I’m sorry if I seem to come off noobish, but applying good pressure has always been one of my weeknesses. This becomes excedingly apparent on knockdown; I don’t know what my options are. I hear a lot about safe jumps, etc. Unfortunately, I haven’t been exposed to the fighting game scene long enough to truly understand what that is or what other options are available to stay on the assault; although, I’ve been playing fighters since birth. I’ve familarized myself with E.Ryu’s links and combos, and I find this board quite informative to say the least. If anyone would teach me how safe jumps and pressure works, particularly with E.Ryu, it would be appreciated. Also, if it’s easier, refer me to any web links with useful info.
I’m sorry. I’ve realized this topic isn’t helpful to anyone. I’ll go use the search function to see what I can dig up. Sorry about the double post. I expect this topic will be closed.
In my opinion, pressure is either the act of or the illusion of still being dangerous to your opponent at whatever range you are in. This could be right beside them where you are mixing them up with block strings, tick throws and over heads or from just over half a screen away as you’re chucking plasma repeatedly at your opponent. The idea behind it is that you’re forcing them to do something… whether it’s block, tech throw, escape, throw fireballs back or simply neutral jump over them.
I can offer a few pieces of insight but a lot of this comes from practice and just feeling out the options at different ranges that will be dictated by your play style, your opponent’s and the character you’re fighting against.
I’ll start with what I feel should be used first. Fireball zoning/pressure. There is a range between yourself and your opponent where (barring moves that will travel through fireballs) where it is 100% safe to throw a fireball. No risk at all. To make it easy, let’s assume we’re fighting against original Ryu. This range is, roughly, half a screen a way give or take a few pixels. From this range if they attempt to jump over your fireballs on reaction and do a jump in attack you are able to uppercut them for full damage and not trade at all… or if you’re reactions are a little off that day, just block. This is hugely important as Evil Ryu as you can force people to make poor decisions or force them to stay on the ground. When your timing and technique is strong you can use this to land an anti-air uppercut, FADC, Ultra. This is a punish for about 400 life for your opponent making one bad choice in jumping in on you. You may have to prove a few times to your opponent that you’re capable of this. Once you have though you can throw fireballs out a little more often as they will be hesitant of their ability to punish you by jumping in on reaction. In short, learn this range. Practice it a lot and even set up something in training mode. You have to be able to anti-air people when they jump your fireballs if the situation allows you to.
Pressure seems to be moreso associated with mix ups and attacking your opponent as they wake up. Cool. I’ll give some of my thoughts on that too. You have TONS of options as Ryu when you knock an opponent down. Just tons of them! You can overhead with f+MP, you can cross your opponent up (which I feel is the safest way of doing a jump in on someone), you can tick throw them, you can do a block string, you can bait out reversal by making it look like you;re going to attack or charging a focus attack and back dashing at the right moment to avoid a reversal attack as they get up. Again, this depends on what character you’re fighting but moreso the player you are fighting against. Some people are aggressive when they wake up, some people are more passive. You kinda have to roll the dice to find out and act accordingly. Here are some of my go to pressure options on wake up.
cLK, nothing. Use this just before the opponent is about to stand back up and then throw them. It looks like you’re going to go for a block string so the opponent blocks and you toss them. Next time they get up, use a block string. Haha. It works a lot
cMP, cMP, whatever. You can do a lot from here. The cMP is more or less safe as long as they don’t mash a reversal. If they try to jab out of it they will more than likely eat a counter hit and you can either do a Hadoken at the end of this string, a hop kick to get in close again, overhead, throw. Whatever you feel like here. Feel out your opponent.
Move right in beside your opponent, start walking back as they get up (to block reversals and avoid a wake up throw attempt) then hop kick or stomp kick in. Get’s you right back beside the person and can also generate counter hits (I really like counter hits)
Standard combos and block strings!!!
cLK., cLP, cLP, cMK, Hadoken for instance
cLK, cLP, cMP, Hadoken
cLK, cLP, overhead (f+MP)
cLK, cLP, cLP, throw / walk in and do it again / hop kick (f+MK) / cross up
My favorite option on wake up. Either a cross up or just while standing… cMK, EX Stomp. It hits low and then hits like an overhead. It comes out pretty fast. People seem to be catching on so maybe this will stop working in the future but for now 9/10 times I use this people either eat both the hits or block low and continue blocking low while they get hit by the EX stomp!
These are all just ideas and not hard and fast rules. I like to tick throw people on their wake up a couple of times to get them thinking about teching a throw and then I try to combo them.
It’s important to try to keep the pressure going, or the illusion of it, as long as possible without being reckless. Sometimes a person will block your entire string and give you no openings of any kind and will wait to see what your next move is. So be it. It may very well be that your pressure is over at this point. You have two choices. Walk/dash/jump in and try again or back off and pressure with fireballs. I’m sorry if I’ve said this a lot but you have to find what works best for YOU based on your style and your opponents. I personally really like fireball zoning.
