Dirty Bull > Raging Bull

balrog

#1

So like, Dirty Bull is a 1 Frame Ultra now. 500-800 Stun or something like that.

Comboing into Ultra 1 adds like 250 damage max to combos. Best way to get something out of it is to link into it, or a whiff/fireball punish.

How come more people aren’t using Ultra 2?
Shit’s cash aside from the range.


#2

It is a 1 frame Ultra, but it’s 0+1, unlike Zangief’s 1+0 start-up, meaning you can jump it. Thus the only way to set it up is through gimmicks or punishes, and like all gimmick ultras, the risk vs. reward is bad. Heck, almost any gimmick you could do with U2 you could probably use U1 or Headbutt > U1 for the same effect, but for more damage.

Besides, U1’s main worth isn’t its damage, its worth is in its FREE damage added on to bread and butters, and the free cornering/incredible Oki afterwards. Plus there are more ways than combo’d Headbutt to set up U1.


#3

o 0+1 not 1+0
oh still good for… other rushdown characters at least


#4

If your idea of usefulness of Ultra is defined by ‘damage after a combo’ then I worry for your Balrog. Ultra 1 is more versatile, useful and, hell, damaging depending on use.

Anti Fireball (Use)
Discouraging Fireball (U1 Ready - How many matches have you watched where someone is playing against a respectable Balrog, and they completely stop throwing fireballs as they expect an U1 that probably never even gets used anyways?)
Anti-Focus Attack
Anti-Dash OS (Character Specific)
Anti-Air Punish
Punish / Combo / Push To Corner

Compare that to Dirty Bull… The fact you can guarantee Ultra 1 half the time is something, even if the damage scaling will be bad in terms of combo - Otherwise it’s used in many ways, some of which result in full grounded damage or even an unscaled juggle (AA), to which U1 is actually good, damage wise. Ultra 1 on Balrog will cause quite a few matchups to change their gameplan - Fireballs become risky, Focus Attacks won’t always fly (Just like how you can SUPER them, Ultra works the same to a degree) etc

Dirty Bull doesn’t have even half that presence as it’s 100% close proximity and easy avoided, making it tough to land and not overly rewarding if it does. Infact I hear the only true use it has is in the Dudley / Balrog matchup as a punish.

Ironically the only reason I never use Dirty Bull (Other than preferring Ultra 1 itself) is because even if I wanted to give it a try, I can’t do the motion on Keyboard :slight_smile:

No loss for me anyways.


#5

U2’s range makes it useless, it’s range can’t properly beat grounded meaty attacks. More range would make it more of a replacement for U1. Balrog loses all of his fear factor when he doesn’t have U1 or super stocked.

it’s lack of range makes almost 100% of all relevant punishes impossible.


#6

I think Balrog’s ultra 1 is the best in the game…


#7

Dirty Bull’s range is absolute garbage, you’re not going to hit anyone with it if they’re playing correctly. U1 gives Boxer more damage potential and gives him a solid anti-fireball game along with his super.


#8

and for the record, U2 does as much damage as U1 with extra stun. Also it will always be unscaled unless you do it after a focus attack. It got a damage buff in 2012, still useless though.


#9

The best way to utilize U2 imo is
Reg/Ex Overhead, focus cancel crumple,U2
It uses 2/3 meter but you’ll get the stun if you land another combo


#10

It’s not worth it, definitely not worth spending two bars for <550 stun (with the scaling). You can get 550 stun with a combo from a jab using two bars. And you get absolutely 0 oki off of U2 so you can’t keep them in place long enough to maintain that stun, they can backdash/move around/DP before you can apply any pressure. MAYBE in the corner. that’s about it.

U2 is best used for punishes, and after shenanigans. IF you can’t land it unscaled, it’s not worth it, period. OH, FADC crump, Grounded U1 does similar damage, corner carries, and gives you ridiculous time for oki.

This is my opinion, and I’m pretty sure I use U2 more than any other Balrog.


#11

U1>U2 for sure. There are some situations where it would be nice to have, but U1 has way more utility for reasons that enigmatic/rope drink hava listed here. You can use it to beat out certain safe jumps in the same way that Guy uses his U2 to do so but I would never pick it for that reason. Only time i would ever consider using it, even though I dont because I dont practice using it, would be in a mirror match maybe, or against oni. Against Oni, it completly shuts down his normally safe slash pressure. On block he is close enough to Rog to punish any slash. Without safe slash pressure Oni is absolutely terrible.