Help me play like this (Ken)


#1

This is one of the worst beatings I got in my life in this game (minus one time I played a Urien online that parried ALL of my attacks).  How does he parry so well?  Even if I can predict with a degree of certainty the move that’s coming, My parries RARELY work unless it’s a fireball attack.  I mean I got totally out classed and I didn’t even know what to do.  I mean, I just got read as easily as the Cat in the Hat and got so messed up I randomly threw out uppercuts because I didn’t know what to do. And to make it worse he toyed with me near the end when he could have finished me off.  So disrespectful lol.  I was just parry practice to him T_T<br><br>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4oRQnFNWmo<br>


#2

the low parries are most likely option selects.  you tap down on top of the other guy, or as he’s waking up or right after you stick out an attack if you expect him to stick out a poke.<div><br></div><div>the rest look like parries on reaction to me.  there’s a couple of parries in there that just look like guesses, but they’re pretty low risk because you went low often.</div><div><br></div><div>remember that sweep can be punished at most distances with a sweep of your own, or a counterpoke with low forward into super.  this means that it should not be something you think of just throwing out there unless you have a good reason to think it will hit.  for instance, it might be worthwhile to stick out a sweep if you seem him dancing outside your poke range looking to catch a button with a forward parry.  then for sure, why not.  you threw out a couple sweeps that seemed like prayers, and if he was more on the ball with his punishes he would’ve punished you hard for them.  he mostly just swept you back, but you can eat supers or low forward xx shoryus for that against better players.</div><div><br></div><div>if you hit a button kind of early on your jump in, it’s a pretty easy parry and punish.  he can see it coming, and has plenty of time to hit forward then think of what to punish you with.  you beat anti air parry by mixing up the timing of your jump in attack, or empty jumping and landing with throw, or empty jumping with some space between both of you and watching to see what he does.  if he whiffs throw or stick out a button you can possibly punish depending on what it was and if you can react in time.</div><div><br></div><div>being able to parry like that will come with experience.  but the parries don’t really matter - he can block those attacks and punish them severely too.  I wouldn’t look at that match and say “this guy is so amazing he parried everything!”  it’s more useful as feedback for yourself about throwing out unsafe moves and praying.  just make a mental note and try to work some of those bad habits out of your game.</div>


#3

^ Pretty much. You made a ton of mistakes dude. Point Blank Haou, going sweep happy, jLP… Jeeze. You know every sweep aside from Chun/Yun’s are punishable with SA3, right? 


#4

Your opponent is not really amazing per se, you’re just playing 1 dimensional–you attack whenever there’s an opportunity, so all he has to do is to buffer a parry during these gaps and get a parry. It’s not anything special. Go back to the video and ask yourself what move you were doing when you got hit, next time, hold down back instead.<br><br>


#5

LP shoryu more, it’s 100% safe online. Also try teabagging and taunting more to get in his head.<br>


#6

<blockquote class=“Quote”>
<div class=“QuoteAuthor”><a href="/profile/20911/Louiscipher">Louiscipher</a> said:</div>
<div class=“QuoteText”>^ Pretty much. You made a ton of mistakes dude. Point Blank Haou, going sweep happy, jLP… Jeeze. You know every sweep aside from Chun/Yun’s are punishable with SA3, right? </div>
</blockquote>

No, I didn’t know that.  I’ve only been playing this game regularly for less than 4 months.  I barely have 3000 rounds in in total and that’s mostly against my firends irl so I’m still figuring stuff out.  I kinda panicked because I didn’t know what to do so Sweep was like my panic button just hoping it’d work XD.  I wasn’t at all calm after that first round so I made a lot of mistakes because I essentially stopped thinking.<br>


