Frame trap solutions?


#1

Finally, I’ve broken the threshold between playing more scrubs than good players, but I’m constantly losing to the same thing: jump in that’s too quick to AA, blockstring to frame trap, 50/50. Try to tech with an OS, and get hit with a counter. Block the whole thing, get thrown. Jab back, get hit with the blockstring combo. I fall down, then the process starts anew:( I guess right, I get a hit in, or even (ZOMG) a combo, but then it opens me up for another blockstring. I know that this is the foundation of SF, but are there other options besides laming it out or getting thrown 30 times for the loss?

PS if you can avoid the usual stupid “practice” responses, I would appreciate it, unless you have WHAT it is I need to practice. Thanks.


#2

Game and character?


#3

SSFIV. Honda, vega, sakura. Wanted to start cody too.

3s when it comes out online, but I’ll practice on my DC with Hugo and Alex until then.


#4

Stand and tech, mash reversal into FADC, backdash


#5

try to late tech, but if you must OS tech, use it with a different attack that will have a better chance of beating a frame trap than a short (like a c.strong)

the reason you’re getting hit by one after the other is because you’re being predictable with your defense patterns. something you can try is if you find yourself in a pattern of constant - quick jump/throw, wakeup pressure into counterhit setup - do the opposite of what your gut is telling you.

if you feel the need to tech…then just block. worst case scenario you eat a throw - better than a 300 or 400 damage frametrap setup. converseley, if you think a counterhit setup is coming, try to reversal

basically if you are getting read correctly then those things are going to happen to you, you need to vary how you defend yourself to throw off better opponents


#6

ex headbutt, ex wall dive, and ex shouken beat (most) frametraps.

vs which character specifically are you getting trapped with?


#7

OS Tech later than you’re doing right now. Time a reversal. Backdash.


#8

This is impossible unless you are playing against a character with a FANTASTIC short-jump like DeeJay.

If they are jumping on you as you wake up, it is probably a safe jump – they do it with the intention of landing before you are able to do a move, which is why you can’t AA it or hit them when they land.

If you are both standing and your opponent jumps, there is no such thing as a jump that is too quick to anti-air.


#9

it is quite possible

its called “online”


#10

Lately it’s been Guy and Ryu. Cody sometimes, but I see a lot of other Codys drop combos and I take advantage. I do EX HB and EX Shooro, EX wall dive gets stuffed by a lot of wake-up jump ins, so I try to use EX kick instead.

What about without meter though? Maybe it’s lag, but Honda’s st hp is an awesome aa except on wakeup. I eat a lot of crossups using cr hp with sak. Vega’s wakeup game stinks without meter


#11

I play a lot of games doing just that: delaying my OS, settling for the throw, etc. But before you know it I down to half health and have only one bar of meter to push them back.


#12

I guess that’s what I’m saying. I’m not the best when it comes to being technical. But what to do then?


#13

If that’s the case, you’re just getting read. Practice more. :\

If you’re being safe-jumped. Block, OS Tech, read your opponent and try to escape.


#14

Blocking is a fundamental thing. In actuality, getting thrown is far less lethal than eating a 300dmg counter hit combo. But you could just try backdashing. Even if you get hit, you’ll most likely be airborne during your backdash which would just result in a flipback and reset. Or dont crouch tech


#15

been playing on the srk stream today. Gotten much better at blocking and reading. Less OS techs have helped too. Thanks for the help. More advice is cool too.


#16

beating frame trap/throw 50/50:

1.reversal (mash it if you have to, i know top players that mash that shit out… including daigo)

2.stand tech (you probably shouldnt mash this one but… it honestly doesnt hurt much at all unless your opponent is sitting right next to you)

  1. your own mixup between late crouchtech and FAST crouchtech, late standtech and fast standtech.

fast standtech and fast crouchtech (ct) beat frametraps that are designed to hit late tech… ie one late tech crouchtech frame trap that ryus seem to use a decent amount is cr.lp (slight walk forward) cr.mp into whatever. a mashed throw will beat that shit, as will a mashed reversal or a mashed jab… not sayoing you should mash those things… just alot of times thats one of the better ways to get out your shit out almost as early as possible.

fast frame traps beat fast crouch and stand techs. but lose to delayed techs…

and so on and so on and such and such. its just rps with the info that the opponent is giving you.

-dime


#17

In addition to all the points already stated: step up your offensive game. Several of those characters don’t have the greatest reversals for a reason, they are meant to pressure pressure pressure. Look at it thusly, you aren’t loosing to mix ups and the like you are loosing by relinquishing momentum and control of the match.

Online you will encounter several types of players:

The genuinely good, who will likely bulldoze you. These are the guys that on your first match you think you do relatively well, then you get your ass handed to you. They respected you at first in order to download your patterns, feel you out to see what they are working with.

Then you have players with an effective pattern but lack the ability to adapt. If you can’t beat these guys YOU are the scrub. Lag can make it difficult but over time you will get to the point where you will bulldoze these despicable dipshits. Beware though, a genuinely good player can appear no different if the gap in skill between the two of you is great enough. The difference being, a good player will modify his gameplan if you can counter it, the other guys will keep with it or resort to randomness or poorly thought out “strategies”. There is some possibility of training these guys to react how you want but most will be you figuring out their pattern and make with the pressure, predicting, and punishing.

The dyed in the wool scrub is the last but easiest to deal with. These types are random or a few steps above with one or two answers that they try to apply to every situation. Modify your approach depending on the match up. You won’t be able to teach them ANYTHING. If they lack a strong reversal PRESSURE them to death, if they have one and are relying on it, bait it and destroy them.


#18

Can you explain to me these terms: Late/Fast crouch tech, Fast/Late stand tech
I never knew there was a difference between fast and late of each tech.


#19

Fast crouch tech is regular crouch tech. You use it when you presume the opponent is going to throw/DP/block on the first available frame that they can. If your opponent takes action on Frame 1, you’re aiming to crouch tech on Frame 4. This gets stuffed by frame traps, where they’ll aim to hit you if you out of the cr.LK startup of your OS on Frame 5,6 and 7.

Late-teching is when you purposefully delay your crouch tech to the latest possible moment. You have something like 7 frames to tech a grab, right? Well, OS-teching late will protect you from tighter frame traps, DPs, and the like. When fighting Dan, as an example, a late tech will block a Koryuken frame trap as he comes out of Danku, and it will tech Danku > Tick Throw.

The other day I was having a mirror, and I could just block and tech all day because he’d be all gung ho to take action on the earliest possible frame. If he realized I was using late-tech. He could have acted against it by pausing for a moment before using Koryuken FADC, or aiming to stuff it with a properly timed normal.