Buk is lucky enough to have Japanese experience so the only questions I feel that should be directed towards him are the high level gameplay and strategy questions. I’m trying to read his thread and I see questions like, “How do I combo after Iori’s grab?”. What the heck, is it really necessary to ask high level player a question like that?
The command for Iori’s special grab is hcb, f+P. If you want to be good, get into the habit of inputting hcb, f, b+P every time you want the grab instead. That way you can take advantage of Iori’s 50/50 roll mixup and grab from either side.
To combo after the grab, the fastest and easiest move you can do is close s.HP. Close s.HP comes out in 3 frames and is easily cancelable into anything. If you can’t get close s.HP to hit after the grab, then keep practicing until you can. You should be able to do a 2 hit combo every time even with your eyes closed.
I don’t recommend mashing, but do what you have to do if you still can’t do the combo. I recommend *double tapping HP after the grab, quicky do a qcb+HP, and then qcb+HP two more times, stop and let the combo finish by itself.
*quickly brush the button first with your middle finger and then again with your index finger (or index and then middle if you like it better that way).
Please don’t post in the Buk thread anymore if anybody here has a question they really can’t find through the search or they have an idea that the question could probably be more easily asked here instead. I’m not taking any in depth strategy questions, but if anybody needs to ask something basic like what team might be best or needs some tips for better execution on basic things like roll cancel (or Iori grab, close s.HP), then ask me.
I’m selfish and I want to keep the Buk thread easy for myself to read (instead of having to edit the html after saving it on my computer to delete all the posts I don’t like).
I’ll try and reply to this thread every Friday afternoon. Keep this and the Buk thread clean please, so no garbage talk to me either. Take it to the PMs or approach me in person if anybody has a problem with me making a thread like this or etc…
Ask PPB too! He likes talking strategy and knows all the same basics (frame data etc…) that I know as well.
i remember you posting stuff about ryu, so i guess i’ll ask here since… the ryu threads seem to be dead. recently i’ve been picking up s-groove ryu, but some of his stuff seem a little wierd. i’ve actually never used shoto’s in cvs2 (unless you count the days of first starting off).
in 3s an other games, a connected c. mk into hadouken works (simple 2 hit combo). in this game, it does too. but at certain distance, the other person is too far or something and can block the hadouken. is there something more gauranteed to connect after a c. mk?
also, i remember you said for a blocked string you can end with a far s. fp. if a small character (like athena) is crouching, will the move completely, or will it connect?
Unless you’re punishing an outstretched limb (I’ll use Athena’s d.MK for example), d.MK xx level 3 super fireball will always connect and is Ryu’s bread and butter. If you want to be random and check the other guy low for example…
-poke with d.MK (blocked), walk forward, d.MK again right away xx level 3 super
You’re usually at max range after hitting with d.LK, s.LP, d.MK bnb combo as well. Use your level 3 super fireball to combo after that.
You’re out of luck if you’re punishing limbs with d.MK xx super unfortunately. Even at level 3, super fireball will not combo at midscreen depending on how far away you are. The biggest reason why SA3 Ken is so awesome is because his super always connects at every range, even when you’re tagging a limb with his d.MK. CvS2 Ryu can’t do the same thing 3S Ken or Ryu can do with their SA3 and SA1 respectively.
Level 1 super fireball will rarely connect outside of point blank range unfortunately. Because of that, I’m not feeling S-Ryu so much now either. Whenever you try something like max range d.MK xx level 1 super fireball, you’re actually leaving yourself open for the opponent to mash on roll and kill you. It’s not fair IMO how Sagat recovers in time to block when he does the same thing with his level 1, but Ryu is left open. You’d might as well use regular hadoukens instead as Ryu’s level 1 super fireball is never safe.
I guess with S-Ryu you can’t safely spam the level 1 super fireballs after all. The best way to use it is like Ken’s level 1 punch super then. Hit confirm it from close range with two low shorts.
Athena is a strange exception to CvS2 hitbox rules. Normally, when a character crouches, his sprite becomes wider/“fatter” and becomes easier to hit and throw. I don’t know what’s up with Athena. She’s normally hit by max range Ryu far s.HP standing, but when she ducks, she can actually avoid it at max range. Just a couple pixels closer and Athena will always get hit ducking by Ryu’s far s.HP though.
