Honest questions to those that complain about Chun-Li


#1

I am really just generally interested to hear some peoples opinions. I wont name any names, but some of you newer or non-experienced players seem like you make it a point to bring up the “chun is too good” comment every chance you get.

Yes even though i do main Chun, I am not offended if you think she is too strong, because everyone can have their opinion. In my honest opinion she is beatable by any character.

But in all honesty please answer some of these questions for me:

What specific Chun players have you played against? Any top chun players? Why were they so good?
What made you feel as though the match up was not fair and not winnable?
Are there any Chun players you respect? Any of them “honorable”?
What do you prefer about playing other characters as opposed to Chun li? Is it just complaining for the sake of variety?
Do you feel as though if you were to pick Chun, you can beat more people than you do now? You can become a top player even?
Do you dislike Chun in other games as well?
If a character like Sean were to have a better kara throw, and a better super, would you change all the complaining toward him?

The reason why I started this thread is because I feel there is a general misconception about Chun-li. If you ask any random street fighter player about 3s, they will be quick to say “chun fest”, even if they dont even play the game! There can be many reasons for this but the obvious is tourney results. But if you really break it down, its not like random people pick Chun and can win tournaments. In fact it is very rare for randoms to even break through to top 8 in any notable 3s tournament. It simply doesn’t happen as opposed to sf4.

I hope this misconception can be changed eventually. I am not gonna say Hugo is better than Chun because that is not what this whole post is about. I just hope people can start to understand Chun-Li before being so quick to cry because of the influence it brings to the game that WE love and play. In all honesty I feel as though this is the reason why 3s tournaments are no longer featured in hardly any American tournaments. I feel that these people crying are bringing a bad rap to 3rd Strike. Something that it does not deserve.

Ps. Any reference to Chun-Li can be substituted to another character if you have complaints about someone else. (Yun, Ken, Makoto, etc.)


Scrubquotes is back!
#2

I don’t want to offend anyone who I labeled as a newer or non-experienced player. Please don’t tell me how long you’ve played this game, or how many hours you’ve spent practicing your latest Denjin set ups. I consider experience as genuine OFFLINE play against average to above average players.

Funny story…
There was this guy a while back who posted on every youtube video putting everyone on blast. He would say everything negative about top tier players, and everything positive about lower tier characters. Would say people sucked, and even go as far to call top Japanese and American players scrubs, just because they happen to use Chun or Ken. Normally this type of internet trolling is a dime a dozen but this guy actually showed up to play at the arcade in San Diego. To be honest, the way this guy was talking I assumed he had to be somewhat decent. This guy was with out a doubt the worst player I’ve ever seen. He looked like he had been playing this game (and any other sf) for about 3 days. I hope there can be actual opinions from people who play the game.


General 3S/3S OE Thread. NO DISCUSSING REBALANCE, unless you like INFRACTIONS!
#3

She’s easy to use, and if you’re really good with her, then it’s a whole different story. She’s not combo heavy, and relies more on her impeccable normals, and her high damaging super. The same could be said for other characters in the 3S cast. I don’t think she’s the best in the game though.

I think the biggest misconception about 3S is when people think fireballs are useless. Wrong.

Edit: Stupid Sean comparison. He doesn’t have her normals.


#4

The only comment I have as far as this is concerned is related to many of the characters but more often with Chun and Ken. I think the only thing frustrating about fighting them sometimes is that once they have super loaded it’s very easy to lose a lot of life from a little mistake. What happens is less confident people tend to get a bit scared and give them space which is for some people not a very fun way to play.

I don’t see this as a problem personally because the same is true for a lot of characters. I mean with Makoto she can smack you around without super ready enough to stun into super into combo, etc. It’s not something only the more overtly powerful characters can do but they have easier/more consistent ways to do it. They have fewer difficult to deal with situations just due to their design.

Ultimately whatever character you choose to use you should know what you’re getting into and take the time to learn everything for yourself, on your own. If you do there is never a situation in 3S that feels ‘unfair’. Situations may be hard but every character in the game has situations they’re not as good at/disadvantaged. When you know your shit and you know their shit because you’ve experimented and spent the time to get a feel for everything nothing is ‘lame’.