One last thing. You’ll notice of course when someone blocks eventually they’re pushed out of range of your attacks. There are ways to keep it going. Here is an example of something I use to stay constantly in my opponent’s face. It’s aggressive as hell and just an example to show you ways to get back inside and continue the pressure.
Assume this is starting right beside the opponent on their wake up or you did a jump in…
cLK, cLP, cLP, hop kick, cMP, cMP, Focus lvl 2, dash in, cLK, cLP, overhead, hop kick, cLK, cLP, cMP, stomp, cLK, cLP, cLP, focus lvl 2, dash in, etc etc.
The main 3 points here are your hop kick, your focus and dash, stomp as well as your cross up jump ins. You’re closing the distance after a brief but instense series of attacks. If successful you ought to be right beside your opponent again in good position to continue the pressure. Mix it up, have fun. Oh… and every once in a while, be random just a little. Don’t be a robot about it.
Sorry for this massive post brother. I hope it helps or at least sparks some ideas of your own!
I just made a massive reply to this post and it doesn’t show now… damnit SRK.
EDIT: Oh there it is. And no dude it’s not useless to everyone. This is something a lot of people should be asking themselves instead of doing jump back roundhouse and hoping to the gods of scrubdom for their full screen red fireballs to land enough to take out an entire life bar.
Thank you. I’m made sure to read over everything so you’re lengthy post wasn’t wasted – very informative. It’s defintately pointed me in a direction in which I can improve. I appreciate the time you’ve taken to write this. Again, thanks for the help. A lot of good advice here.
Anytime man. I’ve always felt I was better at telling people how to get the job done than actually doing it myself. If you have PSN I’d be happy sometime (barring a decent connection) to play against you and offer some insight.
EDIT: Also, which stomp is better for pressure? I think l.stomp and m.stomp come out at the same speed, but l.stomp is stronger; however, m.stomp is weaker, but finishes in less frames so you can combo into cLP, cMP, etc.
h.stomp is too slow for pressure so I’d probable eat a counter. Okay, so it’s obvious c.stomp is my best option. I think I just answered my own question. Lol
Thanks. Unfortunately, I only own a 360.
For pressure I like the MK stomp. LK stomp I believe you are vulnerable to getting hit back if they block. If you do cMK, LK Stomp it will combo though. MK seems to be safe from most distances. It takes a little longer to start up but should it hit you can do some good combos from there.
Any player worth their salt is able to react to an Axe Kick. This is a limitation I’ve realized recently and so far I believe the only place where those kicks will be utilized is in combos. So far I know that at least MK and HK Axe Kicks can be countered with an shoryuken or a fast normal. Also EX Axe Kick is very easy to react to and thus the only thing I can come up with is to do an FADC EX DS.
^BINGO!! You are correct!!
The best way to pressure with Evil Ryu is to punish whiffed attacks [with cr.MK or cr.MP] and then start the combo machine with the Axe kicks.
I disagree whole heartedly. Each to their own. If you’re throwing out random stomps (especially HK) then yeah people are going to be able to react to it. It’s pretty slow. MK is a lot faster and LK is faster still. You guys should try it if you’re just assuming that people will hit you on reaction. Honestly, you two have some god like reflexes if anytime a person does a stomp you can SRK them. Be thankful!
I’ve been playing Evil Ryu a bit and I’m not 100% convinced that he’s supposed to be a pressure character to begin with. Solid pressure comes from making your offense fast and unpredictable. The pressure mounts with every consecutive hit that you land[or don’t land if you’ve been trix-ty before] as the opponent becomes less and less clear what your next action is making them move closer and closer to attempting invincible moves. This is generally accomplished with 50/50s[or more!]/meaties[fake meaties]/frame traps[vs throws]/Counter Poking/safe guard mashing etc… Now technically E.Ryu has all this with decent frame traps into great dmg i.e c.lpx2 xxkara-throw/s.fpxxdeath, 2 overheads [F+MP being rather far] etc but his advancing[why isn’t f+mk faster…] compared to other low life chars is a bit lacking. Its also not as safe. Baiting out stuff is one thing, but his offense is not ‘tricky’ like say akuma/ibuki/viper. Its straight visable 50/50s with heavy weight on the frame trap that do nothing to avoid shoryus/mashouts/etc. At the very least you don’t need to do it many times if you’re landing the CH s.fp but aside from that…;I believe all his stomps are minus on block so that doesn’t help much either. Mstomp at least is, not sure about L. His pretty awesome FA gets blown up by the top tiers and all this combined with the lower life doesn’t help much. Now what E.Ryu DOES have is great normals [s. strong, s. forward[awesome awesome, like Kens but with the low crush property] s.fierce, to a less extent, come to mind] so I figure he’s supposed to be played more like Vanilla Ryu, push them into the corner with the little dmg far [overhead and fast normals] and then rail on their D when you get there or just zone them more. And if you happen to bait out something unsafe give em the murder face :3.
