Following up the Ultra

gouken

#1

Having problems following up the Ultra after landing it and keeping the momentum in the match. Meaties aren’t possible because of the recovery on the Ultra and fireball pressure is pretty risky against characters with good wakeup reversals and Ultras (Rufus, Elf, Ryu).

How do you guys keep the momentum going after landing the Ultra?


#2

late gohadouken is always fun :stuck_out_tongue:


#3

I prefer to do a L. Demon flip w/ the dive kick or a R. Demon flip w/ the counter to try and confuse and land w/out the sweep behind them or counter the anti air leaving them open again


#4

Not that different from any other knockdown IMO, you are faced with the same choices. It all depends on your health and your opponent’s health, and who you’re playing against.

If I want to go into aggression mode, I’ll probably go into a cross-up and/or demon flip mix-up game. If I’d rather turtle, I usually jump back and do a quick LK air tatsu and start playing the fireball keep away game. Just pay attention to your opponent’s Ultra bar and be mindful or their options if you choose the aggressive path.


#5

L. Demon Flip into throw against someone waking-up is another very strong option which adds to your mix-up game. 3 mix-up options > 2.


#6

I suggest going into training mode and checking the timing on what you guys are suggesting. ANY jumpins, be it a demon flip or a crossup attempt, are 100% unsafe.

The point of my question was how to keep the momentum without putting yourself in danger.


#7

Maybe that’s the point? I mean, it is one of the best ultras in the game as far as damage goes, and it can be easily juggled in the corner or off of throw or fadc’s. They probably don’t want it to have a real strong game vs. wake-up or landing it would mean a full life bar instead of half.


#8

Depends on who you’re playing against and how you time it. But of course yes, any jump-in will never be 100% safe. Personally though, I’m having a lot of success with Demon Flip grab on wake-up, just don’t overuse it.

Keeping any form of momentum with Gouken without putting yourself in danger, be it after an Ultra or whichever attack is pretty hard, at least for me.

Charge gohadoken > Ex Demon Flip > Dive Kick > c. HP > Ex Palm is pretty solid if you time it right but you loose two bars (you need to Ex Demon Flip if you’re too far away) and depending on the character you’re playing against, it’s not 100% safe.

Demon Flip from up close into grab, dive kick or sweep is good too, but it’s pretty much a rock-paper-scissors situation, so not totally safe. Thing is, you can escape any shit they’ll throw (or not) at you. Most anti-air can be beaten by parrying, grabing will beat standing and crouching characters, dive kick beats crouching, sweep beats standing. Not 100% safe, but if you mix things up correctly, all you’re options can grant you an opening. But you already knew that.

c. / s. HP is too slow, and so are LP and LK, so safe jump into jab string is not an option. Safe jump into anything is a bad idea with Gouken IMO.

Safest bet I guess would be to go back into keep away game? But that’s not really keeping the momentum. I’d stick with trying to make good use of the options Demon Flip gives.

I may be totally wrong, but I’m having a very hard time finding something 100% safe to follow up with. I know Demon Flip Dive Kick beats out most anti-airs like Shoryukens, but it does not seem consistant, or maybe it’s a timing issue? Perhaps there’s a way to time Demon Flip and make it safe?


#9

I don’t think Demon Flip after Ultra is an option against anyone with a decent wakeup reversal. Reversal Ryu Shoryuken beats meaty Demon Flip dive kick clean, try it out. It’s why Demon Flip resets are discouraged against Ryu.


#10

True that, I prefer playing a keep away game against Ryus, even more againt Kens (their Shoryukens seems to come out faster). Still, Demon Flip Dive Kick CAN beat an SRK, but I wouldn’t count on it. Was just wondering if there was some way to time it to make it safe, though that’s probably more due to online lag than anything.


#11

Once or twice in a match I like to give a person a half a sec to stand before doing an obvious demon flip towards them. Since they just stood up srk is fresh on the mind but the reversal window is gone. Parry into whatever.


#12

After ultra you can do roundhouse demon flip, dive kick on top of their head (that will beat reversal DPs).


#13

i think its always important to land it so that you cross them up with it, and if you ensure landing on their back shoulder with your kick you will always counter DP"s


#14

Charge your Hadoken and release for the 2 hit to register…
After that you can…

Palm Slide- (EX Palm Slide for 4 hit combo) (if they block you get the chip damage from the Hadoken and Palm Slide)

Demon Flip- Dive Kick>Grab (Back throw for punishment, or forward throw to push them into the corner) or Dive Kick (choose a combo) if they block go to cr. lp, cr. lp, cr. lp, cr. lk, cr. hk (this leads you to another option… most opponents will try to sweep you after your cr. hk so transition to a counter after your cr. hk (this catches alot of people off guard)

Demon Flip- Slide- (this will connect for 2-3 hit combo depending on the Hadoken you threw)

If you have enough EX meter in stock- You can

Hadoken>FADC walk up and grab, or overhead attack (crouching)

You can also Hadoken>Palm Slide>FADC> Grab, combo, or demon flip

Also you can mix things up a little by throwing on wake up, and using your focus attack to hit and bait (Gouken reaches level 2 really fast, use this to get your combos and Ultra off)

If you think they are going to jump, get about 1/2 screen away and you can throw mp or hp hadoken and palm slide combo. if you have 2 ex meters, you can FADC after your Hadoken for Ultra, Super, or Tatsu (this works with the mp and hp hadoken too if can hit them in the air… I may make a seperate thread regarding this. (the ultra is 484 damage just in-case you are wandering (The 2 hit AA Hadoken >FADC> Ultra is 534 Damage) You can easily get this off in a match, especially for opponents who like to jump in or have a move that’s an air attack. (Gen, Vega, Bison, Fuerte, Honda… and anyone else who likes to jump in (Ken))


#15

I suggest you try that in a match. Check the recovery timing after you land the Ultra, if you don’t get enough time to safe jump a wakeup reversal then a charged fireball certainly won’t work. You’ll just get punished.


#16

I seriously doubt you can super after just losing two bars for the FADC unless you’re in training mode =)


#17

Charged gohadoken into EX Demon Flip works great after a Tatsu or Palm Slide knockdown because the enemy sits at maximum distance from you. It won’t work after an Ultra because of the distance it leaves you from your opponent. If he does not do a quick recovery, you have all the time in the world to charge the gohadoken and follow up with EX Demon Flip into Dive Kick/Sweep mix-up. I haven’t been able to use the throw (from flip) from this distance though. However, on a blocked dive kick, both s.HP into LK Demon Flip or a simple throw work like charm.


#18

Just paid a little visit to training mode and charged Gohadoken > ex Demon Flip is not that great after tatsu, recovery is too long. Seems best to use it after a LP Palm Slide.


#19

super and ultra are 2 different things… If I typed Super… sue me… It was late


#20

UMMM… you charge while the opponent is laying on the ground… if they jump and you connect with a MP or HP Hadoken and FADC to the Ultra or Tatsu.

I actually pull it off quite a bit in matches too… but they have to be juming in… actually you can do a lp hadoken and FADC to the Ultra too… but I’m pretty sure you knew that too :slight_smile: