I tried something like this as well. you can mix it up with mk raze to land in front of them. also possible after a back throw afair.
a Fw. dash that recovers so slow, that AA cr.HP xx smash x dash cancel is unsafe.
there is alot more to say thanks to. I actually can’t believe how they thought paul would do fine in comparision to raven, rolento, hugo, ryu etc
btw use AA c.hp xx mp smasher instead. combos on ch, and is a free meaty mixup as non counter hit.
You already played against a decent Juri? xD It’s a ridiculous matchup… Runaway, safe divekick, so wtf to do now?
I’m not one to pay attention to tiers, especially since it’ll be a long time till I encounter good players in ranking, but maybe I should drop him as my main character. I’m a terrible player, but my top team right now is Cole/Paul, because they are the only two characters I know how to use, and they are likely the two worst characters in the entire game.
Still, I’m better with Paul than Cole. Can anyone tell me a good point main for Paul so I can still have him as a team, while I start learning characters who I may even win with?
see the Team Synergy thread for opinions on that matter.
and a post by me covering your question:
Thanks. Sorry I did not see the synergy topic, I just assumed it would be in the stickied area.
we only have one other non-stickied-thread currently. hard to miss x)
btw it actually was stickied for a very brief period of time, but I asked for it to be removed from the stickies. the General Discussion is everything we need as a basis for most topics. any “in depth” topic get’s it’s own thread, but it would mess up the concept of “sticky threads” if all of them get stickied in the process, don’t you think? Team discussion, Gem discussion etc can stay floaty imo. If this character forum every gets flooded with threads I’m gonna collect them in one of the stickies for easy access. The Q&A thread is already there to prevent single-question-threads, to help to keep the forum assessable.
If it’s the one I’m thinking of, that tier list was made by some random Japanese guy. Basically akin so someone in USA named xXSephiroth420Xx making a tier list, and the Japanese taking it seriously.
That isn’t to say Paul is amazing, but he’s quite a bit better than I believe people give him credit for. I started with Rolento/Yoshi (being a fan of both chars). Realized Yoshi is absolutely terrible right now, and switched to Juri/Rolento. Too many people playing Rolento, so I switched to Juri/Paul. Won quite a few games, but admittedly Juri was doing most of the heavy lifting. Decided to switch Paul to point so I could force myself to learn to play with him. After putting in some serious work, he can contend with most characters, the biggest problem being opponents that runaway and not having a true reversal.
On a positive note, he has quite a few tricks up his sleeve.
[ Benefits ]
 - If CH, LP, f+MP, HP > Deathfist
AA c.HP > DP+MP (if they recover in crouch, they get knocked down, if they block, +3 Paul)
Against Ken/Ryu scrubs that just jump Hurricane (trying to cross up), nj.HP or HK
Against constant attempts to crossup or in-close jump-ins, instant jump LK (forward or backwards)
 - on CH, c.MP, c.MK > Deathfist
DP+P is +3 frames - Make them block it, ball is in your court:
 - LP-LK hit confirm to launcher
 - LP interrupt, f+HP > Deathfist
 - QCB+LP (bait DP, get safe)
[*]When opponent rolls out of pressure, DP+HP to get back in their face as they get up (+3 again)
[ Gimmicks ]
Crossup MK, MP©, LP (the set up)
 - ignore follow-up free combo, and instead f+HP > EX Deathfist, f+MP, HP(far) > Deathfist
Block String to QCB+LP, slight pause, Deathfist / df+HK…
Combo into QCF+LK, c.MK > QCF+LK…
 - jump MK (front hit)
 - 1 pixel walk forward (can’t even see it), jump MK (back hit)
 - empty jump land c.LK-MK-HP (Launch or EX Deathfist) or THROW
Halfscreen EX Deathfist (the “Hail Mary” of Paul’s offense… just to keep your opponent honest)
Now, don’t get me wrong. Paul is not amazing, but he’s pretty damn fun. I win far more than I lose, and I know if I picked someone else, I wouldn’t lose in very specific instances where Paul got owned… however, there is just something intangibly fun about playing him. So… in my humble opinion, if you want to play Paul, prepare to use as many of his tools as you can. He’s not really anything like he is in Tekken (there no QCF,N… P / d+4 mixup). However, don’t sleep on him either!
Since Okizeme is important, here is the frame advantage after a knockdown. I used video in 60 fps. So far here is what i have found. Errors are possible but the numbers looks logical when i look them (all of them are checked with videos, no guessing)
Quick means quick standing, normal means you don’t touch the stick and roll means roll ^^
Vs Ryu at least.
Sweep : +48 (normal wake up) / +49 (roll)
Phoenix smasher LP/MP/HP : +58 (normal) / +59 (roll)
Phoenix smasher EX : +99 (normal) mid screen / +112 (roll)
Mortar punch lp/mp/hp : +57 normal / +58 roll
Mortar punch ex : +73 normal / roll +74
Mountain Raze lp/mp/hp : +38 quick / +88 normal /+89 roll
Mountain Raze ex : +42 quick / +92 normal / +93 roll
1st hit : +31 quick / +81 normal / +82 roll
2nd hit : +34 quick / +84 normal / +85 roll
sway hp : +18 quick +68 normal +69 roll
sway ex : +58 quick +118 normal +130
shredder lk +44 quick / +94 normal / +95 roll
shredder mk +48 quick / +98 normal / +99 roll
shredder hk +50 quick / +100 normal / +101 roll
shredder ex +45 quick / +95 normal / +96 roll
super arts : +11 normal
I forgot the throws :(. I will add them later
wow, that’s very thorough and must have been hell of a work. thanks.
did you check if it’s true for all characters? did you spot test any other character?
I tried only for Ryu because yeah it take times ^^; but also because the bradygame says page 35 that everyone wake up the same except Ogre who wake up one frame faster in quick standing and normal wake up.
Kazuza too is an exception but only after a face down knockdown. He is 11 frames slower that everyone (Phoenix smasher ex and sway ex cause a facedown if i remember)
What do you mean by spot test ?
randomly test smasher against any other character. then ex sway against another etc just to see if it holds true for all chars to verify if it’s the same for all.
after a smasher, forward jump, neutral jump is very ambigious. somehow the opponent is registered on the other side while he clearly is in front of you, and that REALLY messes up inputs for him. gets even more confusing with nj.hp. it’s also safe against any short of shoryuken and the likes (gets beaten clean by back jump.something tho). opponent needs to roll forward from a fullscreen distance as well, so I doubt it’s that practically unless you face a melee character.
I can’t get the crouching forward after the short mountain raze consistently, even when i plink it.
Anybody have some tips?
a visual help would be to to input it exactly when paul lands. and plinking helps indeed alot imo.
Just took Paul for a testdrive this afternoon and played with him for about an hour in Endless, alternating his position on the team and his partners. Guess I can see why Paul is considered low(er) tier, but I find him very funny. I used to play him in Tekken 3 and Tekken Tag, so happy to find he was in the game, though I picked him rather late.
And the fact that he’s a bit of a goofball, reminds me of Dan, which I like to play in SSF4. Call me a sucker for supposed weak characters…
Things I noticed with him:
I can be pretty impatentient, found I had more succes with Paul as the anchor, so I can tag him in so he can go straight in, close up. That saves me a lot of hassle and damage trying to get in.
His air-to-airs seems pretty bad, but maybe it’s just my timing…
He’s not exactly combo-heavy and I find it a waste to start string with several LP/LK’s into links and then finishing with hcf+LK into juggle qcf+HP. He seems to be able to do pretty solid damage without meter.
I need to be careful with the Mountain Raze and it’s ranges, as well as the Mortar Punch.
It seems there aren’t a whole lot of Paul video’s out, let’s hope someone picks him up soon and shows us what he can do!
no. he has the worst a2a’s I’ve ever seen in a beat em up. either bad hitbox or slow or BOTH. not a single good button in the air apart from nj.hp. and even that is slow. I’m gonna mark the day I hit someone with j.lp. I’m not even sure if it even has a attackbox to begin with.
well c.mk xx mk raze, c.mk xx smasher is a solid footsie damage combo for no meter. and from a jumpin / close punish situation as well.
Yeah, he hits pretty hard, with was corresponding with my memory of him in Tekken. Just an honest, hard slugger… I really liked Bryan too
It seems his footsie tools are pretty slow though. I got beat out consistently with the light pokes by Chun Li (of course) and Rufus. Kazuya on occasion as well. But if Paul does connect, he can dish out some pain pretty fast.
Can anybody tell me if it’s safer to try and space an overhead into Phoenix Smasher? It seems safe on block. Demolition Man seems pretty solid too.
Any other good tools, maybe Mountain Raze and Mortar Punch? They seem punishable, certainly MK/HK Mountain Raze.
if that would be the case I’d be glad, but paul is mediocre in the damage apartment as well. he’s not bad but there are several characters with better tools, yet more damage. just that from that c.mk range he is pretty solid in comparision.
phoenix smasher is -5 for the hp version and -10 for lp/mp. refer to the combo thread for a full frame data list as well as combos (obviously).
demolition man does little damage sadly, and since you end combos with smasher you’re mostly too far away to use it anyway. In the corner it’s a nice little tool tho, but they can always roll…
all raze versions are unsafe. they go under fireballs tho, so keep that in mind. non-ex-versions of morta are +3 on block, so heavily safe and combined with paul’s s.lp are pretty decent. sadly is morta soooo slow (seems to be his thing… to be “slow” >_>) and it can be jabbed out. still something usefull, unlike shredder, which is the worst special ever included in a street fighter game. I swear, dudley’s lightning bolt has more uses.
edit: just hit with j.lp yay!