Anyone know any set ups and special strats for him.
What I like to use:
c.jab- Pretty fast. Good for stopping throw attempts, and if you’re close, you can mash into his iron ball.
c.strong- decent priority. Comes out a bit slow, but still great to use for anti-air and stuffing moves.
c.fierce- an anti-air with excellent vertical reach, but horrible lag/recovery. This loses to adept A/P/K-Groove users wanting to bait you into sticking it out, obviously. You’re better off using his c.strong for anti-air in situations like these, but otherwise, this move’s pretty solid. Use only if you’re looking for someone to jump at you, IF you’re confident they have nothing to counter it.
c.forward- a low poke with good reach and priority, snd faster than his c.strong. Good for stuffing moves and mix-up.
c.roundhouse/DF+FP- this is one area where you should put your mix-up ability at work. The range on his c.roundhouse is good, but the recovery is horrible. Use it, but only at maximum range and for mixing up with his slide (DF+FP). Sliding is surprisingly fast, goes under most projectiles, covers distance, and is much safer. But to hit with it, it’s most effective when they least expect it, as that’s what it’s clearly meant for. Not many would expect something like this from a big guy like Chang, so again, mix it up. Also, along with that comes Chang’s…
s.strong- I find myself doing this more accidentally, but if youre far enough, you can hit people out of the air with it.
s.fierce/s.roundhouse- the recovery may be a little slow for these, too (though not quite as much as his c.RH), but both have VERY good range. So good, they can be deceptive for people thinking Chang’s too slow to get near them, when he doesn’t really have to. Shit, that’s gotta be the one reason I LIKE using Chang in the first place! Therefore, s.fierce/s.roundhouse are a lot safer, and make terrific GC moves. Like his c.RH and slide, you want to throw quite a few of these in your mix-up game to keep pressure on cornered opponents, especially during their wake up. Also, his s.fierce can be used as anti-air from a distance, or as a pre-emptive anti-air if you stick it out early, just as people leave the ground. The s.roundhouse is among probably the second furthest reaching in the game, behind Dhalsim’s limbs, and is best used at its maximum range.
close s.RH- yet another decent anti-air. Comes out relatively quick and has nice recovery, something most of his other anti-airs lack.
j.fierce- now THIS is a sweet, SWEET move. If you want to get in, by all means, use it. This makes every one of Chang’s jump-ins all the more safe. If you want to jump over a fireball (save Sagat’s High Tigers), this’ll hit them clean, right before they can make it back to their standing animations and block. And unless they’re in C-Groove, or controlling characters with high jumps, your opponents will not want to be in the air with you, as Chang’s fierce will shut down almost everything they have to throw at you. The j.fierce is slightly laggy, so it takes getting use to. Just remember to stick it out a bit earlier than you think you have to, and you’ll arm Chang with the “c.fp of the sky.” :lol: j/k
j.strong/j.forward- as good as his j.fierce is, youre not always going to get a chance to use it. Chang does have problems with people who manage to get close to him from the air, and because of the fierces lag, they wont hesitate to try and hit you out of it, and it often works. Fortunately, Changs mix-up options arent limited to ground games, and the j.strong/j.forward are just the right things to keep opponents off you in mid-air. They dont stick out that far, but with Changs large frame, the priority speaks for itself.
j.roundhouse- fast, and does decent damage. It has no reach, so its clearly meant as a tool for low-jumping. I might even go as far as to say its THE best move to low jump with. Other than that, I cant think of much use for this. It stuffs a lot of moves just nicely if you hit with it at the initial moment of your jump, but it also leaves you open, not to mention without your much-needed tripgaurd.
(BTW: If you want low jumps with Chang, but dont pick N-Groove, come see me so I can hurt you! J/k, Ill get to that in a minute).
Throws- Use the punch throw to knock them anywhere, use the kick throw to keep them cornered, or throw them behind you if Chois not standing next to you.
Hold B, F+P- this is mostly used as a counter, with its counter time and reach varying on the button (ie. jab gives him the shortest time to counter a move, and throws the ball out at its shortest reach, and so on). If you think you can randomly insert this somewhere between your barrage of s.fps, s.-c.rhs, and slides to punish a normal on their reaction, do so. Sometimes works as anti-air, but only against deep jump-ins. This can also stop fireballs. Note: Do not RC this. Chang may have a long-ass roll, but its invincibility gets eaten up by this moves start-up.
