Akuma/Gouki's health bar compared to others

just saying because akuma eats 30% (if im not mistaken) more then other’s health bar. But what if he is well balanced just like everyone else?? would people considered that to be broken? not fair? good? etc… etc… what are your thoughts on it? and what are your opinions towards ssf4 akuma?? (btw if this has been posted before…sorry!)

It would actually benefit. Now if Seth had extra health, say up top 950-1050, that’s broken because of his movepool.

Gouki with Ryu’s health = fap fap fap fap fap fap loL

I like Gouki the way he is right now. I think some of the fun of his gameplay is the health management, you have to be aware of it all the time, have great execution etc

He should have a more damaging ultra becuase of his health, imo.

Akuma is already one of the best characters in the game, look at his offense and defense. He does good damage, srk, 3 fireballs, and most importantly the vortex. He has 2nd lowest health and stun but has good AAs and a teleport. If he had 950 health and stun or anything higher he would end up like vanilla Sagat and everyone would complain.

I don’t know if I’d say his Defense is that good. I mean, his block is like anyone else’s. Sure he’s got a teleport, but it’s so predictable, it’s not even worth using if your opponent knows what he’s doing. Even with 10% health, if you block any super or ultra that hits at least 10 times, you’re as good as dead.

His offense is good, but it’s been gimped from vanilla and he suffers for it (no s.HK combos after FADC, no loop, reduced damage and stun on his shaku, recovery on DF throw, less hit stun on DF dive kick, reduced damage to Ultra).

If we’d known beforehand that Capcom would shove the Nerf stick that far up his ass, I think I’d have said for them to leave him just like he was in Vanilla. I would’ve accepted that far more readily than having him as he is now.

I agree with this post.
I would much rather have his damage nerf taken off, even if it means going back to his ‘old health’. The reward for working hard was much better in SF4. In Super, it’s working hard for something a character with better health, and easier execution can pull off.
I don’t necessarily think the loop should be brought back, it was pretty cheap. But if you are gonna take it off, make sure the loops for other characters are gone, too.
Also, the damage nerf really wasn’t needed in this game (I mean for all characters). For the love of God, just tone down the Ultra damage overall, and let it only be used ONCE PER ROUND. It’s a god damn reward for getting your ass beat.

ignore this.
good forum.

His defense is far better than the average character. The teleport is not predictable; only a user can be predictable with it. You can’t blame a move for being so useful that some players tend to overuse it and become predictable. He has block-confirmable uppercuts that can FADC to safety if you guess wrong. He has some of the best AA in the game.

You’re taking these things for granted, try out a few of the many characters that don’t have these tools.

Akuma with 1000 HP would be far and away the best character in the game. He has combos that do a ton of damage, he has a teleport to escape danger, and he has a vortex to mixup the opponent and keep them guessing.

He needed tweaked to bring him into line. Akuma had a wealth of advantages in vanilla that if brought across into Super would have skewed what so far looks to be a pretty tight balance across all of the cast.

I largely agree with and understand all the balances changes made to Akuma though the only one I have a gripe with is the reduction of the HP redball from an FADC lp srk. Not only did this look really cool, it did decent damage at the cost of half your meter. Its a bummer its essentially pointless to do now unless you’re gunning for the same damage as an EX srk and want the position advantage it offers.

I like Akuma in Super. I still argue that he has the most versatile array of options. He has no disadvantages with the exception of perhaps his stamina but that I feel is overcome by focusing on your game. When solid offence, defence and mix-ups come together for Akuma players, the dude runs a train.

Of course, when these elements don’t come together, the dude gets mopped up fast. That’s my motivation to get better. When Akuma players get pulped, its a pretty fucking traumatic lesson that we (should) quickly learn from.

I think they just need to take the ultras out imo. During a match you could be putting a kid on blast and all of a sudden he does some random bullshit ultra and takes most of your health away. Its not needed. Its too noob friendly imo. Super meter is just fine. When you wanna do something cool you work for it and build your meter and do a super. Hopefully Capcom will take it out next time.

I agree with most…it really makes you work harder knowing you get more damaged then others. he is a risky character. Very traumatic once you get a good beat down too…

i really hope it doesn’t discourage those who are still “in training”. I myself is still trying to make akuma my main, yet it feels a little discouraging when losing esp when all the practice seem like a waste haha. Even if i have to painfully watch my replays to learn from it… So i encourage for those who are just starting, to please be patient, and maybe learn a thing or two from experts…because i tell you… winning with akuma feels glorious! :badboy:

Bring him into line with WHAT? Let’s review things here, his “overpowered” HK loop worked on 3 characters… THREE!! Out of a cast of 25 in Vanilla was it? That’s about 12% of the roster. And it’s not like it was that easy to perform, either. His BnB combos struck for 350-380 damage in Vanilla. Overpowered some say? Well how about Ryu who could nail you for 400+ off his SRK FADC Ultra (He still can). “Oh, but Ryu has to burn Ultra meter to get it”. Well that’s my point: Akuma can’t combo into his Ultra for garanteed nuclear holocaust-like damage. So how’s he supposed to keep up with characters like Ryu, Sagat or even (gasp!!) Ken?