#7

<blockquote class=“Quote”>
<div class=“QuoteAuthor”><a href="/profile/57681/IglooBob">IglooBob</a> said:</div>
<div class=“QuoteText”>the low parries are most likely option selects.  you tap down on top of the other guy, or as he’s waking up or right after you stick out an attack if you expect him to stick out a poke.<div><br></div><div>the rest look like parries on reaction to me.  there’s a couple of parries in there that just look like guesses, but they’re pretty low risk because you went low often.</div><div><br></div><div>remember that sweep can be punished at most distances with a sweep of your own, or a counterpoke with low forward into super.  this means that it should not be something you think of just throwing out there unless you have a good reason to think it will hit.  for instance, it might be worthwhile to stick out a sweep if you seem him dancing outside your poke range looking to catch a button with a forward parry.  then for sure, why not.  you threw out a couple sweeps that seemed like prayers, and if he was more on the ball with his punishes he would’ve punished you hard for them.  he mostly just swept you back, but you can eat supers or low forward xx shoryus for that against better players.</div><div><br></div><div>if you hit a button kind of early on your jump in, it’s a pretty easy parry and punish.  he can see it coming, and has plenty of time to hit forward then think of what to punish you with.  you beat anti air parry by mixing up the timing of your jump in attack, or empty jumping and landing with throw, or empty jumping with some space between both of you and watching to see what he does.  if he whiffs throw or stick out a button you can possibly punish depending on what it was and if you can react in time.</div><div><br></div><div>being able to parry like that will come with experience.  but the parries don’t really matter - he can block those attacks and punish them severely too.  I wouldn’t look at that match and say “this guy is so amazing he parried everything!”  it’s more useful as feedback for yourself about throwing out unsafe moves and praying.  just make a mental note and try to work some of those bad habits out of your game.</div></div>
</blockquote>

Thanks for the advice!  I’ll try the option select and maybe in the past I’ve been doing it too early or too late.  Do you time it during the animation as he’s getting up or right after that?<br>


#8

<blockquote class=“Quote”>
<div class=“QuoteAuthor”><a href="/profile/79214/artboy598">artboy598</a> said:</div>
<div class=“QuoteText”><blockquote class=“Quote”>
<div class=“QuoteAuthor”><a href="/profile/20911/Louiscipher">Louiscipher</a> said:</div>
<div class=“QuoteText”>^ Pretty much. You made a ton of mistakes dude. Point Blank Haou, going sweep happy, jLP… Jeeze. You know every sweep aside from Chun/Yun’s are punishable with SA3, right? </div>
</blockquote>

No, I didn’t know that.  I’ve only been playing this game regularly for less than 4 months.  I barely have 3000 rounds in in total and that’s mostly against my firends irl so I’m still figuring stuff out.  I kinda panicked because I didn’t know what to do so Sweep was like my panic button just hoping it’d work XD.  I wasn’t at all calm after that first round so I made a lot of mistakes because I essentially stopped thinking.<br></div>
</blockquote>

almost 3000 rounds … and still playing like this?<div><br></div><div>No offense.</div>


#9

<blockquote class=“Quote”>
<div class=“QuoteText”><a href="/profile/35432/EricGGMusic">EricGGMusic</a> said: almost 3000 rounds … and still playing like this?<div><br></div><div>No offense.</div></div>
</blockquote> It’s offensive no matter what you try and tag on the end if you offer no advice and passive aggressively bash someone, but it is what it is.  I don’t live in an area to play people that breathe this game often, nor do I play this game to compete in tournament so I get away with a lot of stuff I shouldn’t.  So when I encounter someone who knows the game better than I do I didn’t know how to handle it.  Obviously this is an example of me playing at my worst which I stated in my original post and makes your comment come off as nothing but prickish.  Sheesh<br>


#10

imagine throwing super spinning fists in a real fight. It’s not gonna work.

Stop throwing haymakers at close range and wake up uppercuts every two seconds.

Learn your fundamentals.
Combos, block strings, defense, punishes, and so on.


#11

it looks like your opponent tried to do strong fierce srk kara srk midscreen.  don’t worry about him.<br>


#12

Try to work on one thing at a time. First, learn the combos that win games. Then, learn (in general) what normals to use at what range. These 2 steps do not involve you playing against anyone, you can work on them by yourself. When playing against an opponent, try to be aware–e.g. when you get hit in a certain situation, make sure to realize when you’re in that situation again in the future. For example, when you do a point blank sweep, you will get punished 100% of the time vs another Ken. Next time when you’re point blank, be aware of this and don’t sweep, if you do sweep again, you can also remind yourself not to by punching yourself in the nuts etc.<br><br>These are just very general advice, because you need to have specific questions to get specific answers (e.g. not how can I play this good). I say that right now you’re not ready for online. Play against friends, practice combos & play the CPU on max difficulty, look at frame data, and ask match up related questions.<br>