It’s ok to say some situations are hard, that’s what makes the game exciting. It’s a bit shitty to blame the game if you can’t overcome those difficult situations. That’s the difference. Some of us blame ourselves and our lack of ability while others blame the game’s design. It’s a mixture of both but it’s heavily weighted towards player ability and understanding.

I’ve always felt that 3S allows players to dominate players more than most fighting games. If you’re figured out the tools exist to completely destroy your predictable offense/defense. I think that’s difficult to deal with for newer players who haven’t been humbled. Thankfully I have no pride so this has never been an issue for me. I don’t think that’s true of many newer players though, especially in this post SF4 world.


#5

yeah i dont believe she is easy to use at all. maybe at beginner level.
youre right tho, everything you said after that can be applied to any other character, so im not seeing those as reasons to dislike a character.

ok imagine if sean had the same impeccable normals. then would you hate him?
sean hp in 2nd impact was better than any poke in 3s, yet people want 2nd impact sean back?


#6

3S isn’t imaginary, there is no “what ifs.” I don’t have to worry about Sean’s 2nd Impact HP because he doesn’t have it.


#7

I’m opposite, I’ve never complained about facing chun, I really don’t mind and this has been in casuals and tourneys. Blocking low and looking for throws to crouch tech neutralizes a lot of her threat just dont get impatient and pissed cuz your cornered and can’t do much. I know thats a simple answer and its never that simple, yeah she has a lot of powerful tools but who cares? Doesn’t mean you have to try and parry and end up eating her sa. Complaining and making excuses is for the weak.


#8

Do i win more when i pick chun? Actually yes. The whole thing is her hit confirms into super are 20 times better then my characters options, but i’m sort of content with that. I’d still in the end of the day play with necro then chun, hes just more fun.


#9

you are missing the point, but thanks for your reply to the 1st post.


#10

I’m not much of a complainer, but when I do, it’s how strong Chun’s throw/hit confirm/baiting game is that tends to annoy me. Her 2 frame jabs can be a pain too sometimes. Having said this however, I’m against any form of rebalance, simply because I do like a challenge and changing the balance of the game would inevitably just mean another char gets broken during the process.


#11

No, I understood your point, but it holds no merit. I’m not into theory fighting. Something irks me with every character in 3S, and it’s just that Chun is near the top of the list. So what if Sean had his 2nd Impact counter-part in 3S, are you saying people won’t still hate on Chun? Chun isn’t the only hated character in 3S.

Are you insecure about using Chun because people think she’s easy to use?


#12

Stop being a dumbass and answer his question.


#13

lol no im not insecure. i dont care to argue with random people on the internet, which is why i thanked you for your opinion and reply from the first post.
I am sure i can use every character in 3s much better than you so theres nothing to be insecure about.

anyways if you read my original post i said:

Ps. Any reference to Chun-Li can be substituted to another character if you have complaints about someone else. (Yun, Ken, Makoto, etc.)

its a pretty fair question asking if any other character had the same or better pokes, would people still hate on them? to me it seems like people hate on chun li just to join the bandwagon. if you dont want to answer or you think it holds no merit, then dont answer. simple as that.


#14

Yeah, you’re insecure.


#15

good points.

thats kinda interesting. everyone who ive seen who picks chun as secondary will always still win more with their main. when i made the switch from urien to chun i was getting raped for a while. especially in the chun chun mirror.

yeah i totally understand how it can be annoying. i remember i used to feel the same way when stuck in that ass zone where you are scared to press a button/scared to jump/scared to tech. for me it just took match up exp. before i learned to feel comfortable even in that situation. something i know can be difficult for the lack of people playing these days.
but at least the 2 frame jab can be punished easily if parried, unlike other random normals that even if parried sometimes the opponent can block.


#16

Justin Wong is cheap.