So now Akuma does about 280-330 off his easiest BnB’s. That’s more or less 30% of Ryu’s health, garanteed ONLY if Ryu doesn’t block the initial hit and IF you don’t fuck up on the execution somewhere along the line and there’s a lot of places you can fail after the first hit (due to lag, poor timing, etc). Once Ryu pops you up with an SRK, FADC + Ultra nets him 400+ damage on Akuma. That’s a GARANTEED 50% damage intake and the only place he can fuck up is the FADC, which is really rare because that SRK pops you really high, giving even the noobiest noob long enough time to mash that QCF x 2 + 3P.

How about Bison? c.lk, c.lk, lk Scissor kick, c.lk, c.lk, lk Scissor kick, etc. Safe as all hell due to almost instant recovery. Even if you manage to counter, it trades most times or worse, you get a glancing hit which he can punish you with as he recovers. His s. MK and s. HK have barely any startup and quick recovery. His only really unsafe moves are the slide (predictable) and his regular stomp on block. But how many “good” Bison players abuse his stomp or slide?

“Well, Sagat got nerfed”. Really? Where?? In damage output? So did the rest of the cast, remember? His Tiger Uppercut’s still the same in execution and if you feel nostalgic for it’s old damage, you can burn 1 meter to do an Angry Scar before one. There you go!! He can still FADC Ultra juggle you off s.HK shenannigans. His FB is still hella fast, powerfull and has quick recovery.

Now I’m not saying these characters are cheap or overpowered and should be nerfed. But it’s not like we had an easy time against them in Vanilla. I don’t think Akuma had any easy matches, ever (except maybe Guile? Abel?? Elf???). We always had to work for our wins.

I just question the need to make it EVEN harder now in Super. I agree with you though, Akuma’s still got plenty of options and is a lot of fun to play as… When things go right. But now, more than before, Akuma gets beaten out by bullshit more times than should be fair. Shit, even guys like Tokido get taken to the curb against marginal characters like Rose (really??? ROSE!!!). What’s the excuse there, he should work more on his execution? It’s TOKI-FUKIN-KIDO!!..

sigh… I’m gettin’ carried away here. Seriously though, it’s true that to be good with Akuma now in Super, you have to work hard to be BETTER than you were before. And that’s all good. I just question why it’s gotta be Akuma (and a few others) that have to do this when the rest of the cast can get away with bullshit.

Where’s the “falling in line” there?

^^^^ Pretty much, yes.

As a relatively new player, I like the low health because it forces me to learn survival skills I might otherwise ignore.

Venom, just shut the fuck up. You lose any credibility after saying Akuma’s teleport isn’t worth using and his defense sucks.

Jeez! Stop being such a little bitch.

Akuma is beastly in this game still. His Ultra is one of the best there is. His c.MK is now far more solid, which makes it easier to set up a combo like: c.MK, Hado, FADC, s.HP, tatsu, EX SRK. And he still has virtually all of the tools he had in vanilla. No one can out-projectile Akuma, and he does so much damage its ridiculous.

The best tier list out there (the iplaywinner list) has him at 2nd, A+, ahead of Ryu, Sag, Dic, Abel, FFS!


Venom does have a point however. Most of the changes to Akuma do make sense if you want to balance a game, the problem is the lack of scrutiny across the board. Akuma, a difficult character to use, had some powerful things that needed to be kept in check, I agree. But why no such changes for other powerful characters, some far easier to use? Rog wasn’t even touched, and Rufus pretty much stayed the same for the most part and was given a better second ultra.

The SF4 series’ biggest flaw is how internally inconsistent the game design is.

My biggest gripe in Super is how the changes to Akuma makes it so that we have to play him very differently than we did in Vanilla. That’s not a bad thing per se, but why do we basically have to relearn our character when most of the other returning cast character play exactly as they did in SF4?

Heh! I was seeing red there for a bit and before I realized, I had typed up a storm. Didn’t want to delete it, even though it sounded whiny. But my point above stands: I resent that Capcom has made it so that Akuma players have had to change their game while the rest don’t really have to. The only returning characters off the top of my mind that seem like they’ve had changes that make them play differently are Fei and Rose.