Does V-ism ruin SFA3?


#1

Don’t get too incensed by the title. Allow me to elaborate.

I’ve never liked CCs. Even since SFA2, performing custom combos didn’t appeal to me. I suspect it’s too much stuff going on at once* for my slow brain.

Another reason is that in a competitive game, V-ism ends up in repetitive*, often inescapable cycles designed to maximize damage and remove control for uncomfortably long periods of time from the “punching bag” player. (even without the infinite CC).

Finally, I like using A-ism and X-ism (Spinning bird kick ftw!) and after I’ve been soundly beaten by many V-ism players, I feel the dark side of the force pulling at me, telling me to become one of them. It’s heart wrenching!

This is very scary. I had no problem stealing tick throws, fireball traps, crossovers and other repetitive techniques so am I just making up excuses because my execution and timing are too crappy to allow me to enjoy V-ism?

Am I a scrub? Is V-ism the only manly way to play Alpha 3?

I noticed Cody has a really cool dodge in V-ism. Are there many character moves in V-ism that change gameplay significantly from A-ism? If that’s the case, I would feel uncomfortable asking people not to pick V-ism, not to mention the slippery slope to scrubdom.

Your thoughts?

*I think I never got into the VS series for that same reason despite the obvious awesomeness of those games.

**Really good players (Doujinshi comes to mind among others) can come up with borderline artistic CC combos with much variation, flourish and awesomeness. I like watching those .


#2

No it doesn’t. I think the whole custom combo thing is still done best in this game.


#3

I would say that I don’t think Capcom expected V-ism to become as exploited as it is now but then they haven’t really changed it in all the revisions they’ve made to SFA3. That said, (a) they’re not going to just dramatically change the game after everyone’s got used to it and (b) if it bothers people that much I guess they can just have a house rule not to use it or something.


#4

I feel the same way, dude. But, I see it as sort of a personal challenge to beat opponents who use cheap V-ism combos using my X-ism character, much like beating high-tier MvC2 teams using mid-tier characters.

The way I see it, people who really wanna win will use V-ism almost exclusively, the rest of us will dabble in everything else.


#5

No definetly not :), but everyone has his own opinion on the matter and yes some stuff like infs suck but I never cared. Actually it makes chars like Cammy able to compete and the whole juggle system deeper. Also V Guy is so spectacular to look at …, it’s awesome. :slight_smile:


#6

V-ism is not much of a problem if you know how to fight against it. If you can’t figure out how beat v-ism characters, start by learning a-ism sagat. Play super agressive until they have meter, than move on to your best footsies game and stop jumping. Preemptive activations should be srk’d or super’d, (because they can’t block) Blocked v-isms should be alpha countered in between the 0-50% point of their meter, (sorry, but you’ll get guard broken if you don’t) You’ll net faster supers and more damage as long as you can keep your opponent from getting in on you. After you feel like you understand the match up against v-ism enough, switch back to your main and apply what you’ve learned.

I’m not saying that this is the right way to learn or even the right strategy, this is just what I was told at evo and it worked for me so I’m passing on the knowledge. Sagat was the choice character because he is quick to pick up, has decent footsies and a srk.

Hope I could help.

As for the title, I’ll say I’m pro v-ism. I was always too lazy to learn v-ism, I figure the rape factor of v-ism is the reward for the practice. Either way, v-ism is still technically the most advanced super (or at least the latest created super when alpha 2/3 came out) so it only makes sense that it’s the best. I don’t wanna disrespect, but maybe you are kinda living in the past. If worst comes to worst, you can always play the original alpha, right? In case you wanted to know, I play x-ism ryu…


#7

I would have to agree with Iczer that V-ISM is my favorite of all of the ways custom combos have been used in fighters. I think it is one of many things which made A3 really different from A2 and other fighting games in general, so A3 wouldn’t really be A3 without it.

I also think it’s too good in many cases, but I wouldn’t say just making V-ISM worse altogether would be a good solution.