It’s interesting that you say he plays much like Vanilla Ryu, Raas. Considering what you’ve pointed out, I can see why you wouldn’t really consider E. Ryu to be a pressure character. Regardless, he has enough tools available to play a decent pressure game IF you are resourceful enough.
Well if you score a forward throw or land a EX axe kick. He has a nice mix up game with either dive kick or cross up. I go for it all time and my success rate on the first attempt is probably over 90%. Even then most people continue to fall for it because either A) they’re guessing wrong or B) they’re not use to that Evil Ryu tactic yet like they might be with Seth or Cammy’s dive kick set up.
But anyways, I think Evil Ryu players should add this to there game. It makes ER more dangerous on wake up and if you’re execution is up to par, it’s a good way to start the axe kick combo.
Mr. Naps sending JWong to losers. One of the best American players playing two top tier rushdown chars (Yang/Rufus) vs. E.Ryu.
E.Ryu certainly has mixup options and you can see Jimmy/Mr. Naps use them there. When people are on the ground he doesn’t run away and chuck plasma, he stays in their face with cr.lk/lp games or trying for ambiguous j.mk or dive kick. You would think running away from twins/rufus is the thing to do but not for him. Despite how solid his fireball is you can see that this matchup, like a number of matchups, requires that he be very careful with using it.
I kind of agree with Raas though: first and foremost E.Ryu is a character who plays with a lot of footsies and 50/50s. You hear the commentators mention Naps’ playing style: calm, and then he explodes. That’s kind of the way E.Ryu works both from my observation and in my experience. You get that cr.mp or cr.mk and then you try to combo to FADC or link and explode. Even JWong gets caught walking/attacking…again…and again… by cr.mk. He has very strong normals for footsies/poking. When you watch other high level E.Ryu like Chris G or naruo, it’s not much different. Simply put, E.Ryu has Akuma HP and stun so you can’t just be looking to get in their face and trade/guess constantly. You need to play a SMART game or you will just die, that’s the meaning of a char like this imo.
As somebody said, it’s not like Viper or Ibuki where you are all over them all the time. E.Ryu gets close to you with his tools, then pushes you away with others, then gets close again etc. Trying to catch you for the big damage, or at least poke you out.
The more I play with E.Ryu the more I feel a similarity between him and Tekken 6’s Kazuya. Kaz in T6 is a really good punisher character, probably the best in fact. I feel that Evil Ryu is the best punisher character I have played so far. His combos off 3 a frame jab are devastating so I have made a point of not going out of my way to open an opponent up “Seth” or “Twin” style, which I feel is the biggest error for newer players.
Being realistic, an opponent can get away with 2-3 wrong guesses. Once a life lead has been established taking advantage of E.Ryu’s ability to footsie and anti-air will be paramount. Something important I’ve learned was that pressure isn’t necessarily continual attacking. Sometimes good pressure comes from walking up and just blocking. Remember we have a decent walk speed and do damage like a boss.
E. Ryu sure is a lot of fun to play, much more fun than Ryu. Been taking a lot of punishment to my PP by using him, but it’s worth it.
A few things that I’ve found is that he’s got a lot of ways to throw bait. The dive kick has been pretty safe for me on a whiff, you can combo a DP from overhead MP, and if you make them respect the threat of the cr.MK > fireball and lk Axe Kick you can then use the HK Axe Kick for frame advantage. Do these things work in high level play?
Applying pressure is a tricky topic for a forum post, because the way it’s done can change several times during a match. Best way to put stress on your opponent is just with good fundamentals. AA his jumps. Stand in his bad ranges and in your good ones. Focus on that stuff, and keep reading up on how to play SF, and the fancy stuff you see top players do makes more sense. Without a fundamental base, none of that does you any good.
As for the axe kicks…you can abuse them against a lot of people, but they’re not your best choice. The two you’ll use, leave you at a disadvantage(-6 for lk, -2 for mk). The lk version is even punishable. There’s also a gap in between your normal and the axe kick in almost every situation(cl.mp xx lk/mk axe kick is a true block string) that your opponent can mash through. There will be people out there that will make you very sorry for abusing the axe kicks. You’re also missing out of one of eryu’s best tools. The c.mk xx fireball true block string.
hadoken, hadoken, hadoken… c.mk xx hadoken, c.mp (specially good to counter poke, not that good for pression alone due its short range) s.MK (godlike lol), f.MK, f.HK, f. HP