Spinning ball [tap P]- a relatively good anti-air by itself; simply a pain in the ass when RCed. If you havent gotten the hang of RCing this, then just stick with c.strong/fierce. And if you miss, don’t forget to cancel it with 3P.
HCB, F+P- this grab has short range, so its not always guaranteed to land on your part. It might do wonders as an RC, but only if youre some incredibly gifted RCer (HCB, F+P command grabs are some of the most inconsistent RCs ever). If you can, however, try to use this whenever they slip up (like roll blindly towards you), after theyve blocked Choi, or when you fuck up during the middle of Changs CC.
HCB+K- I fuckin LOVE this move. The GC potential this has is too sweet. Its amazing how so many people try to jump over Choi or roll through him as if he were a projectile, only to get knocked the fuck down and get moved in on by Chang. You can provide this inconvenience continuously as long as youre far enough from opponents, and you get a free s.fp/rh if they hit Choi. But if they get within range of Changs s.rh, switch to the short version. It travels closest to Chang, allowing for more error on their rushdown. And no matter what the situation, always, ALWAYS RC it. At the least, if you do it at the last minute, theyll hit Choi instead, which could allow you a free throw in some cases. Not everyone is prepared to whiff through Changs thumb-up pose.
Note: One neat set-up is to buffer this from a close s.rh. It combos when theyre in the corner. Anywhere else, and the roundhouse will push them away, far enough for them to try and jump, and get hit, or roll through and get thrown.
HCF+K- Great anti-air from afar, great pressure nullifier from mid-screen. RC.
DP+K- Choi may leap up in the air, but never confuse this as an anti-air. If anything, you can use it to chase down opponents jumping AWAY from you, but not as theyre jumping towards you. Even if you RC it. Its main purpose, though, is to provide a decoy for people to hit without forethought of taking a s.fp/rh from Chang. This move in particular does that best, as Choi can launch himself onto attacks anywhere on the screen.
QCF, HCB+P- this can be comboed from a c.strong/c.forward/c.fierce/s.forward/close s.rh. Use those to combo into his Lv.3 version if you can. In A, dont bother.
HCBx2+ K- If theyre almost dead and they dont have access to an AC, you can use this on them in the corner to chip them to death, at least. Its useless otherwise.
Changs A-Groove combo:
Activate CC, [close s.fierce x2, s.strong]x2, s.forward x 16, c.forward, c.fierce XX QCF, HCB+P
It is highly recommended that Chang be played in a rolling groove. A-Grooves perhaps the best choice for him. What makes him so scary is that he can keep people out for as long as he wants, until he decides to get in himself, hammering away with his long-range pokes and setting them up for mistakes with Choi (Gcing them in the process). To top it off, Chang does immense damage, and his CC does more damage than any of his Lv.3s. Any other groove for Chang will have to be either C or N; C for the added bonus of air-blocking, N for running (which I prefer) and low-jumping. What it boils down to is that Chang MUST have the ability to RC. If youre not using him in any of these grooves, youre simply not using Chang.
Feel free to correct me on any of this.
Whew,. damn, now that I look at all this. why the fuck CAN’T more people use Chang?
Just thought I’d add more to these.
His s.forward’s used in much the same way.
This is because Chang suffers from the same problem as Dhalsim- when he’s too close, his j.fierce and s.fierce may miss. I really should’ve noted this before.
Whoops, sorry. On grounded opponents, you can use this if you’re too close to hit with j.fierce.
Another thing: Choi’s attacks are negated if either he, or Chang, gets hit. But if they jump in, and you block an attack after Chang’s thumb-up pose, Choi will still hit them with either of these. HCF+K works great against cross-ups, too, BTW (as if THAT were easy on Chang).
Well, I actually take that back. If you use the RH version, Choi will keep running until he reaches them before doing his slash, and the lighter versions will make him stop at a pre-designated distance. You can alternate between these, so it’s, at least, a more useful anti-air than I imagined. Not that you really need to, but, you could throw this in if you want to be unpredictable (Dang, Chang’s got mix-ups for everything!).