#13

it can be useful to sit in training mode, record the dummy doing the same move over and over (this can be low roundhouse, low forward, or anything really) and try to interact with it.  see how you can punish it, at what ranges and at what timings.  can you counterpoke it?  can you block then reversal super?  not only will this help you when you see someone else throw out a button, it will help you not make the same mistake yourself.  so when you throw out a close sweep and the other guy counterpokes with a low forward into SA3, you’ll be like “oh of course, I remember that!  don’t sweep like that again.”


#14

<blockquote class=“Quote”>
<div class=“QuoteAuthor”><a href="/profile/26611/cong">cong</a> said:</div>
<div class=“QuoteText”>Try to work on one thing at a time. First, learn the combos that win games. Then, learn (in general) what normals to use at what range. These 2 steps do not involve you playing against anyone, you can work on them by yourself. When playing against an opponent, try to be aware–e.g. when you get hit in a certain situation, make sure to realize when you’re in that situation again in the future. For example, when you do a point blank sweep, you will get punished 100% of the time vs another Ken. Next time when you’re point blank, be aware of this and don’t sweep, if you do sweep again, you can also remind yourself not to by punching yourself in the nuts etc.<br><br>These are just very general advice, because you need to have specific questions to get specific answers (e.g. not how can I play this good). I say that right now you’re not ready for online. Play against friends, practice combos & play the CPU on max difficulty, look at frame data, and ask match up related questions.<br></div>
</blockquote>

Thanks for the advice!  Really appreciate the help!  Now when you say play the CPU at max difficulty, do you mean in practice mode or Arcade mode because the difficulty setting doesn’t seem to affect the Arcade mode at all.  I can make it through arcade mode with Ken pretty easily until I get to fight 9 and Gill.  I don’t wanna try and make excuses for myself 'cause it’s not necessary, but I don’t think this video is a fair representation of my skill.  Not saying I’m Kuroda or anything, but in this game my brain shut down out of fear of not knowing how to handle an opponent who knows what they’re doing.  My opponent (who I found out was some Japanese person) even noticed my brain what shut off when I asked him for advice. XD  I live in a place where the most popular games are UMvC3 and Tekken 6/TT2, so besides my 3 other friends who I talked into getting the game there’s really no examples of good play except online.  But anyway I’ll take your advice.  I have trouble landing Ken’s target combo into L.DP but I just gotta go into practice mode and remedy that. Thanks again!!!<br>


#15

<blockquote class=“Quote”>
<div class=“QuoteAuthor”><a href="/profile/57681/IglooBob">IglooBob</a> said:</div>
<div class=“QuoteText”>it can be useful to sit in training mode, record the dummy doing the same move over and over (this can be low roundhouse, low forward, or anything really) and try to interact with it.  see how you can punish it, at what ranges and at what timings.  can you counterpoke it?  can you block then reversal super?  not only will this help you when you see someone else throw out a button, it will help you not make the same mistake yourself.  so when you throw out a close sweep and the other guy counterpokes with a low forward into SA3, you’ll be like “oh of course, I remember that!  don’t sweep like that again.”</div>
</blockquote>

I’ll try that.  Thanks for the advice!  I really appreciate it :)<br>


#16

Was that dyne? trying to parry everything followed by the most idiotic punishes


#17

yeah that’s another thing to think about - based on that one video, that guy does not look particularly good.  if he parries everything it’s because you let him.  whenever you watch high level play you don’t see people parrying everything.  treat someone parrying everything as a sign of disrespect, and punish them for trying it.<div><br></div><div>Is he parrying your stuff that you’re just throwing out there?  don’t throw unsafe moves for no reason.</div><div><br></div><div>is he guessing high or low often?  there’s a lot you can do about that.  throw him, stick out a normal and buffer something behind it (low forward into EX fireball or SA3 or jab shoryu, or standing close strong with a jab shoryu buffered behind it are good examples), or just wait and watch to see what he’s guessing.</div><div><br></div><div>you don’t have to live with people parrying everything, and parrying you often isn’t the sign of a good player.  a lot of new people say stuff like “X player is so strong, he parried every move I did!”  if that’s true odds are you are really predictable or he’s playing really carelessly (or both).  there are OSs that you’ll have to maneuver around and certain timings where you’ll find out you just can’t stick out normals against a good player, but the video you posted and the guy you played against wasn’t playing that way.  he was just your average online Ken player who was feeling himself a bit too much.  like that part towards the end where he parries your tatsu and then does nothing - that’s some dumb shit.  make it a goal to destroy people who play that way.  the tools to do it are in the game, you just have to find them.</div>