#17

http://shoryuken.com/f8/evo-results-2k3-through-2k8-here-if-anyones-interested-who-placed-171671/

It wasn’t just Chun, at EVO for many years, but also Yun, that contributed to almost everyone hating on 3S and there being many misconceptions about the game. At EVO2004 I remember 3S being described as “on its last legs”. But after the big Daigo parry moment, 3S exploded in popularity, I even think that 3S drew the most entrants at EVO2005 and 2006.

But the level of play at EVO, following 2005, was beyond boring, and almost uncompetitive. The perception of 3S, from outsiders, was that it was basically guys showing up, rocking top tiers, and looking like they didn’t care at all and just wanting to quickly win and move on. One year Mike Watson said that he hated 3S, thought that the game was [media=youtube]uPUdcyv6VxY"[/media] and that he didn’t play it, and that he’d easily make top eight because no one was any good. And the number of Chuns and Yuns just saturating the top eight every year at EVO did not win anyone over either. Most of the SFIV era players were not exposed to 3S at a good time for the American 3S scene. They see guys like Watson calling out 3S, they hear people booing Chun at EVO2008, and lots of people calling for 3S to be gone. For people who didn’t play 3S, 3S was probably the most boring game at EVO or on the scene when SFIV was announced, it was the least spectator friendly game. People who liked 3S didn’t care who was playing, or what character was being played, because it was 3S.

Also 3S has a steep learning curve. So you have SFIV players who migrate to 3S, try the game and are instantly frustrated when they don’t have immediate success, so instead of practicing at 3S and working hard, they lash out at 3S on forums or YouTube or whatnot. There are a lot of SFIV players who go to GGPO, lose, then scream about how imbalanced 3S is. Even when they lose to Q or Necro…they still scream about whatever they can latch onto about 3S which is usually balance.

Another major problem was that most of the Japanese showing up to EVO played either Yun or Chun. It’s not like RX or TM were showing up for EVO. For some reason the low or mid tier players never attend EVO. RX flew to Brazil but he never made an EVO. Mainly Nuki, Mester, Nitto or Tokido would show up. Mainly Chun and Yun players. Judging by EVO top eight results you would think that MvC2 is far more balanced than 3S. It was just unfortunate circumstances that led to 3S having the reputation as a “Chun fest”. You get the 3S scene to step up and actually invite some low tier players to EVO, and maybe 3S has a different reputation right now. While SBO has guys like Kuroda and RX, clearing house with mid and low tier characters, we have EVO top eight being a nightmarish endless parade of Chuns.

I wasn’t really hot on the 3S scene until someone pointed me to TheShend a few years ago. After being exposed to all of the various characters being played in TheShend’s videos, seeing tutorials and strategy videos, and getting a glimpse of how impressive the Japanese scene was for 3S, I became interested in the game. Now I watch basically every 3S video on Nico Douga as soon as they are posted.

I don’t think anyone was accusing 3S Chun of being so easy that anyone can pick her and win. The top eight results at EVO are pretty clear that only bigger names will get that far. People didn’t like that all of the big names would pick only Chun or Yun. When most of the top eight is Chun or Yun at three EVOs in a row, it gives a distinct impression that 3S is not balanced, and that the only way to possibly win is to pick Chun. That’s why people didn’t want to see 3S at EVO…because it was almost guaranteed to be a boring high tier festival. If the US 3S scene was like Japan’s, with Co-op Cup, SBO, Danisen, Ohnuki screaming on the microphone, and lots of character variety, I seriously doubt that “Chun fest” would even be part of the fighting game lexicon. But 3S in Japan and America is night and day.


#18

ryan ive been saying shit like this forever. where were you with this before you mained chun??? any character can beat her and she must be played in a very precise way to consistently win but good luck convincing anyone else who doesn’t main chun or at least play her extensively.

and you know why? cuz newer players and online players just hit buttons and if someone is hitting buttons then chun can just do whatever she wants. that is why they think she is so good, because they don’t know how to play or how not to whiff 80 moves.


#19

No Need to complain about her really. She wont change untill O.E. so learn to counter her moves I guess.
And learning to parry all of her SAII or Atleast that last hit.


#20

VF4 pretty much summed up my opinions.