Actually, this isn’t so bad, as it chips away at their gaurd meter, most important of all. Chang does have incredible GCing ability, and this could prove to be a nice supplement, given that Chang recovers BEFORE Choi finishes. I still wouldn’t go beyond using it at Lv.1, though.
Cheap Chang tricks( ):
Basic Chang trap:… knock down in the corner, lk spinning choi, j.HKXXHP spinning ball. Crushes 3/4 guard meter. If they get hit cancel immediately and reset the trap. When you have a lvl1 built up, knock down and do choi hurricane (in the corner only).
Command grab: s.LK ticked into command grab is easy since you don’t even have to move forward like a normal tick throw.
AA: Jump back HP is his best option, but if they’re too close you’ll have to settle for c.HP or just block…
I agree not a lot of people use Chang. I guess they think he’s too slow. Anyways I’ve done that cornering trick many times and it works. I also find that opponets will not block his ground ball trip. Thanks Kataklysmic and pain definetly use these strats next time I go to the arcade.
Chang AA setup:
Great vs DP/Wake up Super happy opponents.
On the knockdown, do the ppppppppp chain whirly, then stop, activate.
Great Chang example is on an NEC trailer Ino used in NEC vs Ricky O. you can get it on direct connect .
Chang does bad against S-Groovers, his moves are way to laggy, can i get some tips against them? Chang does good against Cammy,Blanka,Sagat,Sakura,Bison, but i suggest you go use a Roll groove against Roll groove Sakura.
I think Chang’s best grooves are
K and N are tied because you may have trouble against fireball characters, and N has roll, so roll cancel, and they both have run.
A is second because his CC is Damaging. Though Chang is great at gaurd crushing, there is allways someone better than you who can get around this, and you might not get this GC consistantly.
You should put chang in R1 or R2. i personally go Cammy/Kyo/ChangR2 in K groove, I put him last because he’s matched up with bison, and i’d perfer someone with tons and tons of life and power who matches up good/well against Bison, but you can place him anywhere in your order.
Chang’s strength is that you can play aggresively but still stay safe. He’s also very easy to pick up. Hell, my joystick was broken and the first time i picked up Chang was at an arcade, and he did pretty well. Now my stick isn’t broken, so now i can practice him.
Chang’s weakness, maybe it’s his matchups against some people. Fireballs don’t really hurt chang, but it slows him down just a little bit. I really don’t know his worst matchups, but i know that Claw Vega and Dhalsim played correctly are bad matchups.
I don’t think that corner trap with Chang’s spinning ball is that effective. They can still hit you out of hit in between each ball swing, so I don’t use it. If I wanted to GC people in the corner, I could just do HCB+K, c.mk, then s.hp/hk. And if they roll, you know what to do…
Personally, I’ve done good against several Sagats and Blankas with Chang, and a few Cammys and Chuns. S-Groove might give him problems; the only S I’ve lost badly too was Doc B’s. After playing at Newpark yesterday, though, I’m starting to think he loses to good P-Grooves as well. Chang has lots of opportunities to hit people out of the air, but with parrying, it seems to backfire on him worse than any other character.
Oh, one more thing: RC HCB+K can hit Blanka balls.
I hate to flame, but I can’t see any way to not be cheap with Chang. All you have to do is button-mash and you’ve given even the best players a run for their money.
Do you even play CvS2?
Do you think I would be here if I didn’t?
I’ve seen it done.
Chang corners, spins ball around, and there’s very little you can do.
Seriously, even if Chang does manage to get close enough when he’s got them cornered (as any good Chang player would do), he can get DPed, Supered, or ACed out of his ball easily. I tried it before, and I’ve seen THAT done. Many times. Even the friggin’ CPU catches on.
EDIT: I will give you this, though. It does add more to the “inexperience-against” factor that Chang has going for him, so I take it back. It is definitely not unstoppable or anywhere NEAR cheap, but like most of Chang’s tricks, not many would realize that and just eat up the gaurd damage. Thing is, you really gotta work your ass off to get them in the corner and make them block. It’s not as easy as you make it sound. And this is CvS2; button-mashing and CvS2 don’t mix.
