Crown 303A Microswitches (Different @ Etokki vs Focus Attack)


#1

Wasn’t sure whether or not the 303A/303-FK has the Gersung or Matsushita microswitches. On Focus Attack they say Gersung, on Etokki they say Matsushita…

I’ve heard there’s not a different. I’ve heard Matsushita switches are ass. I guess it’s hard to quantify this kind of thing other than maybe throw or force but I haven’t been able to find those figures.

I’ve also heard the 303A/FK are spring tension but I thought they were rubber/spring hybrids as stated on Focus Attack.

Focus Attack 303A
http://www.focusattack.com/crown-303-fk-korean-joystick-clear-white/

Etokki 303A
http://etokki.com/Arcade-Joysticks/Crown-CWJ-303A-Clear-White


#2

Matsushita work, but they’re not high quality. They’re messy looking lowish quality switches. I even think Zippy are much nicer as far as build quality is concerned. However, they still work, the low quality workmanship is mostly cosmetic, they’re frankly ugly ass switches, lol.

I’d trust eTokki. They’ve handled the sticks for ages. If it says what it says on eTokki, then I’d assume that’s how stock Korean sticks should be. Keep in mind that the different model designations may simply be the switches. As you can clearly see from the image on FA, the 303-fk has a rubber grommet. I’m not sure why a stick would need both a spring and grommet. Oh well.


#3

The image shows it has Gersung switches installed.

It’s probable that FA are selling an altered version. Gersung switches are the ones on Myoungshin Fanta Stick (I believe).


#4

Gersung (defult on TaeYoungFanta) is only one good switch from korea- high activation point, nice clic, simillar to Omron/Microyamatace

all koran stick have weak diagonal and slow engage
corresponding switch will help
matsushita is fine but not on K-stick have lower activation point than Omron.
you can curve lever and it helps

true - zippy is an ordinary trash, this switch use every china factory in clon iL buttons for 0,5$
4me it is unbelievable that vendors offer them in bulk or kit as a replacement Omron/Matsushita
zippy silent kit Jesus… this switch is not silent only have extremaly low O.F.
many low O.F is quieter than 100-200g and is normal this switch destroy fell on JP/korea sticks


#5

I can not speak to other vendors but all the Korean sticks currently in our store have Gersung which is the higher quality of the micros.

Most manufacturers offer different options on the sticks. IL does this with all their joysticks. Vendors can pick up cheaper parts, and still sell a name brand by using lower quality micros. It’s factory original, just the low end model.

curving actuators can help with direct actuation but it will also distort the diagonals. Increasing the actuator size is the easiest way to adjust for switches with low actuation points.

Zippy switches are in a few varieties. Just like every other company they offer many different models, at many different quality levels. Also like most other things, Zippy has been cloned by other Chinese companies. The company Zippy is actually a Taiwanese company, which tends to have better design controls and reliability than mainland China. Happ’s standard switch is specified as an E-switch or a Zippy now.

Zippy switches are not the default switch put on most cheap buttons from China, most wholesalers over there actually go one step further down the food chain and use a red and black or blue and black microswitch called King or some other name. Most Chinese buttons come from wholesalers with 125 gram micros installed. Playing with with those is a work out.

In regard to offering them as a product, most vendors selling to the mame or classic community offer Zippy or E-switch, which are about the same. Zippys and E-switch’s have become the standard micro for almost all Happ/IL style buttons now, whether from China or not. Cherry has made themselves almost unapproachable. We have tried to make deals with them but they insist on 10k minimum orders at over 1.50 per micro in that kind of bulk. This is sad because they don’t need to be restrictive in distribution and they are a better quality switch.

In regards to the silent nature, it is do to a lower operating force so the “snap” in the snap action switch is much quieter, hence silent. As a vendor I provide options that customers ask for, people asked for kits so I offered them, that is the nature of capitalism.


#6

I actually received a 303-FK from FocusAttack the other day. The serial on the microswitches is as it says on that page: GSM-V0323A3.

On a Myoungshin Fanta I have the serial is GSM-V1623A3. These switches also have a lot more printed on them (logos and other numbers mostly). Dunno what this means really, maybe this info means something to you though.


#7

Probably Gersung then.


#8

That’s a Gersung model.


#9

Armi, for me reading this is a waste of time.
is a poor excuse.
e-switch have worst quality
I’ve seen
this is not low-end swicth, only sub-low-end swicth
First rule, do no harm.


#10

the ones i got from etokki have an RU logo printed backwards and an M


#11

@Kowal, may be a language barrier, but I am not defending E-switch, we agree, E-switch are poor quality. However that is the standard now in the US for Happ buttons.
This is part of the reason we carry IL and not Happ.


