Wow this was extremely helpful. Now I can try to calculate what moves actually link into eachother. I never really looked at it through that perspective.
[LEFT]Thanks a lot for all the information, ilitirit. It’s helping me a lot.[/LEFT]
this type of stuff always goes over my head - never found a use for all that frame rate data. but informative atleast - thanks op!
Even though I don’t fully understand the calculations, seeing the VesperArcade videos and to know which moves are safe, how much stun damage they have and the speed of normals and what not, should be very helpful on higher levels.
For example the standing close fierce punch of Ryu has a high recovery time that it can be punished if it is not cancelled into a Hadouken, I am correct?
If this is correct, there should be a lot of applications on combo’s creations on the game
That’s one example of how to use frame data. It helps determine which moves are unsafe, and which moves you can use to punish it, from a purely theoretical point of view.
It also aids in combo creation, but often there are some combos that work in the game, which are technically impossible if you just look at the frame data for the moves. At the end of the day, it’s still all about playing the game, poking and prodding at it, alongside viewing the technical frame data.
It’s especially useful in determining setups for certain situations, such as safe-jumps, frame traps, etc.
hey, can someone explain to me the frame advantage regarding projectiles.
eg. Sagat’s high tiger shot is -2 on block, and +2 on hit. Just what does that mean?
I can understand that +2 on hit, means, your stuck in 2 frames of hit animation from the projectile.
But -2 on block?
Or is it only in regards to when your up close? Eg. Tiger shot is total 39 frames. If you block the Tiger shot up close, before the projectile has time to travel, your at +2 on block - obviously your at a distance due to pushback
Yes, the -on block / +on hit for projectiles always assumes you’re right next to the opponent.
I am 35 and played street fighter since 1992. I can say learning frames has been hard but the old days of feeling are gone when up against A+ players. Sometimes I feel like I am playing DDR instead of SF. SFxT especially is one you gotta get frames on. I need a tutor. SMH.
can someone please try to answer this… i understand how frame data adds up except for how it works when read for supers.
for example, Ryu’s super is read as: 1+2
According to this it’s 3 frames… but it’s really 1 frame of freezing, then 2 frame startup from what i hear. my question is in it’s application and if its correct…
how many frames do i actually need for startup then? does this mean i need only a 1 frame window (within a frame trap for example) to perform Ryu’s super? or do I need 2 frames only… and that one extra frame is just to get technical about it?
Very helpful. Much appreciated.
Awesome stuff! If you know of links for a variety of games’ frame data, let me know. I’d like to add it to the Newbies Links along with a link to this thread.
I know I’m late but it’s obviously clear that a whiffed moves animation looks faster than a move that hit or was blocked. The blocked/Hit animation looks longer than a whiffed move. So as for the moves official recovery, how is any of this believable. For all we know there is a recovery for a move on block or hit. Can someone help me with that?
You’ve gotta read!
When you whiff a move, the move goes through startup-active-recovery. When you connect with a move (i.e. the active frames touch the other character), hitstun or blockstun will activate and change the outcome, affecting both characters. This is why frame data has “on guard” and “on hit” categories.
Ryu’s Crouching Medium Kick has 12 frames of recovery. If guarded, 13 frames of blockstun occur from the first active frame (assuming that it connects on the first active frame). So, 4 active frames plus those 12 frames of recovery equals 16 frames. Since there were 13 frames of blockstun, 16-13 = 3. Ryu recovers 3 frames slower than the opponent (-3).
If it hits, 16 frames of hitstun occur from the first active frame. So, 4 active frames plus those 12 frames of recovery equals 16 frames. Since there were 16 frames of hitstun, 16-16 = 0. Ryu recovers at the same time as the opponent (0).
Of course this is assuming cr. MK is not canceled into a special move or super.
Read the first post again.
Where could I find frame data for Juri?
You can find frame data for everyone on our wiki:
If I do a move that leaves me at +2F on block and then followed by a move that has a 5F startup, is that considered as a 3F frame trap? If so, does that mean it will trap moves that have 3F startup or more?
If both you and your opponent do a normal on the very first frame possible, it will trade. In practice 5f to 7f gaps are very common to beat crouch tech though.
ok. That clears things up.
what about moves that are cancelled into another move? How are you suppose to calculate the frame gap?
Usually it’s frame advantage on hit + active frames - startup of move you cancel into - 1.