Demon mash

akuma

#1

Bit of a noobish Q here…but what’s the best way to mash out demon for wakeup etc.

A lot of times I know I can catch someone based on the wakeup BS they’re pulling on me, but I can only pull off a demon by hitting the input exactly on time with my character getting up (which isn’t always easy.)

Any attempt to mash out the demon inputs results in something silly like cr.HP and me eating whatever meaty move they threw.

Advice?


#2

He did the mash
He did the demon mash
The demon mash
It was a graveyard smash
He did the mash
It caught on in a flash
He did the mash
He did the demon mash


#3

Yep.

Don’t mash specials/supers/ultras if you expect any semblance of reliability from them.

You’re essentially saying “Hey, when I waggle my joystick like a madman and mash my buttons like a four year old finger painting, shit doesn’t work and instead random crap comes out. Why is that?”

Learn to perform the Ultra correctly if you expect to be able to use it when you have an opening. Learn the delays in your different wake-up speeds and the timing required to whip out your Ultra depending on which wake-up speed (if available) you select - i.e. instant or delayed. Its a practice thing. Hit training mode and experiment or ask one of your buddies who you play with to run through a few practice sessions with you.


#4

^Shit as soon as I see a Psycho Crusher land hard on me no matter what ex or not I mash it out by pressing LP+HP+LK repeatedly and Downback to upback repeatedly->gives to 3 back inputs.


#5

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

this has to be a troll


#6

So you can get it perfectly everytime Ryu throws a meaty fb at you?

The timing is really strict, but know that wakeup demons are pretty terrible answers to begin with. a meaty fireball might catch you just late enough to hit, srk will 100% hit you, other ultras will win, etc. Demon will only beat out normals. Try Jabx2 when you are in “chinese get up” animation.


#7

^dude u can just use cMK buffer to go under fb’s on reaction.


#8

On a wake-up meaty fireball?

Anyway, if you really want to mash out an ultra or super on wake up(and no, it’s not usually a good idea against an experienced player), just tap lp repeatedly and try to hit lk + hp just as you’re getting up.


#9

^no just regular standing up as the fb comes at you duck the first half with cMK then cancel to demon and if you do it right the fb will pass through your invincibility frames.


#10

Oh no - not all the time, of course not.

I find plinking all three punches makes a substantial difference in terms of reliability though. Having said that, I landed a healthy amount of (lucky) wake-up demons on seemingly well placed EX balls from a Ryu player recently that saw me take advantage of the brief invulnerability the demon’s startup enjoys. This of course was followed by me yelling out loud “oh you lucky bastard” because I know full well how small that window actually is :smiley:

I find it helps to pre-enter the punch portion (for me by plinking) of the demon and then simply press b+lk+fp on reaction thereafter (or not) if I feel its worth going for - e.g. if you see Ken wind up for an overhead, or Ryu try and plough in with his gut-punch. The latter especially as he tends to yell out a cue as if to remind us he’s putting himself at risk.

My point is that mashing out the demon and ‘hoping’ it lands strikes me as unnecessarily risky. I find when using Akuma that my approach is a lot more calculated due to how severely we can be punished combined with capitalising on openings (for me) to be something I make every effort to be precise about which rules out mashing for me. Frankly when faced with situations where the end result looks risky I’ll often opt for a teleport or simply block. With demons though sometimes you can get a feel for your opponent and you know full well he’s going to do something dumb to try and molest your wake-up where a well practised (and therefore reliable) demon response makes a worthwhile option.

As a flip-side to all this though, I’ve had a sparring mate mash out demons while I’ve been ripping into him with combos. The idea from his perspective is that if I screw up, he gets a demon. If I don’t, he’s subject to the combo is doing anyway. A few times its really worked in his favour due to me fluffing a FADC while he’s still grounded and of course I’ve eaten his demon. Frustrating.


#11

^I don’t think that would really work very well.

  1. If you’re opponent was standing close enough for the demon to hit before he recovers, he’d most likely get hit by the c. mk and be able to jump out.

  2. If he’s far enough away for c. mk not to hit, he’d probably recover in time and you’d just be wasting meter.

  3. If it was properly timed meaty fireball (and in higher level play you won’t be seeing much of any other type of wake-up fireball), you’d get owned if you tried to get c. mk out.

EDIT:I was replying to Bokkin’s post:


#12

^I’m going to post a vid cause I do every now and then in casuals because it’s kind of hard to do and it can be done pretty far from cMK range and still catch on their recovery frames.


#13

^Just wondering, does it work on slow fireballs? Or just the faster ones? I’d think if Ryu threw an lp fireball at a little over sweep range it might be a bit hard to duck under the fireball with c. mk and land an ultra before he recovers.

edit:
Anyway, it’s cool if you can get it to work, though I doubt if you’ll actually get to use it much if you’re going up against a player who knows how to time his fireball meaties properly.


#14

buffer double lp into hitstun blockstun or wakeup animation


#15

You don’t duck the the fb entirely with cMK you do it so when you cancel to ultra you’re inside the FB but the invincibility frames allow you to pass through. This only really works on Ryu on his ex,HP, and MP FB’s it works on Ken’s EX and HP on Akumas EX and HP as well. Against ex FB’s you have to be closer because recovery is closer. Go to training mode and check it out.


#16

@bokkin, thanks for the suggestion on how to mash the demon on wake-up. Shit works wonders when someone decides to FA or FA, backdash you on wakeup or comes in deep with a jump kick on wakeup. Haven?t missed this once in the last two days when the opportunity arises.


#17

^yeah I do it now when I block ex greenhand that’s an awesome punish to that move.


#18

Awesome guys. Thanks for all the input (and the song.)


#19

Also, in reply to Gamogo…

Like it or not the lenient timing in SF4 means that us amateurs and weekend warriors can get more success in certain things by mashing rather than trying to get frame perfect timing. Reversals on wake-up attacks being a perfect example.