Because of the weird way Athena gets distanced whenever she gets hit, blocks, or is crouching or standing, I never recommend going for any blocked/counter hit string with far s.HP with anything greater that d.LP, d.LP, far s.HP. If you get greedy and go for d.MP, d.LP, far s.HP, Athena can mash you out of it with her d.HP. It’s not that her d.HP cleanly goes under your far s.HP every time… because it doesn’t. It’s that her unconventional crouch/stand and block/reel hitbox can really throw off your distancing.
Athena really throws off a lot of players when they first play against her I think. Keep practicing to find better attack setups and patterns you can use against her, and good luck with your new shotos.
Bison’s game after a knockdown - I think my timing is a little off or I’m just doing the wrong stuff. c.lp always gets stuffed basically no matter who the character is, meaty c.mk doesn’t seem make a lot of sense since there don’t seem to be many good follow ups either blocked or hit, and staying back a bit usually swings the momentum back in their favor. What advice you got?
I’m a bit leery on posting this question in Buktooth’s thread seeing as asking for his help wouldn’t be too far from asking, “How do I beat you?”
Last week, after about 2 months in training mode, I finally got to go an arcade (Fresno Nickel if anyone cares). I didnt lose a match until I came against one guy, using K Akuma/Morrigan/Geese. Since neither Akuma nor Geese gave me any issues that I couldn’t handle on my own, my question revolves around Morrigan.
I know how to block her crossups and her generic chains found in conjunction with her run, but I have trouble countering it effectively. My practice at home has been on my custom Sanwa, so my stickwork on Happ’s aren’t quite up to scratch, which is part of my issue.
I usually ended up fighting his Morrigan with my second character, that being C Ken. Until i’m able to DP these strings fast enough to counter them, is there anything braindead easy to keep in mind so as to stop her momentum? Once i’m on the offensive, I generally have him beat. My issue just comes down to getting the momentum in my favor.
Thanks in advance. My question is a bit general, so let me know if you need me to elaborate further.
Bison meaty d.MK is really good. It makes a lot of sense in my opinion. Another d.MK is really easy to link afterwards, and against fat characters, you even have time to link a charge combo. See if d.LP, s.LP, or s.LK might work for example.
Bison’s d.LP is ridiculous. I hate that move with a vengeance. I can’t even begin to count the number of times damn Mexicans have mashed that move out of me when I try to throw them and put me in a death combo. Even when I don’t want to throw but go for counter hit instead. Bison d.LP STILL has that magical property of somehow trading or even counter hitting ME whenever I’m up close. I don’t want to talk about this masher move anymore. You figure out how to use it yourself, because I don’t have the slightest bit of advice for you. People who pick Bison are annoying enough already.
When to jump depends on what character you’re playing and if the opponent’s character happens to have a hard time anti-airing your character’s jump in. If I have Yamazaki versus Rolento for example, I’ll jump on him in the corner with my j.HK ALL DAY. Sakura feeling a little hesitant to attack me? Jump in from far with my Sagat j.HK. Also…
-Iori j.LP on Rolento
-Sagat far s.HK on Geese
-Rolento j.MP on K-groove
The most common time I jump however is only when I have a guaranteed setup. My favorite times to jump in with Sagat are after I connect my fierce Tiger Uppercuts. I roll once and then use my super jump LK to land right on top of the other guy’s head as he gets up. I mix that up by landing and going low with a combo as well. Sometimes I also normal jump to stay in the front.
Rolento also has an awesome jump in setup after landing his level 2/3 super. I walk forward and then normal jump forward with my j.MK right on top of the other guy’s head. The best thing about using the setup is because you get the guaranteed jump attempt since opponents can’t tech roll after a super.
Any other time you want to jump is when you want to take a risk to try and get in. Sakura has an anti-air at every angle for Ken for example. I don’t care about that though. Sure, she may hit me with d.HP three times in row, but if I get just one sucessful random jump in with Ken, Sak is losing more that half her life in one shot.
Buk would be better able to answer this question that I can, so please ask him too. Again, 90% of the time I only jump in after I’ve knocked the other guy down, but to be a truly strong player, you need to know all the other times it’s good to jump as well. Random jump in HK during Sagat verus Sagat mirror match is good at times for example.
Yeah, that’s the same reason I asked how to get around RC Iori punch in the ask PPB thread instead.
I use C-Ken too so I’ll give you some of the things I keep in mind whenever I fight against Morrigan.
