcasm]

    ....

    Stop the theory fighter and enjoy the matches. Its very easy to sit on the sidelines and say "oh well, he should have done that". As far I as I know, you nor many people play the game. And now you call yourself criticizing high level matches? You realize how silly that is, right?

    Surely you can do better, right? No of course not. Now as far as know the problems of the game are easy to point out. This thread is mainly for those that want to learn, already play the game and have a positive interest. I know for a fact you hate the game and don't play it. So...why you here? The thread wasn't made to hear your disgust over it.

    I use to play the game a lot. I'm pretty familiar with high level SVC. And yeah I played it on arcade cabinent, not on emulator or XBL. Once you run up against someone who knows what they are doing, you'll quickly find this game really annoying to play. You were clearly at Final Round. There is this guy who was at Final Round this weekend named Antonio. Wish you could have met him. He has one of the most retarded Geese, Zero, Demtri's that I've ever seen. I wish he could have sat down and played you guys (didn't know you were at Final Round until I saw your vids). Trust me, this guy would piss you off in that game.
    M.O.D.O.K Avengers - Minister Of Defense
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  • DropOffDropOff @NharlieCash Joined: Posts: 535
    Don't listen to Spooty Whiteboy. That is all.You know there's one thing worse than people who flame the game, and that's people who talk about the game and don't know what they're talking about. Seriously, if you don't know what you're talking about than just ask questions, or don't say anything at all.

    You are a fucking clown, did you know that? I've been here a long time and that was the single most bullshit elitist response I've encountered to date. I said that one character had a redonk infinite, which is true, shit is brain dead, but so is stuff in lots of games so I don't see how that takes away from the game anyways. I didn't start trying to talk shit about the game or even speak my own opinion. I stated that I recalled some shit when this game was still newish. Maybe if you weren't a colossal faggorth people there'd be an actual community for this game since your a fucking "knowledgeable player" you should be trying to get people into the game instead of shitting the bed over a non-biased comment. In conclusion you just lost the game.
    It's fine
  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    That's for A LOT of broken games; SvC is no exception. Chun in A2, Good top tier in Marvel, the list goes on in.

    No-one is looking through the game with rose-tinted glasses; anyone can see it has problems; what's your point? Don't play and don't take the thread off track. If you don't want to contribute to helping others that are interested in learning; don't bother. That's like me going up in SFIV subforum, complaining about the game in a thread someone made for those that enjoy it.

    What a waste of time.
    snip

    No the game has a ton of problems, it runs on dated hardware and looks bad compared to what came out around the same time. Really, there's a lot of reasons it failed. No-one is trying to start a community and I'm no elitist. I just want people to come in and talk about the game constructively...we know the game's problems, we know how retarded the characters are.

    BTW the Zero infinite starts by setting up a metool cyber elf; its not "braindead". Also Zero has a few weaknesses and his infinite is nowhere near as good as Geese's, which if I remember requires MAX mode (Although its not hard for him to get to lvl. 3, mind you).
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • Branh0913Branh0913 PSN: branh0913 xbl:Tightest Titan Joined: Posts: 3,570
    Mid level chaos is semi-enjoyable. So I'll give people that. As long as you don't abuse CCFS, I think the game is okay. There are some hit box issues to be noted, and some stupid colission detection for sure. Even withou GCFS, there are still some crazy retardation. For example, the easy mode Chun-Li stuff. How she get an untechable command grab mixup, which could lead into max mode, and lead into exceed. Almost a touch of death. The only thig that saves her is the stupid grab range in this game.

    There is also Guile who probably has the dumbest stuff as well. He can rapid fire sonic booms. I kind of like it, but it's pretty boring.


    Terry has free jump-ins. His j.D does way more damage that it should. And his supers have no recovery.

    Overall, Chaos is a mixed bag. If you're willing to ignore all of it's flaws I guess it's okay. I personally don't like the pacing and feel of the game. But I guess I can see where some would enjoy it.
    M.O.D.O.K Avengers - Minister Of Defense
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  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    Yeah its not perfect or anywhere close to it; but I like the system a lot.

    I'm pretty sure the thing about GCFS was that they wanted to keep the game moving at a fast pace and stop things like corner traps and pressure coming up since they gave the characters all these command normals and attacks....basically the opposite of CvS2 in that's less defensive.

    I hate a lot of things about the game but its fun and I don't take it too seriously; that's all that matters.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • Branh0913Branh0913 PSN: branh0913 xbl:Tightest Titan Joined: Posts: 3,570
    That's for A LOT of broken games; SvC is no exception. Chun in A2, Good top tier in Marvel, the list goes on in.

    No-one is looking through the game with rose-tinted glasses; anyone can see it has problems; what's your point? Don't play and don't take the thread off track. If you don't want to contribute to helping others that are interested in learning; don't bother. That's like me going up in SFIV subforum, complaining about the game in a thread someone made for those that enjoy it.

    What a waste of time.



    No the game has a ton of problems, it runs on dated hardware and looks bad compared to what came out around the same time. Really, there's a lot of reasons it failed. No-one is trying to start a community and I'm no elitist. I just want people to come in and talk about the game constructively...we know the game's problems, we know how retarded the characters are.

    BTW the Zero infinite starts by setting up a metool cyber elf; its not "braindead". Also Zero has a few weaknesses and his infinite is nowhere near as good as Geese's.

    Comparing A2 Chun or God tier in Marvel is not a fair comparison. A2 Chun can be bad, but generally speaking she's more than beatable. There is no one way to beat her, but she can definitely be outplayed. God tier in Marvel changes the game, and make more tactics valid. For example, run away, battery, team chemistry, non-linear rushdown happen when god tier is in the game. There is more strategic depth and far more tactics in high level Marvel due to top tier and their tools.

    SVC "god tier" does not make the game any more playable or create anymore strategy. As for some games where sometime the God tier makes the game more interesting, in Chaos, God tier dulls the game. Basically you can't do anything about God tier in SVC Chaos. They can build meter for free, GGCFS for free, infinite for free. Basically they shut down any real options.

    I mean high tier marvel, you get tri jumps, infinites, guard breaks. All take really good execution, and the broken run away balances the broken rushdown. There is nothing that puts checks and balances on SVCs brokeness.

    SVC is a bad broken. Marvel or A2 is good broken. Even A3 is a good broken, because it makes the game really interesting. SVC broken does not do anything for the game. Which is why many stopped playing it as soon as it came out.
    M.O.D.O.K Avengers - Minister Of Defense
    The Turtle Master, but my name ain't Splinter
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  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    There is no "good" or "Bad" broken in my book. Its bad all around for me.

    What defines it as playable is if the system is engaging or not. You can't simply make a blanket statement which kind of broken is better as that simply comes off as a personal opinion and holds no water. That's fine but you can't say that many people that like the game think Marvel or A2's brokeness and God Tier are preferable.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • Branh0913Branh0913 PSN: branh0913 xbl:Tightest Titan Joined: Posts: 3,570
    There is no "good" or "Bad" broken in my book. Its bad all around for me.

    What defines it as playable is if the system is engaging or not. You can't simply make a blanket statement which kind of broken is better as that simply comes off as a personal opinion and holds no water. That's fine but you can't say that many people that like the game think Marvel or A2's brokeness and God Tier are preferable.

    Of course there is. Think about how you beat a team like MSP in Marvel with low tier. You can abuse all of the broken stuff and glitches and use it AGAINST God tier. For example, God tier could abuse a tron assist like anyone else. But you can beat MSP with trone. You can also eat up command assist with trone as well. Sometimes infinte balance things out. If you play low tier, and you can setup a nice combo, you can damage an incoming character for free. God tier can do this, but you can have your low tier teams abuse it as well.

