Abel ver 2012 will cause Tears

now im not talking about high level, i mean the lower levels (simply because i dont see pro abels using what im about to explain). i already get hatemail when i mix people up with countless TTs. if i see they cant deal with it, i dont need to alter tactics, which makes them even more mad(oh well), which in turn makes it clear to see why TT was considered too strong in SSF4, 'cos the noobs couldnt defend or counter it (im not exactly a good player myself).

now my “save the day” tactic is Abel’s COD: high > low > high which scores me a knockdown. honestly if you play someone that isnt reversal happy, this move always hits. even on good players, just dont repeat it more than twice(because at the end of the day, its nothing but a gimmick). you see, they block high 1st, but the 2nd low gets them. so they block low, and the last hit gets them high. my concern is - at LOWER LEVEL - this really makes landing ultra 1 even easier and more random. you do a COD, if 1st hit connects > FADC > elbow > ultra. if 1st hit is blocked, you go low then > FADC > elbow > ultra. giving us 2 chances to land the ultra, and a somewhat guessing game for the opponent. i know at top level this wont matter, but counting the times i land the low, and knowing others will adopt this additional guessing game for the ultra. its clear to see you will have a lot of people complaining about abel. i dont want this addition to abel, 'cos in the long run, if another patch comes out, im afraid they will nerf him to all hell. he will be near top tier in 2012, and he will also destroy scrubs at low level (breathless is back), which is a recipe for disater when you take the nerf bat into account.

what do you guys think? how do you feel about his new mix-up: 2nd hit COD (low) > FADC > elbow ? also take into account, pro players dont always matter, capcom listen to newer players too. if the immediate response to the thread is negative or cautious, ill delete ASAP cos i dont want to influence capcom in not adding it at all lol

there’s no such thing as 2nd low mixup… that move is ULTRA slow and besides maybe used as a meaty on wake up, it will only work against players who dont know the matchup or in a laggy online environment. only the hit stun of the move’s improved, its still slow and easy to react/counter

people will complain, hell yeah, but about Breathless since that move just got better than the original breathless LOL

hey remember i said lower level, the type that send rage mail. they dont know any match ups:) im worried they will whine about abel

Isn’t lower level that alternate dimension where Zangief is top tier and Fei and Viper are low tier? Yeah don’t worry about them

Why would we need a thread with advice on how to beat people who are already bad…

thats not what this thread is about. there is also no advice in this thread, im just point out the cod low > complaints > easy ultra… meh honestly im not going to explain it again. i did my best to try and be clear, and if you cant comprehend what i was trying to get across, oh well

He won’t be near top tier, and anyone who complains about it probably doesn’t even know Abel’s combos are one-frame links. And guessing from that completely pointless c.hp nerf, Capcom just drew changes out of a hat for AE.

nah mang, invincible breathless??? sooo top tier. Top 8 characters in the game at least.

i played abel twice at the loketest, both for a 6 wins streak (not on stream though) and both i threw the last match because i got bored, technically the 2nd one i lost because im late to go see a friend… but yeah… nothing new, the cr.hp is back to super goodness, tornado throw damage buff is always a good thing oh and ex does same damage as HP TT (according to the notes, ive tested it but im not 100% sure lol)… and the 2nd low fadc cr.hp is kinda weird at first (the timing to fadc it) and if im not mistaken its a 1frame link from the fadc to cr.hp.

anyway, yeah, nothing much to say about abel… and i have a feeling most people dont like to play against him lol

“my concern is - at LOWER LEVEL”**

**…yeah… **
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Abel will be great though, Gief got some buffs and Fei Long didn’t get hit as hard as I’d like but yun and yang are at least less scary, the new height restriction on yun’s divekick is particularly nice.

All of our tools got better (read: put back for the most part) but our bad match-ups (for the most part) got worse, so the uphill battle will always exist, but now we have… idk how to end this analogy… climbing shoes with which to climb the hill easier? :stuck_out_tongue:

Could work rarely if you land a forward kick HP COD combo, then do a low for the reset…rarely. Actually no, probably not, most people would block low in case (if they are already being hit then high is gonna combo anyway).
Most people don’t like playing against Abel, I I hated playing against another Abel back when I used Abel because I knew everything he could do, he’s scary. Things seem a bit easier with Makoto though, Tsurugi helps with that (although falling sky catches it)

lol yeah my point was me being scared they will complain to capcom to nerf abel on certain things. thats not the same thing as me giving advice on how to beat them. pasting that just shows you schemed through instead of reading, but never mind

nekojita also landed this on uryo :slight_smile:

Abel = top 8 for sure

second-low buff is interesting now that I think about it… It won’t make hard match-ups easier, but it’ll allow for more shenanigans we didn’t have before.