First and formost, your rapid fire whiffed s.LP’s will stop Morrigan’s random fly in. RC kick also stops Morrigan cold in the air as well.
You can’t random DP any of Morrigan’s strings, because they’re all chains. Ideally you want to keep her from ever getting in on you in the first place, so that’s why standing jabs and RC Kick are so good. Once she’s on top of you, there’s really no right or wrong thing to do. You can only take a guess as to which way to block or whether to stick out a limb or not and then commit to that decision and hope you guessed right. Better to not ever put yourself in that postion in the first place. Keep her out!
Common abusable Morrigan patterns:
-Fly in with fly HP
RC kick it or stay out of range. Those spikes make it difficult for you to DP.
-d.LK, walk forward RC grab
d.LK has very long range. It’s longer that your Ken d.LP or d.LK that’s for sure. Don’t try and jump away from the grab. Either take the grab or grab him out of the roll yourself.
Why you shouldn’t jump:
If you jump away, Morrigan recovers in time to DP you every time. Jumping away isn’t even remotely worth the reward because not only do you leave yourself opening to getting hit low again, but a grab does less damage than a deep anti-air DP anyway. If the DP trades to put Morrigan into rage, she can even combo a level 3 off the trade… jumping away sucks. Just don’t it unless you have Vega or Rolento maybe. If she does fly j.MK after the d.LK, that will have beaten your jump away as well.You could of DP’d or RC kicked that.
-d.LK, walk forward, d.LK, d.HP xx level 3
Very dangerous. You need to play extremely conservative and runaway the first chance you get whenever Morrigan is raged and on top of you.
Force Morrigan to get into the footsies and ground game with you. Then you only have to deal with fighting against her far s.MP and d.HK mostly. Those far s.MP xx qcf+P patterns are definately not as deceptively safe as they appear to be. Use your Ken’s reverse dp+K.
So yeah, whiffed jabs and RC kicks. If she gets on top of you, you need to just chill, block, and wait it out until you get some breathing room and a safe time to reset the momentum. dp+HP is also good by the way. Even if you only get one or two hits, you still get the knockdown remember (I don’t think you can follow up after though since good N/K-groovers know to tech roll). I hope that helps with your Ken defensive game. I know I’ve need major help at times too.
Although K can be aruably better, I have a really difficult time fighting against P-Cammy. She’s easily, if not one of, the strongest characters in the game after the A-team. Her walking speed is what drives me crazy. If she doesn’t want to fight me, she seriously doesn’t need to. It’s very easy for her to walk backwards out of range and keep you from running any kind of offense. It helps that her combos, frame advantage traps, and guard break potential are brain dead easy as well. You P-groovers are all really good with the option select low parries after a tech throw I noticed too. Cammy is excellent at doing that with her powerful far s.HK and d.MK.
P-Hibiki is also one of the best versions of Hibiki. After A and K, and she’s much better than N IMO too. She can get in relatively risk free with her qcb+LP now and annoyingly parry any punish attempts during her recovery. P-groove also makes her combos ending with qcf+MP a lot safer as well. I can never seem to punish P-Hibiki with my reversal Bison scissors after she does her bnb combo on me. I think it’s really scrubby that P and K are allowed to spam the slashes like that, but it works.
If you can make P-Chun li work, then go for it. I know a guy that makes P-Iori work of all characters. IMO there are better characters that can build meter fast though. If you can’t punish whiffs with far s.MP xx super consistently, then you’re going to be a hell of a time against Sagat. You need to walk forward first whenever you want to punish a whiffed Sagat crouching fierce and it will be very frustrating because although it will look really scrubby for Sagat to be spamming moves like an idiot, he won’t stop doing it if he realizes your footsies are only average level.
I’m trying to get rid of my PS2 joystick btw, if anybody is interested. I’m open to both buyers and traders.
against fat characters, meaty d.mk, cr.lp, st.mp xx scissors/psycho crusher will combo.
against normal characters you can do meaty d.mk, d.mk xx scissors/crusher. But i’m pretty sure you need a bit of extra charge time, but most of bison’s knockdowns will give you enough time to get that extra bit of charge.
Thanks for that kcxj. When I was playing against the guy’s Morrigan, I always felt pressured to find a way to get back on the offense, and that was a major part of why I got so messed up by it. I’ll make sure to keep those pointers in mind next time I play that guy.