    There are a lot of things that low tiers can abuse really well in Marvel, creating count strategies for high tier teams. In A2, all isn't lost when Chun-Li is stocked. you can very well counter blowback CC her if she tries to activate, eliminating her most "broken" option. for an option that can be beat with that easily, it doesn't seem as broken. Sure she takes advantage of blowout CCs, but so does anyone who isn't top tier. Plus there are other things like spacing and footsies, which could help you bait CC activations. Chun-Li takes good fundamentals to use properly, not just anyone can play her.

    The problem with Chaos is that no one abuse GCFS quite like Geese, Iori, Zero or a lot of the hidden charaters do. There is no way to use the system against them. I mean we all know Marvel is broken, but the system could be used against the most broken charactes. This create depth. CC is broken, and no CC is quite as crazy as Chun sweep xx CC Xx lighting legs. But CCs can be used against her. In Choas, you can't use CCFS against Geeese. You can't even control the match enough to even get enough meter to make it matter. He has everything. Battery, rushdown, and good use of GGFS. So you have a character with good pressure, good keep away, good battery. He shuts down anything you can do. Zero does to, but I GUESS he's more technical doing it. But it doesn't matter because the fact he can do it is bad enough.


    The brokeness in chaos doesn't make the game any more playable. As a matter of fact, it basically puts only 2 or 3 characters in the game, and they all have to be played in the same lame manner. That's a bad broken.
    M.O.D.O.K Avengers - Minister Of Defense
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  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    Of course there is. Think about how you beat a team like MSP in Marvel with low tier. You can abuse all of the broken stuff and glitches and use it AGAINST God tier. For example, God tier could abuse a tron assist like anyone else. But you can beat MSP with trone. You can also eat up command assist with trone as well. Sometimes infinte balance things out. If you play low tier, and you can setup a nice combo, you can damage an incoming character for free. God tier can do this, but you can have your low tier teams abuse it as well.

    See I don't get that. Tron alone does not beat MSP; although you can say it makes a bad match-up because MSP's purpose is to get in and abuse Psylocke. But you're not looking at the entire match-up. Say whoever's on point (mags/storm) realizes that Tron is making trouble. They can play smart, bait the assist, use Storm hurricane instead, switch tron in, etc. Having Tron can make the match-up difficult but its not exactly counter picking MSP; they still I have lots of options. Also tron isn't invincible, so just as she comes out she can be beaten by another assist.

    What I mean by your example doesn't make sense is that God Tier is God Tier because they do everything Low tier does better. Saying they can use the same tools doesn't make the game "better" broken, its still broken, all the characters have access to the same tools and the tiers don't change. If you're point is the system is more creative and you can do more with it, than yeah that's true. Its the only I reason I play.

    As for you saying Geese/Zero/Orochi/whoever play the same and they're unbeatable, I don't agree. I also don't see how they play the same. Its similar to the 3S discussion in the lounge in that the parry is universal and all characters benefit from it but the top tier benefit the best. This is true in SvC, but at the same time I think its better for the low tier to have it than without.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • Ben ReedBen Reed c. LK is my co-pilot Joined: Posts: 1,010
    This game...it really is kinda hard to hate. It fell just short of being good (if it had been just a little longer in production, REAL production, not development hell), and there's some fun cheesy stuff in there, but I wouldn't play it for anything other than a laugh.

    The aesthetic presentation was gorgeous, the mechanics were just all over the place. Putting aside the whole issue of GCFS, hit detection was all over the place, moves whiffed absolutely inexplicably at weird ranges, and the charge system sucked no less than six flavors of dick. (One of which was mule, for certain.) Playing Vega/Bison was like shotgunning bleach in SvC. Shadaloo deserves better.

    Guile's near-nonexistent charge time on Sonic Boom was pretty hilarious, as was Chun-Li and her, uh, everything.

