Combos in general. Am I missing something?

sakura

#1

I’m spending more and more time trying to refine my chains / links etc. I’ve never really been that informed about the general terms, I finally found out the other day (litterally 5 days ago) what the hell the difference between chains and links are, and that you can’t do specials from chains, yeah yeah, noob I know. But anyway the more I know the higher my execution rate has been. But sitting in training mode, I don’t understand why the same motion I would use to lets say :df: c.:mk: :db::df::hp: to link c.mk to hp shouken; but when I add c.:lp::lp: to it, it just doesnt want to come out, and if it does, maybe 30% of the time, is there a change in the timing or some other game mechanic that im not thinking about?

I’m frustrated because I can do this cross j.:lk:c.:lk:c.:lp:c.:hp::lk:tatsu, c.:mk::hp:shouken 60% of the time but i can only get c.:lp::lp::df:c.:mk::db::df::hp:shouken to connect 30% of the time.

Thanks in advance guys,


#2

Putting those images in kinda confuses me :stuck_out_tongue:

As for the c.MK xx Shou link combo you can replace the c.MK with c.LK to make things easier if you want. Also s.LP x2 > c.MK xx Shou is a bit easier to do as well since the s.LP gives you an extra frame to work with (only works on standing opponents in general).


#3

There are two ways you can do that combo. If you were to write that combo out using the proper terminology it would be :
cr.LP, cr.LP, cr.MK xx shouoken -or-
cr.LP xx cr.LP, cr.MK xx shouoken

So the key point is that you’re cancelling the cr.MK into the shouoken, for that you MUST link the 2nd cr.LP into the cr.MK. This is the fundamental rule of the game engine that you’re missing. You can only cancel a normal move into a special if you have linked into that normal.


#4

Im just going by what some of the Dallas guys have told me, I was told when you connect c.mk it will always be a link, regardless of me chaining the two jabs,

So from what your saying I have to link the jab as well as the c.mk to connect the shouken?


#5

No that’s not the case.

Are you getting the c.MK to link but the Shououken not coming out? - input error
Or is the c.MK not coming out but Shououken does? - link error, too soon with c.MK
Or does the c.MK get blocked and cancel into Shououken? - link error, too late with c.MK

Also Radar I think the “correct” terminology for a link is an arrow ‘>’ :stuck_out_tongue:


#6

the way andrew had told me is the first one you posted, cr.LP, cr.LP, cr.MK xx shouoken


#7

I was being wiki compliant :wink:

EDIT: Yeah it doesn’t matter if you link or chain the jabs - the only important bit is the link between the cr.LP, cr.MK. What your friends probably meant by “it’s always a link” is that you have to link it - but of course you can still stuff it up. :wink: Sugami outlined all the errors you can have above - head into training mode, set the dummy to auto-block and then see what’s going wrong.


#8

My main question is, why is it when I do just DF c.MK DB DF HP the crouching medium kick will come out and connect with the hp shouken, but when I do DF cr.LP cr.LP, D cr.MK DF HP either A) i get the two hit combo then the MK comes out to the shouken (MK too slow) B) 2 hit combo from the jabs and then the shouken comes out (MK too fast)’

I can do it from the standing position all day long, but when crouching it just will rarely come out @_@


#9

^this. the c.LP, c.LP, c.MK xx shouoken should work every time otherwise your timing for the c.LP > c.MK link is just off.

However, if you want to do c.LP, c.LP, c.LP xx shouoken, the last c.LP has to be a link in order for the shouoken to come out


#10

You just answered your own question there. Links are tricky - they take lots of practice so don’t expect it all to work perfectly straight off the bat.


#11

its impossible to chain a weaker attack into a stronger attack. its always a link. so him using any jab into c.mk, is 100% always a link.

chain = cancelling recovery of a move into another move to make a combo
link = you cannot interrupt the recovery frames of the first attack. you have to fully let the move finish recovering before you are able to combo into the next attack with careful timing.

sf4 has no chains except weak attacks chaining into other weak attacks(which is how it is in pretty much every sf game ever. and ken has the s.strong,s.fierce chain. thats it.


#12

to comment the quote, so basicly on the 2 hit combo, if it ends there my link to mk is off, and if i get stuffed at a 3 hit combo, my input into the shouken is either A wrong, or B to slow?

yeah, thanks guys, i was over thinking the logic of the combo lol. after sitting the last hour in training mode, ive concluded that my dp motions were just not fast enough, cr.lp cr lp > cr.mk come out 95% of the time now, so im just working on when and how fast to input the dp. or is there a better way or approaching this.

And damn it, im so embarassed that I don’t know any of this jazz, well until just recently =( at least my not half bad sakura should only move forward with understanding of the game mechanics @_@ how the hell did I get by playing cvs2 and 3s not knowing any of this…


#13

Alrighty guys I got a video uploading, take a look, and i need to see what you guys have to say, if I can do that, I should in theory do the exact same thing except with cr.lp cr.lp > cr.mk xx hp shouken yeah?

[media=youtube]bmxTVBjYU0Y[/media]


#14

Try 3 punches. I can do s.Jab c.Jab s.Jab -> c.Forward -> Shoryu all the time. Hell, it’s even won me a round in tournament play :tup:

Also, Ryu’s hitbox is weird and is not the standard for practice. http://forums.shoryuken.com/showpost.php?p=7312900&postcount=48 Unless you’re going to use the s.Forward -> short.Hurricane loops, pick a character like Abel or Balrog at first to practice your combos against.


#15

It’s not the DP motion if the c.MK either doesn’t combo or doesn’t come out at all, you’re just not timing that link correctly.

And gwah at linking c.MK after Light Shunpuu x_x? c.HP link is a 1-framer, c.MK is a frame slower so that shouldn’t be possible brain explodes

s.LP gives you one more frame of advantage than c.LP =) But from jump-ins you want to start with c.LK to force them to block low. You could do c.LK > s.LP (x2) > c.MK xx Shou but that won’t work on most (if not all) crouching opponents :frowning:


#16

That’s actually my block string that I confirm into c.Forward -> Shoryu o.o; There are rare occasions that I mess up whatever spacing and c.Short c.Jab c.Jab comes out where the 2nd c.Jab whiffs, then I just throw =\ But it is possible to also link c.Forward -> Shoryu off c.Short c.Jab c.Jab. :tup:

And I’m pretty sure the only way that combo is working is because of a specific distance. Unless I’m reading the frame data wrong (and I could be~).


#17

weird, that c.mk is technically not supposed to link after the LK.tatsu lol.

LK.tatsu gives you +4 on hit, and c.MK has 5 frame start-up o.O


#18

Actually, to be specific, that’s not a chain. Those special chains are called Target Combo’s. Many characters have them (Guile c.mk > s.mp for instance). Chun has several, can’t recall who else has some.


#19

im so beast, i can make shit up and itll connect, but i cant do standard stuff thats suppose to gg =( <- i kid i kid, my sakura blows @_@

well on a note this is why i was getting frustrated, I can do that combo more times then I can do that stupid cr.lp cr.lp > cr.mk xx hp shouken =( sigh and now that I know its not even suppose to connect make me even more frustrated. Why can I feel confident doing shit that isnt even suppose to connect while I suffer on combos that should @_@ /wrists

I stumbled upon this combo after i was able to hit the c.mk so i was like hey Obey beats my face in with c.mk to hp shouken all the time it should connect. this was about a week or so ago. and so I thought it would be a good combo to get better at since its good damage with no use of EX bar not to mention it nearly fills an ex bar.


#20

Can you do c.LK/c.LP > c.LP > c.MK on its own? Practice doing it without the Shououken and then you can start tagging the Shououken on the end.

Or if you want to sacrifice damage for reliablility use a c.LK instead of c.MK, it gives you an extra two frames and is safer because of its ability to chain will mean that if you’re too early all that’ll happen is the c.LK will come out without a Shou.

You could also try to train yourself to hit both LK and MK for the link, that way you get best of both worlds. I do the same for Seth’s c.LK > c.LP > c.MP.