Evil Ryu version 2013 wish list

evil-ryu

#1

I see other character forums doing this, so lets get in on this to. First off there is no announcement of a version 2013, Ono has mentioned that he’s interested in doing it but this is all wishful thinking right now. So just for fun and for the sake of discussion, what changes would you like to see with Evil Ryu. This is mine which I copy and pasted from the rebalance request thread with some minor changes.

Light axe kick
-reduce stun from 200 to 100
-change it from -7 on block to -3

Reason: Right now I don’t know what Capcom wants us to do with this move. It’s unsafe on block, isn’t a true block string when used with low forward, and it does shit damage with no follow up or mix up opportunities. Pretty much all it’s good for is FADC combos. But that cost meter. This change will at least make it a pressure tool, but it’s still unsafe as it’s not a true block string and when spaced poorly, it can still be punished by fast normals or specials.

HK axe kick
-make it a overhead

Reason: It’s extremely slow and no Evil Ryu player uses it. It’s very easy to stuff it or jump out of it even when canceled from a normal with a lot of hit stun like st. HP or st. MP. If it’s an overhead, at least there will be some incentive in going for it and hoping to catch your opponent off guard.

EX axe kick
-give it hit invincibility
-reduce damage from 160 to 120

Reason: It shares a similar problem with the HK axe kick, it’s slow and gets stuffed or jumped out of so easily unless canceled from a high hit stun normal. This will at least make people be forced to block it similarly to Makoto’s EX chop. Reducing the damage should balance things out a bit. But it remains -4 on block and with very little push back, it’s definitely punishable on block. So it’s not something that can be thrown out without fear.

sweep
-change start up from 7 frames to 6

Reason: Evil Ryu is low health and low stun, but unlike other low health/stun characters. He lacks the tools to get in and stay in. With this he can at least Tatsu > sweep every character that Akuma can and stay on top of his opponents. He doesn’t have a deadly mix up game so it’s not like you’ll be seeing one axe kick combo followed by another on a wrong guess. So his wake up pressure will be pretty basic, but at least it’s something just to help him out a bit.

Stand Jab
-change start up from 4 to 3 frames
-increase hit stun so that it’s +6 on hit instead of +5

Reason: OK this one is probably not necessary. It’s just me wanting more. I just want a faster jab so I can attempt to punish things like Balrog’s jab dash punch. And increasing the hit stun is so he can have another combo into a hard knockdown. Again I think I’m getting a bit greedy here but I just wanted to throw this out there.

The axe kicks is Evil Ryu’s unique special move, but Capcom has made almost every version of it crap. The only semi decent one is the MK version. These changes makes that move much more relevant, but not too strong. I changed very little else where so he’s not that different from before, except that you may actually use the axe kicks more this time around for pressure and as overheads.


Possible character balance suggestions ver 2013 (2014?)
#2

Agree with rice_eater.
Light axe kick should not be punishable.

Possible other buffs:
Make towards MK an overhead like Juri’s.
Buff the teleport range or speed or both.


#3

The sweep change risks Evil Ryu becoming a monster. He already does more damage than Akuma, which helps mitigate the less fearsome vortex. But the biggest change is in footsies, where ERyu gets a poke at the standard shoto sweet spot where he is currently weak (and as compensation stronger further out with a buffed Ryu-style zoning game and “step focus”, and with batshit insane combo potential up in the opponent’s face), basically turning him into a super shoto.


#4

More invincibilty for the EX DP
start up 6 frames for cr MK “OR” cr HK
Axe Kick HK advantage frames on block +2


#5

Chk 6f, teleport same as akuma,divekick more frame avance on hit,light axkick +1 frame advandage on block. Reduce health to 850 stun remain as in 2012


#6

Balancing by health is horrible. It creates stupid shit like Seth where you feel your win condition is hitting a couple random things. Also, as above on the sweep. It is a stupidly dangerous change (only outdone by 5f or 6f cr.mk)


#7

mp>fp combo- fp doesn’t KD, special move cancellable, +meter gain

dive kick- +frames on hit
hopkick- hits shoto’s cr.mk

ex hurricane- make all hits hit

HK axe kick- overhead, more pushback
EX axe kick- Rice eater

ex fb- no knockdown, less recovery, less knockback on hit

lp red fb- less startup,
mp red fb- less startup, less knockback on block
fp red fb- less startup, less knockback on block, less recovery
ex red fb- less startup, less knockback on block, less recovery, faster speed…like sagat

teleport ultra cancellable…

FLAME AURA ONLY ACTIVE ON special moves, EX MOVES, SUPER, ULTRA- shit looks retarded


#8

I really don’t see how this makes Evil Ryu that much more threatening. Yes he gets a new untechable knock down combo and yes this strengthens his footsie game. But I don’t think it does it to the point that you fear. He doesn’t have a scary mix up game to really capitalize off hard knockdowns. I know how other characters can be really scary with small changes, but I really don’t see how this would apply to Evil Ryu with this change. If they made his low forward a 5 framer and changed nothing else about it, then that would be huge. But I’m not asking for that.

m00ieee, making the hop kick a overhead would make it too good. The move is good for blowing up crouch tech and you can do a ton of extra damage off it with a aerial EX tatsu. If Capcom made it a overhead, they would probably also remove the ability to special cancel it into a tatsu. We already have two overheads with the F+MP and the EX axe kick, so it wouldn’t be worth it.

peqqi, I want to place more emphasis on the axe kicks but I don’t mind your version either. Although it would make him more similar to Akuma though.


#9

Man…I feel like I’m the only person that likes lk axe kick how it is.