#12

I received a 303-FK today. I’ll confirm a few things in this thread.

The 303-FK has Gersung switches. If you remove one it has Gersung molded on the other side. The stuff printed on it just the stuff like amperage and all that.

The 303-FK has a spring indeed. I’m not sure if this is how all K sticks are designed. However, the difference here is the spring isn’t used for any type of tension, it’s simply used to keep the rubber grommet in place by adding tension behind the rubber grommet and the plastic housing. It does not affect the tension of the actual stick’s motions in any sort of way, it’s 100% all rubber grommet for that. It is certainly not a hybrid spring/grommet stick.

Focus Attack is wrong about that hybrid thing, and should update their page accordingly.

Update: Not all K sticks have springs. @CUTWEST confirmed his first K stick didn’t have a spring but his current one does. See above why this doesn’t matter anyway.


#13

it depends on the series/year. my first k-sticks (5y ago) have spring only on 305 and he had best dynamic.
rubber grommet is the same in many models.
spring is not needed, but it helps
better to buy sticks with spring, you can always remove it.
spring increased pressure only 20-50g


#14

Hi Moonchilde,

Thanks for bringing this to my attention. I agree that we misspoke regarding a “hybrid” spring tension system. The 303-N does not come with a spring, but the CWJ-303A does. As a result, so do the 303-FK joysticks. In any case, I’ll revise the listing so others aren’t mistaken by the spring’s actual use.

I won’t pretend to know everything about some of the products we offer. The Crown joysticks - based on a product suggestion forum that we ran back in 2012 - ranked highest next to some other products we are releasing. It’s helpful to get insight into some of the internals by those same players that asked for it. You and others in the FGC were around far longer than I, so I appreciate the corrections.

We’re looking to offer Matsushita switches for those who would like to purchase them. Over time, we’ll look into expanding the types of switches offered for fasten type joysticks like the 303-FK.


#15

Has anyone here actually opened a 303N? It is identical to the 303A on the inside. It does have a spring in it.


#16

I have opened the 303-N. A few notes:

Our first shipment of the 303-FK arrived, and upon inspection, didn’t have a spring. At the time, Crown did not provide the springs. We realized that something was missing upon internal review of ETokki’s CWJ-303A. We asked our supplier to get the springs, and installed them directly into each 303-FK joystick. The 303-N was also without a spring. We don’t have those installed, but the rubber tension piece is intact.

Given the notes by Moonchilde, the rubber tension system is most essential. Tests of the 303-N without the spring showed no unexpected behavior during play.

So we have the 303-FK and CWJ-303A. At this time, the main difference is microswitch. CWJ-303A has Matsushita, and 303-FK has Gersung. The advantage of fasten-type switches - to my knowledge - is that they are interchangeable. Some may prefer Matsushita, and some may like Gersung. Others like Zippy, and the list goes on. The 303-FK represents the first fastener type joystick in our store because most have installed 5-pin into arcade joysticks, which is what we currently specialize in. I will try to get each of those switches for players to try out.

I’m certainly willing to learn more about the benefits of these joysticks, switches and more. From there, we can offer more of the items you want.


#17

Maybe its the difference in the supplier then? All the 303N and 303A I got from etokki were identical with exception of the mircoswitches. I have no idea what this FK model is.


#18

303-FK - according to our suppliers - is the official name Crown provided for the joystick. CWJ-303A is specifically branded by ETokki.

I asked our suppliers if Matsushita could be installed directly. It can, but the cost is higher than the Gersung simply because Matsushita is a Japanese product, and Crown has to import it. Korean Gersung is regarded highly by most, and is essentially what is used in authentic Korean joysticks like the Myoungshin Fanta stick that ETokki offers. Instead, we can provide Matsushita microswitches separately to customers that want it, or believe that Matsushita is better than Gersung.


#19

It’s always funny how things go full circle, these stick feel more like a Wico stick than any modern joystick I have played with.

There are two key factors with microswitches, actuation point and activation force. The force will cause changes to the feel and the actuation point changes to the way they play.
Our ls32 mod kit will work ith these joysticks. Zippy’s tend to have a very light actuation force (20-50g) but lower actuation point. Cherry switches tend to have a higher (more sensitive) with 75g actuation force. Omron snap action have a higher actuation point while d2rv micros have a lower point both with 100-200g actuation force.

I will bring some choices to Evo for people to test who are there. A good spreadsheet of details on actuation point and force might be helpful to. I can’t remember if Kowal has that, either way I can do some testing and let people know.