    I'd be tempted to learn the game if I could ever find a properly wired SvC cabinet. As early as 3-4 years ago every damn hole-in-the-wall Orlando arcade had SvC (one of them even had two), and the only one on which the buttons were ever wired properly was the first one I ever played on God knows how long ago. (RIP Fashion Square Mall arcade, as mall arcades go you did not suck dick.)
    This post is +0 on block.
  • Branh0913Branh0913 PSN: branh0913 xbl:Tightest Titan Joined: Posts: 3,570
    See I don't get that. Tron alone does not beat MSP; although you can say it makes a bad match-up because MSP's purpose is to get in and abuse Psylocke. But you're not looking at the entire match-up. Say whoever's on point (mags/storm) realizes that Tron is making trouble. They can play smart, bait the assist, use Storm hurricane instead, switch tron in, etc. Having Tron can make the match-up difficult but its not exactly counter picking MSP; they still I have lots of options. Also tron isn't invincible, so just as she comes out she can be beaten by another assist.

    What I mean by your example doesn't make sense is that God Tier is God Tier because they do everything Low tier does better. Saying they can use the same tools doesn't make the game "better" broken, its still broken, all the characters have access to the same tools and the tiers don't change. If you're point is the system is more creative and you can do more with it, than yeah that's true. Its the only I reason I play.

    As for you saying Geese/Zero/Orochi/whoever play the same and they're unbeatable, I don't agree. I also don't see how they play the same. Its similar to the 3S discussion in the lounge in that the parry is universal and all characters benefit from it but the top tier benefit the best. This is true in SvC, but at the same time I think its better for the low tier to have it than without.



    They have different movesets but all have the same goal. As a matter of fact, anyone in the game has the same goal. This is what you do. turtle, build meter, turtle, wait for one to attack, GCFS, win. Seriously, if you're doing anything more than that, then you're ding way more than you need to. So if it is someone like Guile vs Geese. Geese can build meter, run away, RTSD, do meterless combos, and with meter, do an infinite. What options does guile has, and how is he even using the system at all. Sure in 3s, low tier can use the system less effectively than top tier. In chaos they can't use the system at all. If you are Geese and you are losing to Hugo, then you are just a stupid player bottomline. There is prettymuch no reason you shold ever lose such a matchup.

    Overall, that's about all SVC turns into. A massive meter building, turtle fest. And the only difference is that top tier does it better than anyone else. And it's not just they do it a little better than everyone else, not even twice as good as anyone else. They do it 100% better than anyone else.

    I mean, I'm not going to hate your for hating this game. I have a friend who loves this game. But you're going to have to deal with the reality that people aren't playing this game because they are not uninformed about it. Back when I joined SRK, there was more than enough discussion about it. It's not that people didn't give this game a chance. On the contrary, people really wanted this game to be good. I wanted this game to be good. It's just not a competitive game, no matter how you cover your ears and pretend that it is. It's not. It's fun (I don't have fun with it), and maybe that's how you should be looking at it. There is no plausible way to justify it's competitiveness without being stupidly biased, or just falling into intellectual dishonesty.
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  • Violent RyoViolent Ryo Mistuurrr KaraTEH! Joined: Posts: 382
    I refuse to play SvC Chaos competively, as there are too many broken characters/tactics.

    Also, some Capcom characters were really well made. I feel SNK did a better job of translating Capcom's characters than Capcom did in CvS with SNK characters.

    But anyway SvC is a lot of fun in casual matches and I feel SNK should release a (re-balanced)remake for XBL, PSN, or WiiWare. (assuming the 'netcode' is playable)

    A good remake would be a popular game on these Live arcade networks.
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  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    snip

    The only thing I disagree with is turtling. No, that is NOT how high level play in SvC works out and that's simply put because you build meter better doing just the opposite. Its just impossible. You also make these blanket statements like every good character has an infinite. This isn't Samurai Spirits III. And this goes for a ton of fighting games; where you build meter and use them to achieve the same goal. Did you forget this was a fighting game? The better characters are better because they take advantage of the system better. This is nothing new; we already know.