LG, since he wasn’t on your list, I have to ask, have you considered P-Sagat? He builds meter pretty well and does good damage even without the meter. Like all good P-groove characters, he’s practically guaranteed at least some kind of damage of a parry. Not to mention he can combo into his supers off of practically anything. Disregard what I said if you hate Sagat, I just wanted to throw that out since he has practically everything a P character needs to be successful.
Kang, I read your blanka thread a while back. ( great post btw)
But i think you deleted it for whatever reason. I have two main teams . C- Guile,Blanka,Sagat and K-Kyo,Hibiki,Sagat . I have a couple of questions :
1.What are blankas best mixup options and 50/50 mixups after a knockdown. I know you can dash and either A.Rc Elec B.Throw C.Low shorts into whatever or D. KKK back and try to punish any wakeup attempt whiffs. What are some other blanka mixups?
2.Should K-Sagat be played in a similiar fashion to C-Sagat?
My C- Sagat is basically just jiggling while using S.short and other hard to punish normals while looking to punish whiffs and mistakes. Then after a knockdown (usually from a tiger uppercut)
getting close and using guard crush patterns and mixups. Is there anything i should be doing different with K groove?
Although I personally don’t feel you’re using Blanka to his full potential unless you’re using him in A-Groove, there are a lot of things Blanka can do to mix you up after a knockdown.
-slight wait, dash, dash, RC elec
-no wait, dash, dash, whiff d.LK, RC elec
-no wait, dash, dash, whiff d.LK, counter hit d.LK, d.LK, s.LP xx super
-no wait, dash, dash, sit for a split second, counter hit d.LK, d.LK, s.LP xx super
-MP ball to other side of body, RC elec
-MP ball to other side of body, meaty d.LK, d.LK, s.LP xx super <-- normally a one frame link, but the meaty attack makes it easy
-LP ball to the same side, slight wait, d.LK, s.LP xx super
-MP ball to other side of body, meaty s.MP, link whatever you want after or counter hit sweep (aka. the New Jersey special)
-dash, normal jump forward, press j.MK right on top of opponent’s head A totally ambiguous cross-up, that lets you combo a HP elec or a d.LK link combo (if you’re nasty with the one frame links like that) every time.
-[dash, dash] or MP ball, jump staight up falling j.HK xx combo It works because people will try to throw you out of RC elec.
-any of the above setups, but do a throw instead
To summarize, your main Blanka offensive manuevers after a knockdown elec are either 1.) [dash, dash], 2.) MP ball, or 3.) [dash, jump]
If the opponent likes to tech roll, then punish him for that too. Easier said than done of course, but keep punishing him if he’s a persistent player (like Ricky) who will spam on tech rolls all day if you let him. Your [dash, sweep], slide, and HP ball are your main tech roll catch moves. Hit him more than once and his stun meter will start to soar. Keep track and then beast him with the dizzy, dash up, vertical j.HP, s.HP xx super. :badboy:
I’ll get to you about K-Sagat later by editing this post. I’ll just say right now that he’s a lot stronger than any other groove Sagat (except maybe S-Sagat) in the Sagat versus Sagat mirror match in my opinion.
Notice the major difference in frame advantage for far s.LP and close s.LP. If only far s.LP gave +8 as well, a sweep xx super would link after that like nothing. I could be nasty and do an OTK combo like low jump HK, far s.LP, d.HK xx super. Crazy! But doesn’t work unfortunately. :sad:
Good luck making Nako work, Nick. A tip Nestor gave me was to knock the other guy down, stand over his body, get on the bird for a split second, cancel with kick to drop down, land d.LK, d.LK, d.MP xx ground slash combo. It looks very deceptive and is tricky to block. After the guy sees you do this for the first time, you start getting a lot of free throws as well.
First of all , im not ppb. I lost my acct pw and thought this would be funny after watching rocky III recently.
I realize that blanka isnt be used at full potential unless hes in A. BUT my team in a-groove is Ken,geese,blanka, and I find that against good people ( buk, Ashley Hernandez) that team just doesnt cut it. And i refuse to do the sak,bis,blanka thing. Im so tired of seeing that team that i usually dont even watch vids anymore of that team playing. So i went with what i figured would be the next best thing, one of the top c groove teams.
If you have any team suggestions to liven things up a bit im all ears.