Vega isn’t shit tier anymore as he was in Vanilla, but between SSFIV and AE, he still could be alot better. IMO, Vega needs one tool, and one tool alone…invincibility on his AA (EX version only possibly). Buffing anything else like damage output per say, would OP Vega, and Capcom knows this, which is why they’re so hard on him. I think a solid, “back the fuck up off me” AA would do the trick to improve Vega’s game without making him OP. Vega has great tools to keep opponents out of the air while on his feet (FBA, Sky High Claw, s.HK, Air Grab), but when under pressure, all he can do is block, tech grabs, hope, and pray.
All I have to say is: Here we go again.
What I want to know, is how invul on Scarlett Terror will fix his AA problems. what would it accomplish? Help you hold down back more and mash cr.mp?
I also want to know, if Vega was shit tier by the end of Vanilla, and would he really be shit tier by now, had Vanilla stayed the flavor. Towards the end of the game, he had tools to force mistakes and put opponents guessing situations.
BTW, fixing invul frames on Scarlett Terror wont fix his AA, unless you still haven’t grasped what Vega is designed to do in this game.
Lastly, why does this exist? There is the Capcom Unity thread, and FYI. I mean serioulsly, the lime light isn’t that great.
why make this thread when we have a 4 page one going about this exact same thing
besides, naerly everyone who talks about “balancing” vega just wants to make him overpowered, that’s not balance
as it stands now, vega is pretty well balanced. he’s probably not as viable as super vega because as emersion said the introduction of the twins was a major nerf, but he’s still a mid-tier or lower-mid character.
SF AE 2012; We’re still going to find something to whine about edition.
we can use H.ST also…it is always valuable to show your opponent he still has to worry about that unsubtle move shitting on his so subtle attack plan. mixups are only getting more powerfull once the opponent has convinced you that the only tools you can use to get out and punish him are too dangerous.
I have a feeling that this patch will do more nerfing than buffing in order to keep the more versatile characters in par with everyone else. So I would not be surprised if they kept Vega the same but weakened characters like the twins.
Lets just hope they work out in our favor.
if Vega truly was balanced we would see him more not only do we never see him win but we hardly even see him get used, hes to much work for a below average character. i don’t want him to be OP i want him to be competitively viable that is something he is definitely not
If they buffed Vega from his Super counterpart (i.e having I frames on EX ST and being able to cancel it , improving hitboxes on cr.hp/st.hk for example) he would have been the type of character Capcom clearly tried to eradicate , a turtle character who could grab the life lead and then became extremely hard to crack. So I don’t think Vega is going to get buffed to a higher position than he was in Super.
I’d be pretty content if they just put him back to Super Vegz. There’s only one buff I could ever want for him, but it’ll never happen (make st.HP recover faster.)
Finally, someone on this page with some since and his head out of his ass. Couldn’t have said that better myself. You people are fucking idiots if you consider Vega balanced right now. No offense.
Right, which was my point in the main post. However, I-Frames on EX ST wouldn’t make him OP, but give him an answer to pressure. And until I see a Vega at least compete in the top 32 at EVO, he’s not balanced properly. It isn’t like that can be debated.
Edit: And when I say compete, I mean actually COMPETE, and not get their asses kicked.
Do you not play Vega? Did you not, in the early days of Vanilla, try to ST your way out of pressure on the wake-up, to find out that it has no I-Frames and that it gets shut-down? (Unlike other wake-up AA’s like SRK, or even Dee Jay’s EX Multi-Kicks)? Stop being a dick for one second on these forums and think about what you’re saying.
Can you stop being a dumbshit for once? Or is that shit a bit to hard for you?
First of all, what you where describing is a wake up tool reversal tool, not a damn AA.
Second of all, if ST would work as an AA for you, then the “people” you play can’t be very fucking good. Who in the fuck is going to let you sit there and build a fucking charge long enough for you to AA them? Or is that the “people” you play are to fucking stupid to realize that cr.mp isn’t some fucking wall that can’t be penetrated? cr.mp doesn’t create the same barriers Mother Terese would put on her fucking pussy.
And what fucking pressure in this game? Block strings are not tight in this game, where having a reversal to an offense initiated while you are standing would be seriously needed. There are plenty of holes, in this “frame traps”, where you can blow people up for hitting you while you block. Or what, you want invul frames and FADC so you can just liberally throw that shit out like Ryu?