I’ve been playing a lot of K-Chang lately, and now I have a change of opinion. Just a few more things from my original post that I want to correct:
I found that RCs aren’t actually necessary if you want to play Chang well, after all. I’m sorry for placing so much emphasis on it. It’s still a very good supplement, and it does make him more dangerous if you can RC everything he has (except his B, F+P), but you hardly need it. In fact, you hardly need to roll, which you probably shouldn’t do anyway since Chang has the worst roll in the game. Now with that said-
Running is still necessary if you want to better your offense, and low-jumping too. You add more to the pressure and mad damage by throwing out Choi and rushing in with hard attacks. Without either of these, you’re pretty much stuck turtling and throwing Choi out as bait for a Super/CC/throw/etc, which probably won’t happen if they know when not to roll, or if they don’t have rolling at all.
I don’t know if I said this before, but alternate between the three HCB+Ks and DP+Ks to hit people out of the air.
If they’re too close and all else fails, keep charging back and hit F+P when they jump in (Yep, I’ve been seriously undermining his autogaurd move).
I use the Chang trap more and more now. I haven’t done it with too much success before, but I realized you don’t need to jump in after Choi’s HCB+K. Just mash right into the ball on recovery. It’s still rollable, but if they try that shit, just hold back on the joystick and knock them back.
Another thing to note about S-Groove: Since Chang’s attacks have so much lag, the ideal thing for an S player would be to dodge constantly and counter him. Rush in, but when you see them dodge, don’t get reckless by sticking something out. Just try to be more patient; that way they’ll do something and leave themselves open.
Best grooves for chang:
A and K hands down. He has one of the easiest and most damaging Customs in the game, and in he does massive damage when raged. a simple 2 hit combo when raged does more damage than most lvl 1 supers.
then comes C: since he has hop dash and air block
P: hop dash and airblock
N: his worst. all he has is short jump roundhouse. He doesn’t need run or need to roll, since his roll sucks.
Watching Kat play the Chang trap on a number of people with some success, even against S-Groove, it helps to move Chang further out so the tip of his ball barely hits the opponent caught in the trap in order to reduce the chance of getting slammed by a VERY well timed dragon punch or a good Alpha Counter.
However, I did see A-Sakura roll out of it once Kat moved out to this distance and throw his Chang.
Probably a fluke, but the number of people who die to this trap alone is amazing.
What easier way can Chang keep the pressure on without running? His roll sucks, but it gives him the added benefit of RC Choi and RC Ball. N’s the only one that allows him to use both. Plus, you can just break stock and add more damage to your hits that way. It may not be his best groove, but his worst? No.
Chang and Athena are my 2 main characters in CvS2. However Chang seems to do terrible against opponents who do a lot of poke string.
I came to the conclusion that K is his worse groove, except if you are hell good at “just defence”. And I really mean hell good. It is really hard to play Chang against people (and that’s pretty much anyone who is not a scrub like me) who like to poke string a lot. You cannot get out because his anti air sucks, and he has no quick retalition moves. I got beaten almost perfect against any character who just rushes.
And that even include shotos crossjumping all day long. I am serious… non stop. j.MK, jMK… do that 100 times, watch your guard break goes to 0 and no idea how to counter the shoto.
Vega (LK move forward)*infinity is also a problem… god every opponent I have face is a problem!!
Chun-li is probably the worse. She can crossjump all day long, does a series of pokes and breaks my guard all day long without giving Chang a chance to even hit her back.
But that’s my impression. If you have an idea how to beat any character, in particular Chun-li, that plays poke strings a lot, let me know.
What are his poke strings if your opponent is not in the corner?
Is there a way to do the spinning ball and cancel really really quick like Blanka electricity thingy? You know… spinning… cancel… spinning… cancel… but very fast
K is Chang’s best groove. Japanese and gay people from California play Chang in K.
Dumb expected question: WHY? Just because some jap and US people use it in K mode doesn’t mean much without explication. In my experience, he seems to be better in C, N, or S mode.
And someone, please… answer my questions.