Digging In: Makoto



I’m not fucking around anymore guys. I’m going to EVO this year and I want to break faces. I need help though. Right now I’m an advanced player. I feel like I’ve plateaued. I sort of stopped testing Mak and took time off for a few months and now I’m losing to people that I should be raping. Here’s what I need help with:

  1. Matchup knowledge: I need to be able to post specific questions and put of heads together to solve them. I accept the fact that I’ve gotten good by myself but its time for me to reach out. Like what tricks of the trade you guys have figured out like cr. mp at max range beating bison’s roundhouse.

  2. The absolute maximum damage combos I can use in every situation including counterhits, karakusa, crumple, etc etc.

  3. EVERY useful option select. Fukikusa is like, the best example ever. I never would’ve been able to come up with that alone. I want to be able to cover backdashing, jumping, everything. Right now I honestly frame trap > OS sweep ON REACTION.

  4. I need to practice my spacing and footsies. I mean every day playing high level fundamentals players and only using footsies and anti airs.

Please guys. I’m tired of seeing 2 Makotos in the world. Wouldn’t 3 be much better?

Completely not joking.


the rindoken bible: http://otersi.com/makotobible/testspread_nov03.pdf has a ton of the info you want for combos and oses on pages 28-the end of the book.

There isn’t much matchup stuff but there is a couple that were carefully broken down (like cody’s)

While the data is from AE the basic matchup info for most characters is still in tact.


I am 100% in this mode right here. Grinding the fuck out. Fuck the bullshit. Yo one thing i’ve done that helps a lot is i’ve been playing A LOT of ranked matches, then going to my win percentage to see who i’m losing against. Then i go to the forum and seek out that character’s best players. Maybe You could use that as a strat too? It works pretty well for me right now…


I’m so fucking pumped right now I think my testosterone just sterilized my room. I’m compiling every piece of information I personally have. That way you know everything I know. I’m sure it will make it easier to help me.

p.s. wherefore art thou vryu


I know the reason why I picked up Hawk as a sub is because of my terrible performance against him as Makoto. Somehow I’m winning the majority of my matches with him too, I don’t get it.


Hm… I’ve been looking at setups (as I’m really new at the game in this level, I didn’t test them). I’ve been told that the b.throw setup (dash x2, meaty MP Oroshi) doesn’t work anymore. I would test them and ask as I got results, but as we are already on this topic, is there any other setup that doesn’t work anymore?


Just the back throw setups. they’ve changed, but honestly, they’re easier.


I see, thanks… Is there a place I’m overlooking that has them?


The Makoto strategy and the makoto Q&A stickied threads should have info but you might have to dig towards the later posts because I don’t know if the main posts have been updated.


I’ve read all of it. I know quite a bit actually. I’m going to compile everything I know into this thread. that way you guys will know what i know. I’ll finish it this weekend


OK. check this match out.


First of all, I just want to say that Makoto matches are pretty hard to analyze because most of her game is player vs. player not character vs. character, at least as much as the other characters. We can’t know what each player is thinking but we can hypothesize. With that said though, there are a few times during this match where Haitani just gets a free jump in and hes not doing anything tricky. I feel like japanese players just respect him so much that he gets away with stuff i’d never get away with. It’s really annoying when your friends are like “haitani does it.” Am I crazy or do they let him get away with so much its stupid.

22 seconds in: Akuma stops pressure for no reason.

I see this happen all the time and its only to Haitani.


See what you dont realize is- Haitani is actually playing both sides at the same time! he puts quarters in on both machines and then records to make himself look good!

No…no, probably not…


Well, remember that the japanese have different fundamentals than american players. that’s one reason they are consistently better.

Also remember, the better the competition, the better Makoto can be. You can’t mindfuck mindless (american) opponents.

Also remember, that the japanese respect each other to a certain extent. Its not about the win… its about winning with Honor. American’s dont’ care about that shit lol. Japanese try to win with honor. Americans try to win by any means necessary.

Because of this, Haitani will look better because 1)he is better, and 2)he plays better competition. Nothing we can do about that… its hard to practice honorably and respect other people when it is not returned to you. That’s what we deal with every day. American’s have always fought dirty. SF is no different.


No, it’s true. A player is seen as one of the best and people hesitate. They hesitate and choose not to do something they’d normally do to a lesser known player. It’s the player vs player match up.


I don’t think that’s unreasonable. The Akuma used a close cr.HK (presumably a failed OS), and the advantage/momentum went to Makoto. After a second of blocking, he backdashed to beyond sweep range (a defensive sweet point), since if neither are in frame advantage, Makoto’s options > Akuma’s at that point. Well, arguably, because of Akuma’s AE st.HK.

I don’t think Haitani gets away with stuff, mostly I think he plays with risky reads because he knows how smart his opponents are. Going for the Karakusa is hella risky over Tsurugi/frame traps, but at that level of competition, often, it’s the less risky thing to do.


That’s a good point. He is probably -5 to -7 frames because of the range. The thing is haitani isn’t even sure what he can get away with so he opts to do nothing because he’d rather have the situation reset to neutral than to risk going into a vortex situation. Haitani is certainly an amazingly skilled player and he weighs his options. I think maybe you guys are right on the money with honor. How do I rape Americans then if they aren’t even thinking? That’s my worst matchup


Baits are the key. Which isn’t nearly as fun as actually applying your own pressure games, but them’s the breaks against people who don’t think.


Develop an autopilot that doesn’t lose to random / low skilled players.
Change your playstyle on how well they adapt to you.
I lose the most when I’m the one adapting to my opponent.

I also forget Makoto is way different than Dudley.


Still good advice though IMO. How is the he coming along? I been on like 10 characters lol.


I only need one character.
Unless you’re talking about the tut.
The tut is female obviously.
Anyone with a brain can see that.

I finished tut but lack motivation to record it.

Maybe after I get 5000 PP