Defending against rushdowns


#1

I’m a Vega player and I have a lot of trouble when people put a lot of offensive pressure on me. As soon as anyone plays an aggressive offense I almost always lose. I especially struggle if people jump in on me a lot because I can’t find a reliable anti-air. If I’m charged I’ll flip kick and s.HK seems to work as long as they aren’t jumping in deep. I also try to air throw whenever I can anticipate a jump. Even while I do this I always seem to lose to jump ins. Anyone have some advice to keep them on the ground and at mid range footsies?


#2

Just to verify, this is for SF4 right?


#3

I’d bet my life on it


#4

Chip damage. Run to the other side of the stage once you have a small life lead. Jump over fireballs or do that KKK thing. Block and tech.


#5

reacting on defense gets rid of probability and is probably the best method for defense. Study patterns but react for the counter. If you study the patterns but dedicate on the counter, you can be easily setup which is why reacting is so beneficial.

when you have a character with bad AA, there a few substitute methods. For one, if you constantly mixup your positioning, it will be exponentially harder for your opponent to judge your range and properly use a jump in. When you play this out right, you can get the opponent out of position. You can also try to walk\dash into your characters best AA angle. Instead of baiting the jump and AA-ing from that angle, you can bait the jump and walk\dash into your best hit box positioning. There are also jumping AA’s which win in different situations. Some characters have the benefit of having 1 reliable AA, others have to use multiple methods to create an AA from multiple angles. I don’t know how good claws AA’s are but this method seems universal as you can apply it to most 2d games.


#6

With Vega, you need to initiate the pressure yourself and never let your opponent start up pressure against you. This is more of a situation where Vega himself doesn’t have good answers to the problem and the solution is to actually just avoid the problem itself. You’re already using pretty much all the tools Vega has for anti air anyway (s.hk, scarlet terror, and air throw). You can try jump forward/back hp and neutral jump hk as well.

For mid range footsies, use c.mk, c.mp and s.hk. Those will be your main tools. c.mk can be linked into s.hk on hit which is really helpful, or linked into c.mp ex Izuna drop for some nice midrange combos. If you work on your charging, you should be able to repeat c.mp, jab rolling crystal flash. It gets you some nice chip damage and is safe on block, but don’t abuse it too much as it can actually be escaped and punished by holding up-back.

The only way I’ve really found to get people to stop jumping is to use scarlet terror after blocked rolling crystal flashes. Its not a stable strategy by any means, but it can help to keep your opponent grounded.


#7

Isn’t his j.hk a good air to air as well? The one where he flips backwards is what I mean.

But yeah, just know how your opponent’s attacks work, and then figure out what you have that beats it. There’s a chance you won’t always have good options though, seeing as you’re playing vega :confused:


#8

You can’t expect to be able to never be rushed by your opponent. Sometimes you will just get killed, too. You’re Vega. Here’s what I would keep in mind though:
down+forward HK is one of your best offensive tools, but if you use it and they try to cross you up, you’re also gonna dodge right under them, which is great.
Same for the down+HK slide, although it should be used less. Also try staying within poke range and walking under jumps. Other than that, use neutral jump HK to anti-air. Sometimes you just have to block, though.

Learn to crouch tech:http://www.shoryuken.com/entry.php?b=252
And don’t be afraid to spam backdash and focus backdash away from jump-ins.


#9

First off, yes its SF4. Thanks guys, I think thats gonna help my game a lot. I’ve tried using j.HP before and I always seem to wiff or hit on its startup frames. Is j.HK more reliable? Does it have good priority?


#10

I started using cast recently, before I was set on using a few characters. After struggling through charge characters I have come to find that rushdowns against them can be a bit difficult. But the end result is determined by creativity and practice. By finding what works all around and playing as many people as possible. The majority perfer to counter before contact is made by an a rushdown character, what works for me is inviting them in and then catching them in a pattern. It may not work for you, but by giving the bait I can cause them to slip up and lessen the chance of constant pressure.

I hope that helps.


#11

1.) to play vega you need to know 90% - 100 % of the match up
2.) know what beat what and have a punisher for whiff or block attack
3.) i think people are still sleeping on vega
4.) the way you start your offense is VERY important against (Blanka, Ryu, Rog etc)
5.) who do u have problem with the most
6.) use the character u have problem with to understand how he or she attack know what punishable

  • if they make vega any strong in ssf4 I WILL BE INVISIBLE haha*

#12

You’re playing Vega =\

If you get matched up against a good Rufus, Ryu, Akuma, Sagat, any top tier char, you’re going to have to avoid getting trapped in the corner, throw set ups, and you’re gonna have to work very hard for the win.

Also note, take advantage of Vega’s dash in kara throw, its one of the best in the game and will take alot of people by surprise because of its range.


#13

Neutral jump hk is a good anti air (the aerial backflip), jump forward/back hk is passable. j.hp has a really odd hitbox that can hit by Vega’s shoulder if you time it correctly (think Cable’s j.lp if you’ve played MvC2). One other option I forgot to mention earlier is backdash. Vega has a really good backdash. Coupled with KKK and PPP (which should be used much less often), you can at least dodge some wakeup meaties on yourself.

Another note about keeping offense up with Vega is knowing how to pressure/punish against fireballs. Walldives build meter and dodge fireballs, while your EX drill and EX rolling crystal flash will pass right through them (as well as Ultra).

For Vega, the best defense is a good offense.


#14

Just patiently block. A lot of people get counterhit too often because they try to mash light punches into the opponents’ blockstring. That’s just what he wants you to do. Like, when Ryu jumps in on your wakeup, does cr.mp, waits a little bit, then does cr.mp again - just block it. Some do not realize that you don’t actually lose that much health when blocking patiently. However, you WILL lose a lot of health if you desperately try to get out all the time. As Mariodood said, learn late crouch teching. And as soon as you tech a throw, you’re most likely not in a disadvantageous position anymore and can just cr.mp -> FBA to the other side of the screen or safely backdash to gain some distance and make yourself some room.

Also, always keep in mind that this game isn’t really that rush-down friendly. It is really hard to rush down with a character like Ryu or something. As for me, I only really fear characters with command throws/divekicks or guaranteed mixups. The rest of the characters aren’t really that scary.

Now for anti-air. There are a lot of solutions to this: J.mp, j.mk, j.hp, nj.hk. All of them work. Push the button AS SOON as you get off the ground. Also, a lot of people seem to forget j.back hp. This shit is almost invincible when timed right. Try it out in practice mode - wait for the opponents’ jump, then immediately jump back hp.


#15

I’ve been working on all of this and it’s really helping. Thanks Hyper Inferno for telling me to play aggressive. I do much better if I’m initiating the pressure. If I do this I control the spacing and I know what AA to use before they jump, making it so that I can just react instead of thinking what I need to do and try to react at the same time. It’s making all the difference. And Mariodood, after I read what you said about crouch techs I realized how bad I need to learn them! I was getting dominated by throws today…