#10

Read my mind on the st.lp and sweep changes.
I was thinking f.mp combos in to EX shoryu so could get more damage of his overhead… Or more damage to his overhead but that mite be asking to much haha


#11

lk axekick is not going to be +1 on block. that is a ridiculous buff

divekick could probably use a little more hitstun, though.


#12

70 damage hadouken and add 10 to all shoryukens and 6 frame cr.fwd and same inv on ex dp as o.ryu. Ex tatsu should have all hits also. If I wanted to tatsu sweep characters. I’d just choose Akuma damn though having a sweep that reaches the toes would be nice.


#13

Why do you people list madness? 6 frame sweep ranged low forward into 400 damage. 70 damage on fireballs to go with that when the low forward connects more often as a true blockstring than other shotos. When your faraway game is better than normal Ryu’s (better walk speed, dashes, focus, shaku…) and you can go batshit insane in some opponent’s face in a way he could never hope to? … yeah. Sure. Right. Gotta be okay. I also heard Cammy needs buffs because EX Cannon Strike is bad.

Tatsu fixes I approve of. Shoryukens, whatever. I’d much rather get some actual hitboxes on antiair specials and normals. Have you seen that shit? It’s PITIFUL. Turns out Cammy’s DP has an actual hitbox. Big surprise there.


#14

Better hitstun for the divekick - not good vs tall chars other than for a meat dive aka “dp me pls dive”, it would allow E.R. to at least do c.mp combos against the non tall chars but I dont see that extra damage as a big trouble for the balance of the matchups.

cl.MK connecting after MK Axe Kick against all the chars while standing. I dont like random mixups, but fuck it, thats whats SF4 is all about.

If the cl.MK is too much of a buff, then the c.HK connecting after lk.Tatsu against every char with the same recover as Ryu’s c.HK. Its not necessary to me taht the c.HK’s startup gets changed to 6f, if they manage to keep its current framedata while allowing the move to hit after the lk. Tatsu its fine to me.

Id have to test a 6f c.MK before to give a final word about it, sometimes its seens too strong in my mind games, but others times it seens just fine, given how E.R. Sucks against some chars at such range. But if Id change it to 6f Id increase its recovery frames by 2 or 3, such good poke must be punishable with some ease if it misses.


#15

how about keeping cr.mk 7f…but make hopkick faster/better?

hopkick>lk. tatsu unpunishable at -1f, add juggle
>mk tatsu juggle, -2 on block
>hk tatsu NO juggle, +2 on hit, bigger damage

ryu got solar plexus>follows. e.ryu gets hopkick>tatsu>srk/ or hopkick>mixup

the above mentioned with 6f sweep, and cr. mk makes him way too strong.


#16

His air tatsu is horrible, make it the same as Akuma’s or the same as Ryu’s. 6 frame sweep or cr mk would be amazing but the air tatsu is the only really big problem.


#17

I actually think 6 frame cr.mk is reasonable. I don’t like 6 frame cr.hk just because it will make him a tatsu -> sweep monster. It’s not an elegant buff, it’s a buff that says “I give up, he’s Ryukuma now.” I wish there were a way to give him cr.mp -> sweep without giving him tatsu -> sweep. It would let him use his midrange kara throw game better and actually capitalize without counterhit.

One buff that would be crazy but play into his playstyle would be buffing the speed of cr.hp so that it can combo off cr.mp or cr.lp without CH. I don’t think it would lead to infinites if it were 5 frames.

I think he should have some safe option off f.mk xx tatsu. It’s currently useless without EX in my opinion. It’s minus on hit on all tatsus from when I checked. I’d rather do f.mk -> cr.lp and see if I CH than do a regular tatsu.

One change that might seem kinda crazy is if they made lk axe kick knock down and fast enough to combo from cr.mp. He just needs a way to combo into knockdown from his sweet spot. This would remove “cr.mk leads to 400 damage and knockdown.” Maybe this could be combined with 5f cr.mk and leave lk axe kick at its current speed. I don’t want that buff to happen really, but I don’t see other options.

They should increase the blockstun on hk axe kick so that you can abuse the frame advantage better. At least +3 on block or something. If it actually led to a real mixup, people would be more scared of it. Currently there’s just no reward for going for it.

Far hp CH, and his target combo, should put the opponent in a free juggle state. It would still be useless but not laughable.


#18

cr.mk buffs are not reasonable unless you do something to severely curtail the conversion potential. It has sweep range, ridiculous conversion potential and the blockstring already going for it. Making it not-awkward at that typical shoto sweet spot just turns ER into a monster. Now, if you kill the stupid damage? Bring on the good low pokes. I’ve been wanting a fast-walking footsies/zoning character that isn’t charge-based for who knows how long.


#19

Increase dive kick hitstun
Make far smk from -3 to -2 on block
Light,medium and hard axekick to have a better range hitbox(Hard axekick an overhead or make it 1 more frame faster making it 25 frames?)
Light axekick to push opponent further when blocked.
Crmk to go slightly more forward than it already does
St far HK to go slightly more forward than it already does
Crhk to go slightly forward
Close hk to have a better hitbox
EX axekick same frames as mk axekick which is 20frames i believe.
Fmk+extatsu+U2 to connect in the corner.
Raging demon to be faster.


#20

That was why I argued for lk axe kick knocking down, so that the only routes for big damage off cr.mk would be A)CH cr.mk xx mk axe kick, which is a gamble or B) cr.mk xx fireball FADC, which doesn’t lead to a huge combo at cr.mk’s best ranges and doesn’t do as much anyway.