#18

He parried everything to show OP how predictable he was. <div><br></div><div>Doing a fireball right in front of their face has never been a good idea no matter what fighting game you’re playing. </div><div><br></div><div>You took offense to my earlier comment? Here’s some advice then.</div><div><br></div><div>Learn your good normals in every position you’re put in.</div><div>Learn to hit confirm into super</div><div>Watch videos of good Ken players</div><div><br></div><div>Those things will help you body at least 80% of people playing online. Doing those definitely doesn’t take 3000 rounds of playing</div>


#19

<blockquote class=“Quote”>
<div class=“QuoteAuthor”><a href="/profile/35432/EricGGMusic">EricGGMusic</a> said:</div>
<div class=“QuoteText”>He parried everything to show OP how predictable he was. <div><br></div><div>Doing a fireball right in front of their face has never been a good idea no matter what fighting game you’re playing. </div><div><br></div><div>You took offense to my earlier comment? Here’s some advice then.</div><div><br></div><div>Learn your good normals in every position you’re put in.</div><div>Learn to hit confirm into super</div><div>Watch videos of good Ken players</div><div><br></div><div>Those things will help you body at least 80% of people playing online. Doing those definitely doesn’t take 3000 rounds of playing</div></div>
</blockquote>

Thank you for the advice.  I know I’m not the best at this game and most of those rounds were again my friends (who are new to the game too) who let me get away with stuff like that.  They’ve been learning too and I haven’t been able to do it as much, but you must admit that you’re only as good as the people you get to play most often.  FGs are not popular where I live so places like this and other sites are the only places I can go to talk to people who know way more about the game than I do when I encounter play above mine.  Not trying to get into any internet wars with anybody and just want to grow alongside others who have a similar hobby.  And btw those close fireballs were input errors.  I sometimes get those and that step-thing Ken does by accident when I’m careless with execution.lol<br>


#20

listen to ryu24. <div>he was as clear an concise as needs be.</div><div><br></div><div>think about it like boxing, or some other kind of full contact fighting sport.</div><div><br></div><div>1. don’t think of the buttons as ‘low damage, med damage, high damage’. think of them as completely individual moves with no relationship to each other. except that they use an arm or a leg. since even the functions can change (makoto’s low fierce is her sweep type move).</div><div><br></div><div>2. always try to hit at the furthest possible effective range (except in instances where that makes a combo you want to use impossible). so for example, kens low roundhouse. pretty far range move, also relatively slow with pretty bad recovery. if you hit someone at the edge of its range, it will be essentially safe since there is pushback. if you do it close (not at the edge of its range) the pushback wont push far enough to leave you at a safe distance.</div><div><br></div><div>(short/jab)weak and quick moves exist to throw off timing, interrupt, set someone up, etc. just like in boxing. think of jab. a jab is not for doing any substantial damage, it is used to set up other attacks. either by forcing them into a defensive position, breaking their conentration, positioning them for another punch, etc.</div><div><br></div><div>(forward/strong) these normals are often used for comboing and have many many uses depending on situation and character. theres no real general trend i can think of except general utility and usually the most commonly special and super cancellable normals.</div><div><br></div><div>(roundhouse/fierce) often for very specific situations. often have strong ‘priority’ meaning in trade-type situations they frequently win due to large hitboxes and/or small hurtboxes. general trends are high damage, long range, slow recovery, sometimes slow startup. </div><div><br></div><div>you need to know the normals of the character you choose to play and all other characters (to a lesser degree). you need to know the ranges, the general timing, how unsafe some things are at certain ranges, etc.</div><div><br></div>