Competitive or not

As I read on many other boards, there are a lot of people who say brawl isn’t really competitive, or much less than melee. The speed of the game and the less mechanical skill needed is under heavy criticism, although the community seems bigger. What do you think about this? Is brawl more or less competitive as melee was/is? What brings the future? Many games hyped soon and dropped later on, because there was no real skill needed to master it - as it seems with brawl. Will that game last for long or will it only be a hotshot that drops quick?

And whats the deal with the items: A whole bunch of people hate them, and many many tournaments are without a single one. On the other side, the evolution even allows smash balls - do they tear the community apart? Personally, I like to play with items though some of them sucks (pokeball for example). What do you think about this? Are they neede for competitive play, or should they be banned to ensure that only pure characterskill decides?

personally Im not taking Brawl seriously, there are just too many glaring balance problems to justify sinking more time into it than is necessary. its really fun and I like it better than melee since there are more characters and far less broken stuff people like to claim give it a “competitive edge” when really all theyre doing is hitting the trigger buttons really fast. I actually prefer this engine over melees, since there are few combos I have to be on my toes instead of just hitting the same sequence of buttons for a combo.

as for items, in casuals (which is all the time) I prefer items off, since it just character vs character, a battle of wits, etc. but in say, a tournament I kinda prefer items on so I at least have a chance of getting through the sea of snakes and metaknights. although that could backfire on me just as badly.

What I’ve never understood is the extremes mindset everyone has with items. Items are perfectly competitive, but not everyone likes them. However, that doesn’t mean that items off has to be the only competitive option. Likewise, items on doesn’t mean there has to be no items off tournaments or games, or even that all of the items have to be on.

There doesn’t have to be a divide at all. And the assertion that things have to be One Way Only with Smash, especially in professional tournaments, bothers me.

it’s not and there isn’t much question about it. very few good players even like this game and its only played for the $ since its new and a scrub magnet.

IMO Brawl is not very competitive. And to hell with items.

Personally, I’d say Brawl is a very competitive game.
Even though there are SOME things that don’t require much skill, others require a LOT of skill.

For example, de-syncing with IC’s is VERY difficult to do.
Actually de-syncing itself is not at all hard to do, but using it effectively in chain grabbing and combos is about as hard as all of the advanced techs in melee.

Even Pit can be used competitively.
(I’ve seen it… No arrow spamming!!!)
All of the people that I know who play Brawl play it as religiously and competitively as they played melee.

And as for items, I don’t really think they’re that unfair, or unbalanced, except for a select few, but everybody can use them, so it’s not really that big of a deal.
But, I myself, prefer to play without the items, because they annoy me.

This game has the potential to be competitive, but I’m just waiting for something major to happen so more characters can be able to be in tournaments. For now the “Secular Seven” will probably dominate the tournament scene for a while. If you main a character that’s mid/low tier then good luck. I really don’t like the lack of hitstun in this game. Snake reminds me of 3S Chun, and she just pisses me off :rofl:

I think its a huge improvement over melee. I hated the emphasis on mechanical glitches and pressing bunch of buttons in a short time to be good type gameplay in melee. Brawl is a more purist game imo without relying on all that bs.

I won’t really be swayed one way or the other about it’s “competitiveness” with regard to Melee. I don’t even remotely care about the loss of WD. Dash dancing is a fierce loss, but manageable - shit, even trip isn’t that detrimental.

Bottom line: it’s not nearly as fun to play or watch.

Playing Brawl and taking a break to go back to melee is pretty ridiculous.

Especially going from Brawl C.Falcon to Melee C.Falcon.

Recovery was waaay more difficult and I think that added to the competitiveness because there was pretty technical things you could do off the edge, (wall tech meteor recovery) that, and fucking hell it was faster. Playing against Falco is still kinda rape for me, I never got too into melee beyond casuals.

Brawl can still be competitive but it’s pretty shallow. Melee was more shallow than say, ST but at least it had combos.

Brawl is a lot more fun in FFA than melee ever was though, because with the easier recovery people feel less ripped off when they are knocked out of the game early. I think in FFA even novices and “experts” can fight on even ground.

I personally enjoy this game more than melee since the game to me feels more about yomi skills over combo skills. Even most of the combo skills in brawl require you to read your opponent to pull off.

Maybe it’s because I play Guilty Gear so my need for big combo’s are fulfilled in another game.

Competitiveness is defined by the amount of shine combo’s falco has, obviously.

:rock: FUCK YEAH!
No, but seriously? Yes, Brawl is a competition-worthy title. I believe that Melee, as many have already stated, placed far too much emphasis on using technical prowess to compensate for a lack of analytical skill. That’s just one girl’s opinion though. I’m not saying it’s a fact.

Here’s how you determine if a game is competitive:

Does the better player always win?

Do mind games and out thinking the opponent play an important part in determining the winner?

Can most of the cast compete / is there anything super broken about the game that limits character selection?

Honestly, Brawl has all this. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. EXECUTION SHOULD NOT PLAY A ROLE IN DETERMINING IF A GAME IS COMPETITIVE OR NOT. In fact, easier execution is better. The better strategic mind / creative thinker SHOULD win. Not the guy that practiced the broke shit in training mode his entire life. Hell, if you can be a better player than someone and then lose because someone knew some esoteric tech shit that you didn’t know, I think that makes for a worse game. I think fighting games should be about mind vs mind. Your ability to execute should not come into play. For example, I love guilty gear. I think it’s a great game, but I hate that the execution barrier has kept so many people from playing it. I’d happily give up all my hard shit that I can do execution wise if it meant more people would play the game.

So in short, yes Brawl is competitive. What you’re hearing is backlash from the whiners who miss Melee and were too used to how that game worked.

augh…we’re never gonna get away from this fucking argument…I’d rep you for your post xsamuraix if I could.

LOL this is one of the dumbest posts in the history of internet message boards.:rofl:

Brawl is competitive so everyone stop bitching and step your game up.

Close this dumbass thread plz.

Meh, I guess you can take it competitively. I don’t really find it fun competitively long term though.

That’s my big complaint. Were it not for that, I’d REALLY love Brawl. As it is, I like to play it when I’ve humans to play against. Low hit stun makes other problems seem trivial; getting punished for hitting is FAR too possible.

I do think Brawl is competitive, and while Melee may turn out in the long run to be a better game, you bastards aren’t giving Brawl a chance.

What can you get punished for hitting with in Brawl? You just get another guessing game when you hit. I mean hell, crouch canceling made hitting people unsafe in melee. I don’t see how it’s different.

Yeah, combos would be cool. They’re still sort of there, you just have to work harder for them now =/

That’s my big complaint. Were it not for that, I’d REALLY love Brawl. As it is, I like to play it when I’ve humans to play against. Low hit stun makes other problems seem trivial; getting punished for hitting is FAR too possible.

I do think Brawl is competitive, and while Melee may turn out in the long run to be a better game, you bastards aren’t giving Brawl a chance.