Cr.HP back to super level is honestly all we needed… Now we have more damage, more shenanigans, and a anti-Gief Ultra… Top Tier for sure

ppl do hate playing abel. hell I even hate playing abel, although justin wong gave me some really good advice about the matchup that helped a lot. don’t second guess yourself.

you control the entire match, when suddenly you get hit by one EX TT and then you lose your entire lifebar on the ensuing mixups. or you control the entire match, when suddenly you get hit by one f+mk and lose your entire lifebar after the mixups. or you control the match and throw one cheeky fireball and then lose 50% of your lifebar. or you try and jump in and lose 50% of your lifebar. or you think you finally scouted a command grab, only for abel to whiff normal grab as you neutral jump and then EX FS you on the way back down and you lose your entire lifebar to the mixups.

lols he’s just so cheap. once you really start to learn his game and integrate ALL of his options into your play, shit gets real. these days abel can crank out improbable comebacks like nobody’s business.

I think I’m probably the only person on earth that absolutely LOVES Abel mirrors… They are so dynamic IMO

They aren’t like other mixup character mirrors (Viper vs Viper, Fuerte vs Fuerte, Yun vs Yun etc) because your wins are based entirely on the strength of your ground game. You can’t just dash up and do shit vs a competent Abel, you have to work for it. Of course the match-up turns to 10-0 on knockdown, but actually scoring that knockdown is the real challenge.

Actually, scratch that, I love playing against Abel regardless of the character I choose, because I know that he can’t do shit without the knockdown, and my ground game is strong enough to avoid that from most players… aka, Abel will body you if you have no footsies.

Can’t wait for v.2012 :lovin: I actually miss playing Abel so bad… but I can’t do it in this current version. Peace out Makoto, I’m going back to my REAL main.

Daigo said the most important thing to work on with Abel is using f+mk really well… Mago said it was okizeme.

I think Abel’s got a pretty powerful standup game. A buddy of mine was reading the Japanese wiki and said the most common bit of advice for the Abel matchup was “watch out for step kick” but I still wish s.fp had a buff hitbox on it so f+mk, s.fp was 100% reliable regardless of circumstance

and yo man if they are slow on their buttons and spacing you out, dash up EX TT is godlike hahah. the one thing I like about Abel mirrors is that they are faced paced and revolve around my favorite part of the game. no protracted zero damage footsie battles, no fireball obstacle courses, no triangle jump flowcharting. just pure mixup. and step kick. man I love step kick

Yeah, playing against people that KNOW how to stay away from step kick range and then punish it on whiff 98% of the time is hard… That’s why I rarely use step kick against them. I just use that inherent fear and respect that they have for step kick against them. If someone is scared of it, I’ll abuse it and walk their ass to the corner. That’s why I think st.lk is Abel’s best poke by far… It does no damage, but it lets you control the ground while you advance and push them out. Sweep buff in Super actually made this playstyle even better, because I get a free knockdown on people trying to walk back out of step kick range.

I use step kick when either whiff-punishing or when I’m 100% certain I’m in range. Most of the time (against people that know the matchup) I’m netting damage just because they are trying to avoid that range. Step kick is hella good…that’s why it makes his other tools 10x better.

Shit, I could probably write a book on Abel’s ground game alone… God I love this character :lovin:

im just glad strider is back full time for abel.

and since yang got graped i assume HAV’s coming back sometime soon too?

abel forums going back to the gold standard.

Yang players are over-reacting big time. he’s still going to be really good. all his most important stuff is still there… he’s got an annoying as hell pressure game. s.lk nerf is kinda big but he still has c.mk to compensate, his jabs are still godlike, he still has a bunch of ways to combo into sweep, his damage is still good. palm is still functional, he still has no meter options to get through and punish fireballs, he still has really good wakeup, he still has two ultras that are easy as hell to combo into…

I’ve been screwing around with Yang for most of AE because he’s easy as hell to play and win with and I don’t need training mode to do any of his combos. he’ll still be a force in apology edition, and he’ll still beat up on Abel. with Breathless buffed again it’ll probably just be 6-4 but definitely not even. both twins are still super buff characters who will be high tier.

tl;dr I don’t think HAV has any reason to switch from Yang to Abel unless he likes Abel better