You first bitch about ST being a viable AA, and then you change your claim into Scarlett Terror needing to be this reversal for you to use on sup bar block strings, and wake up pressure. which one is it? Because ill tell you this shit right now, that invul frames on Scarlett Terror won’t do you any good, unless you play dumb asses. You want a viable AA, bitch about st.hk and cr.hp not being good enough, because they whiff so much and leave you open badly for doing the right thing.
Why don’t you fucking think for one second, and address the real issues that make Vega such a sub par character and stop spewing some dumb ass shit, that won’t serve to do anything, but make wake up a bit more tolerable? Why in the fuck do I want to give up space while im standing, for the ability to reversal on wake up? What good will that shit do for me? Why the fuck do I want that? it won’t make my character any better in the long run, and still the biggest issue this character has still won’t be fucking addressed. Excuse me for not wanting shit buffs, that won’t do anything for my character.
But no, Im just a fucking dick head right? My head must be fucking lacking hair, and have a slit on the top. All because I’m asking questions about your claims, which again, are fucking half way thought out. Here let me EX FBA a bit more.
Do you not play Vega? Because it don’t fucking seem like it.
I think both of you have legitimate points.
I believe BD is right in saying we should have I-Frames on EX ST; but it’s primary use would be wake-up reversal as Pedo says. However, in the first post BD did say that it would be a great GTFOM move, and that usually brings to mind a move to keep pressure on wake-up off you. I-Frames on EX ST would serve firstly as a wake-up reversal, and secondly as a half-decent AA. Like Pedo says, anybody you can catch with I-F EX ST as strictly AA, meaning they actually jump in at you while you’re sitting on a charge, is probably not a decent player to begin with; meaning, at higher level play, almost no one will jump in on you if they suspect you have a charge (not necessarily a crouching charge), and at least one EX bar.
But therein lies the beauty of it. Pedo says even if we get I-Frames EX ST, we will almost never land it as AA, unless playing against someone stupid. This is true, therefore higher level players will recognize that EX ST can now blast them out of the air and won’t (or more like can’t) pressure as much. It is inevitable. Just because you won’t actually land the EX ST as an AA, doesn’t mean that having it won’t greatly benefit us. It’s more of just them knowing you have it, then you actually using it.
Think of it like having a gun at your waist. Just because you don’t use it is hardly the point. Just having it there will most likely ensure you don’t get fucked with.
Pedo, you also said that cr.mp isn’t a some wall that is difficult for opponents to break through, and I agree 100%. That’s why I think that the argument that Vega shouldn’t have I-Frames on EX ST because it will turn him into some turtle character is greatly flawed. Vega’s cr.mp is a decent poke and great cancel able move, but it’s not the god-like move people make it out to be. It can be stuffed, quite easily it seems sometimes, and only the most dull and stupid player would get constanly stuffed by cr.mp and then knocked out of the air by I-F ST. This is not just realistic. If you are in favor of Capcom strictly catering to the scrubs then that argument is legit, because those are the only people it would affect.
If we got I-Frames on EX ST,and then I went out and treid to cr.mp all day and then EX-ST any jump in, I would get demolished, fast. I would be ripped piece from piece by any average player and I would deserve it. It is a stupid strategy, only scrubs would would get beat by it, and any Vega player who treid to adopt it would be an idiot.
EX-ST with i-Frames would serve as a wake-up reversal 90% of the time. Catching Seth off a wall jump after he drops you, or knocking Yun’s tiny ass straight outta the air as he attempts to dive kick on wake-up, shit like that. It would be near useless as a text-book definition AA, in the sense you wouldn’t get to land it much, but it would be great to have there because people would always give us our 3 feet, they know any slightly unsafe jump in will be punished, since Vega is great at hiding a charge. Of course, this is all assuming we don’t get cr.HP or st.HK fixed.
My only suggestion for Vega that I’ve wanted since Vanilla was for RCF to combo off his normals the way Gen’s roll does. Is that too much to ask? Even if it is just the jab one or maybe EX. I dunno if that’s broken but it’d help if we didn’t have meter for FBA and we were too far for ST to hit. Other than that I’d seriously be fine if any other changes were minor
Vega can combo into RCF off his normals. He’s been able to since Vanilla.
I’m not talking about up close. Have you seen Gen’s he can combo his fierce roll of a max range cr. strong