    BTW your last paragraph is just redundant. You know why? Because I and many others have said EXACTLY what you just said; the game's flawed. Check. There's problems at the competitive level. check. We play it because we like the system and have fun with it in spite of its flaws. Check. We look at it more as a casual diversion than a serious one. Check. I notice you've done that with just about every post you've replied to me in this thread. You quote me, but you go off on a tangent and argue things that no-one talked about to begin with. No-one is blind to the game's flaws; you're totally missing the point which is simple: Its fun to certain people. You don't get that (or perhaps refuse to) but that's not my problem. You are arguing points to yourself, by yourself.
    snip
    snip

    Pretty much these. This is what I've been saying from the beginning.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • Branh0913Branh0913 PSN: branh0913 xbl:Tightest Titan Joined: Posts: 3,570
    The only thing I disagree with is turtling. No, that is NOT how high level play in SvC works out and that's simply put because you build meter better doing just the opposite. Its just impossible. You also make these blanket statements like every good character has an infinite. This isn't Samurai Spirits III. And this goes for a ton of fighting games; where you build meter and use them to achieve the same goal. Did you forget this was a fighting game? The better characters are better because they take advantage of the system better. This is nothing new; we already know.

    BTW your last paragraph is just redundant. You know why? Because I and many others have said EXACTLY what you just said; the game's flawed. Check. There's problems at the competitive level. check. We play it because we like the system and have fun with it in spite of its flaws. Check. We look at it more as a casual diversion than a serious one. Check. I notice you've done that with just about every post you've replied to me in this thread. You quote me, but you go off on a tangent and argue things that no-one talked about to begin with. No-one is blind to the game's flaws; you're totally missing the point which is simple: Its fun to certain people. You don't get that (or perhaps refuse to) but that's not my problem. You are arguing points to yourself, by yourself.


    If you want to play the game for fun, then I can't argue with your taste. I personally have never found the game particularly fun (CFE is a better crappy fun game). In terms of turtling. Let me give you a scenario. Geese has full max meter. Do you rush him down? I would like to see how that works out. If he blocks you (which is easy), then he gets a free GCFS, and we all know what happens after that. Actually if Geese wanted to, he can rush you down indefinitely. You could GCFS him as a weaker character, but of course he has ways of stopping it. One is to bait it, then do a super. consdering you have like 8 opporunties to do a super on a full max bar, he can kill you totally by baiting GCFS attempts. So you're better at having him eat your guard bar. And if try to GC him to knock him back, you waste guard meter, and he's right back on that ass again.

    Seriously, you have NEVER played against a good Geese, or against one who abuse all of the blatant cheapness. There are SO many things Geese can do to you for free. And yeah, if Geese have full meter, you're better off turtling him. you sure as hell aren't going to rush him down, unless you're ROB Iori or Zero. But overall, the game just comes down to who'll get who in an infinite or some stupidly high damage combo based on a setup from just attacking someone. Yes, this game gives you no incentive to attacks someone. I mean you could, but it's just a stupid idea. You get free combos off of GCFS, and any other setup is completely unsafe. There really no point in doing anything but waiting for your opponent to do something.
    M.O.D.O.K Avengers - Minister Of Defense
    The Turtle Master, but my name ain't Splinter
    Hitting down/back so fast, you think I was using macros
  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    snip

    You're theory fighting again. I've fought PLENTY of good Geeses. Your argument falls apart because of several reasons:

    1) Not every attack is GCFS punishable.
    2) Why must I attack? Why can't I grab?
    3) Turtling is worse than looking for an opening, because when he's in MAX mode he gets a repukken pressure string in the corner. So he starts to lock you down. No, you go on the offensive. You obviously can't start too many fireball wars with him either since double repukken is a two-hit projectile. If he starts making the mistake of using Repukken blockstrings, you can GCFS through those outside of the corner.
    4) Not every character has the same zoning, damage, movement options
    5) GCFS still takes meter, even in max mode

    Its a really dumb character, but you seem to be unaware of some options. I could make the same blanket statement about Goenitz and say every match-up is pointless due to tornados. Nevermind people like Gouki and Shiki have teleport; Guile can fit in Sonic Booms between the gaps while building meter and so on.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • Branh0913Branh0913 PSN: branh0913 xbl:Tightest Titan Joined: Posts: 3,570
    You're theory fighting again. I've fought PLENTY of good Geeses. Your argument falls apart because of several reasons:

