Bushin Frame Traps/Counter hit Setups

guy

#1

I’d like to compile a list of usefull frame traps for Guy so if you know any good ones, let us know and I’ll update this post.

Frame Traps

— cr.lp, cr.lp, cr.hp block string to score a counter hit

— cr.lp, cr.lp, st.mp xx lp hozzanto/run xx stop st.mp

— cr.jab, CH cl.st.mp xx run stop, cr.jab, st.HP xx ex/lp hozanto

— crLp, crLp, crLp, crLk into a whiffed crMp into Ex Hozanto. (against Ryu)
beats: crMk, crHk, All normal uppercuts, Ex Tatsu

— TC xx run stop, cr.HP

—Cr.MP->Cr.LP->S.MP (needs to be close for cr.lp to hit)

—Cr.LK ->Cr.LP -> Walkforward->Cr.LK

—c.lp, c.lp, walk forward, cl.s.hp, s.mp xx ex.hozanto

—c.lp, c.mp (CH), c.mp, s.mp xx ex.hozanto

—c.lp, cl.s.mp (CH), s.mp xx ex.hozanto

SSF4 AE Guy:

—cr.lp, cr.lp, st.mk, TC

—cr.lk, TC xx lp hozzanto, cr.lk

Guy Countehit Setups Videos

[media=youtube]UOKLq0A5jHA[/media]

[media=youtube]i7uvtCq6wyI[/media]

[media=youtube]UawRm1b9-xs[/media]

Thanks for everyone’s contributions!

Guy’s Option Selects: The Versatility of Bushinryu

Run/Stop Pressure: Run Guy, Run ! - A guide to the practical applications of Run/Stop

AE Frame Data: http://wiki.shoryuken.com/Super_Street_Fighter_IV_AE/Guy#Frame_Data


The Guy Q&A Thread: Post your questions here!
#2

Cool topic.

cr.jab,Counter hit close standing strong xx run stop, cr.jab,st.fierce xx ex/lp hozanto seems like his best one but its damn hard to do.I’ve never landed it in a match but I’ve seen Kiryu do it.

I keep getting thrown or jabbed when I try to do the cr.lp, cr.hp one.I think I’m delaying the cr.hp too long.


#3

Like the Thread!

AlboShinobi try crLp, crLp, crLp, crLk into a whiffed crMp into Ex Hozanto. Go in training mode and set Guy as the dummy and You as Ryu. The idea is to cacth Ryu’s crMk, but this also works well against other stuff.

(against Ryu)
beats: crMk, crHk, All normal uppercuts, Ex Tatsu

This seem to work best against a Shoto who is mashing hard. (note: can beat Ken’s Step Kick)


#4

TCxrun stop, cr fp is pretty effective for counter hits


#5

That’s because that frame trap is mostly good against crouch techers, because when you tech, you actually do it by pressing a bit later. It won’t work well against someone who mashes jab/throw, the gap between c.lp -> c.hp is too big. For those kind of players, you should rely on ‘immediate’ frame traps (leaving the least gap possible) and by doing low moves (if they mash throw).


#6

Didnt we already make a thread like this?


#7

Cr.MP->Cr.LP->S.MP
Cr.LK ->Cr.LP -> Walkforward->Cr.LK …well its not exactly a setup but works great with guy thanks to cr.lp blockstun …


#8

Where? Didn’t see one


#9

This is sweet, love to have an option-select thread also with vids explaining them.


#10

I think it’s this one http://shoryuken.com/f334/versatility-bushinryu-237874/ hope it gets updated if neccesary


#11

It was mixed in with the Run/stop Thread.


#12

ah thanks AlboShinobi :smiley:


#13

scouting your opponent is very important in anything, and i think in sf4 one of the most relevant things to look for is probably how the enemy defends. this is really important because a large portion of any offense is counterhit setups, and frame traps have to be used according to the type of defense your opponent uses.

it all starts with the enemy’s fear of a throw. because your enemy expects a throw in your offense, they will probably either 1. stand tech, 2. crouch tech (early and late), or 3. backdash or 4. neutral jump (if you are being really predictable with where you time your throws, this is probably the most effective way for the enemy to regain momentum back, since it’s a jump in

i think the first two categories, stand tech, and crouch teching, is where most counterhit setups come in, right?

so, how do you like to scout your opponent? do you start off assuming the enemy crouch techs and use anti crouch teching frame traps right off the bat (c.lp, c.hp)? it seems like when you run into a random, the enemy might be a jab spammer or stand techer (ie. not using crouch tech), and both these beat anti crouch tech frame traps really bad because of the large delay. so, do you start off using anti jab spam/anti stand tech/anti neutral jump frame trap, like c.lp, TC or c.lp, c.lp, st.mp, or c.lk, c.lk, st.mp?

i thought of this because i realized if i start off the match with a tick throw and they tech it, i have no idea if they were stand teching, or crouch teching for later on during my offense. this makes a huge difference in terms of which frame trap to use, and since there is no one frame trap to fit all situations, i think it might be worth it to somehow stop your offense temporarily and do a delayed crouch tech to see what happens. if they stand tech, you will tech them. if they are crouch teching, you will see their c.lk come out (of course they could crouch tech using c.lk c.lp c.mp for example, but… not likely against guy i would think). unfortunately if they like to neutral jump this will be very bad for you, but neutral jumping is generally a foolish thing to do during defense i think so most opponents will not do this. you could also do a backdash, but i think a delayed crouch tech will be good if they do absolutely nothing, this way you can continue your offense.

also, from the enemy’s point of view, an educated opponent will know that you are attempting to adjust your frame traps and will respond appropriately, so i suppose during the entire battle you need to be doing some rock paper scisors.

thoughts?

TLDR version: how do you scout out what type of defense (crouch teching, stand teching, etc) your enemy does? is this normally how you pick your counterhit/frame trap setups? i made a suggestion in the second to last paragraph above.


#14

Noob question what does: xx stand for?


#15

cancel or into.


#16

Thanks


#17

I’ve actually started theory fighting about this a couple days ago but haven’t really experimented in-game. For Guy i think a c.lp > c.mk might tell you if they like to stand tech. c.lp > walk back should show exactly what they do. I feel like the c.lp>walk back should be the done at the first chance you get but it could be a little risky.

so i’m thinking this is how to beat each option.

stand tech: c.lp > c.mk or c.lk, c.lk, etc

crouch tech: c.lp > c.mp (my current favorite for scoring counter hits)

jump: c.lp > wait > nj anything. or c.lp > s.mp xx run.overhead ?


#18

SSF4 AE Frame Traps

cr.lp, cr.lp, st.mk, TC

cr.lk, TC xx lp hozzanto, cr.lk

agree?

Also do you guys really use cr.mp, cr.lp, st.mp frame trap? cause the cr.lp whiffs on me a lot of the time when I tried it in training mode


#19

my current favorites:

c.lp, c.mp (CH), c.mp, s.mp xx ex.hozanto

c.lp, cl.s.mp (CH), s.mp xx ex.hozanto

c.lp, c.lp, walk forward, cl.s.hp, s.mp xx ex.hozanto

Also, after a blocked bushin flip elbow, an immediate close s.mp seems to score counter-hits easily.


#20

@albo Its only if the C.Mp is really close … the thing is you can kara throw after C.MP , works pretty well… I’ve seen combofiend use it at times… But the C.MP should be pretty close…if its far just replace c.lp with s.mp

C.MP has insane hitbox and +2 on block…should definitely be used in frametraps…