#8

I think it’s ironic that V-ism both hinders and enhances Alpha 3.

For some players the ability to improvise during a match is amazing, giving characters consistant anti-air options (V-Zangief) and just something fun to do rather than just hit confirm xx super.

For the other players it’s a case of how ridiculous can a game be if you can do unblockables into 60-70% damage, Crouch cancel infinites and (apart from select characters) nearly making A / X unusable in comparison.

Me, I love V-ism, if it wasn’t for VC’s I would find the game incredibly boring.


#9

I forgot to mention this earlier. I think V-ISM is the hardest of those custom combo modes to master, which makes the big reward really nice. It is more of a tool the intermediate and higher level players are able to use and only of at least some minor practise seasions. I’ve seen a lot of players with no dedication to it, you really need some practise first. In SFA2 everyone is able to make the standart customs in like no time at all and in CVS2 the whole juggling in the customs was a lot easier to not make a failure (all those SFA3 flipping countermeasures if some fails at the proper juggle execution).


#10

I always preferred The Excel Combos in SFEX2 and the CCs in SFA2 to SFA3’s V-ism. It’s not a matter of game balance, it’s just that the combos are more intuititive to me which brings me to my point: Although many people consider custom combos cheap, most people don’t like them because they aren’t intuititive. Everyone isn’t able to figure out easy and practical custom combos. However when a person is able to learn them they are highly rewarding. The problem is, that in most games that have this, Custom Combos are too rewarding, so if one can’t use them, they won’t have any success at a competitive level.

Capcom vs SNK2 isn’t my favorite 2-D Fighter, but it’s one of the few games where the Custom Combos don’t completely overshadow everything else.


#11

Well like said above i think many people were too lazy to get into v-ism:they stuck with good ol x or z,i must admit i did the same thing for a while before getting into v.
V is really rewarding to learn but really hard,i trained and trained and failed but succeeded eventually,i’m would say i got an average skill level in fighting games,and practicing these combos first and then the way to apply in real match took me weeks.
To sum up v is really different from other modes and more funny for me,yet i 'm currently improving Z honda:lol:


#12

its what gives this game its depth. without it, it would be pretty trashy.


#13

It really doesn’t ruin the game per se, it just creates a very large rift between players rather than characters. With this rift you’re either on the side that hates it or the side that likes it a lot.

It’s not about any one feature, because everything about it can be viewed as either good or bad by different people. It really all boils down to preference because basically all of it can be argued logically in a positive way.

But there may be value in it because of it’s uniqueness, as pointed out already. The way SFA3 did custom combos for V-ism: the way shadows work, how OTGS work, how throws work, how neutral states work, and even how infinites work, is really different from any other game (even all the other games that have customs, none of them work the same as SFA3).

But if none of that is of any interest to you, then play something else. To the people who like it, it’s a good game and it makes sense and it’s fun.


#14

Not by design, but the exploits make it that way.
The ISM thing was what made Alpha 3 what it was…

Still, that juggling crap makes V-ISM broken beyond repair.


#15

no v-ism didnt ruin sfa3 but v-ism is too good compared to a-ism and x-ism. however, without v-ism, i think there would be wayy less usable characters.

as for v-ism being hard to master, it doesn’t mean anything. so is bisons CC in cvs2, but people still got it down. as long as you put in time to practice, nothing is hard. while v-ism is easier to mess up in a combo, there is a lot more you can do after activation compared to A2 and CvS2 CCs


#16

Yeah, it’s been said that v-ism actually helps even out the tiers and makes some characters playable/interesting.

Without V-ism the game would be heavily dominated by characters like A/X-Dhalsim.

… mostly Dhalsim.

However, like I said in my previous post, whether you enjoy the way it evens things out or not is a matter of preference. The way shadows from VCs work in SFA3 is entirely unique to SFA3, which alone merits significant value/interest.


#17

V-ism ruins the game because it makes people create threads like this.