    1) Not every attack is GCFS punishable.
    2) Why must I attack? Why can't I grab?
    3) Turtling is worse than looking for an opening, because when he's in MAX mode he gets a repukken pressure string in the corner. So he starts to lock you down. No, you go on the offensive. You obviously can't start too many fireball wars with him either since double repukken is a two-hit projectile. If he starts making the mistake of using Repukken blockstrings, you can GCFS through those outside of the corner.
    4) Not every character has the same zoning, damage, movement options
    5) GCFS still takes meter, even in max mode

    Its a really dumb character, but you seem to be unaware of some options. I could make the same blanket statement about Goenitz and say every match-up is pointless due to tornados. Nevermind people like Gouki and Shiki have teleport; Guile can fit in Sonic Booms between the gaps while building meter and so on.



    LOL, you're talking theory dude. I really wish my old chum Antonio could have met you and broke out his Geese. you aren't doing none of those things to a good Geese man. I'm not theorizing anything. Trust me, back in 2006 when I use to play this game at the arcade. Yes AT the arcade. Not on XBL. Not on GGPO or 2DF. No back when I played it at the ARCADE, this is what has happened to me personally. I've brainstormed numerous ways to beat Geese or Zero (PM Pokchop who used him and got to be really cheap with him). Or ask players like Norm the Storm, who did retarded lockdowns with Mars People, and could slaughter you with ROB Iori. Or my fiend Jarvis who could rape your guard bar with violent Ken. Overall, I've played with people who took this game seriuously. I've seen first hand the retarded stuff in this game. And guess what, I saw it years ago. I mean, you can rant, and intellectualize all you want. But at the end of the day you're only playing catchup.
    M.O.D.O.K Avengers - Minister Of Defense
    The Turtle Master, but my name ain't Splinter
    Hitting down/back so fast, you think I was using macros
  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    Right back at Square one

    I'm done, dude. I mean, its like totally impossible some characters might have a good match-up against God Tier, its just impossible. All characters move the same, act the same, perform the same. Its all Geese.

    Here I thought we were talking about match-ups and how to get around certain strats and we've regressed full circle again. Good stuff.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
  • Branh0913Branh0913 PSN: branh0913 xbl:Tightest Titan Joined: Posts: 3,570
    I'm done, dude. I mean, its like totally impossible some characters might have a good match-up against God Tier, its just impossible. All characters move the same, act the same, perform the same. Its all Geese.

    Here I thought we were talking about match-ups and how to get around certain strats and we've regressed full circle again. Good stuff.



    I know you're TRYING to be sarcastic. But you're statement couldn't be anymore true. I do realize that I do present a negative vibe to this thread. But in reality it sucks that SVC did turn out the way that it did. The game had a lot of potential. And for casual matchs, I guess it's okay every once in awhile. I'm just a very rigid player. And I hate the risk/reward in this game. To me it's really annoying, and it makes it very hard to see this game as anything but a total mess. I understand people enjoy games for different reasons. But I hate that there is very little I can do safely in this game.

    Though I have to say I do somewat like Dhalsim in this game. He's really fun to play with, and his drills are really annoying.
    M.O.D.O.K Avengers - Minister Of Defense
    The Turtle Master, but my name ain't Splinter
    Hitting down/back so fast, you think I was using macros
  • Tech RomancerTech Romancer PSN: Tech_Romancer Joined: Posts: 5,200
    SvC is like Project Justice.

    Its better if its not taken very seriously. I don't play the game too much now as the scene I had back in Germany (Wiesbaden) is gone and I'm kinda weak at it now. Commands don't come out like I want to even in the PS2 version, I can't seem to use my Guard step on point like before unless I use the command version, keep getting cyber elves when I don't want them, etc but its an interesting diversion and good to mess around with.

    If you don't like it that's perfectly fine, but isn't what the thread is supposed to be about.
    youtube.com/user/Ergeniz
    "Problem with Marvel is when you are not mashing you are losing". - 9thPixel
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