IC: JP Balltop compatible Suzo 500 Hollow Shafts - Get Shafted!


#1

Update: 2/26/15

Shafts are now in!

Thanks to everyone who helped out! If you pre-ordered your shaft it will be going out tomorrow or saturday!

Pics:

Spoiler

https://arcadestatic.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/shaft.jpg

https://arcadestatic.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/suzo-500.jpg

http://arcadestatic.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/install.jpg

Recently I got a Suzo 500 and was disappointed with the lack of compatibility with japanese handles, dustcovers, and annoying mounting heights with the stock stick, and was going to get a custom hollow shaft made out when i realized that there were a few others who had previously wanted a suzo 500 shaft as well.

Shaft would be hollow to fit 3mm LEDs and there will be 6mm thread to support JP balltops. The shaft would be shorter than the stock shaft and will utilize 8mm E clips (provided by me) instead of C clips to hold the spring flange. There will also be a slot for a flat head screwdriver to tighten and remove the balltop. Stock shaft covers will not be compatible unless they are shortened in length. Shaft will be stainless steel.

Currently the pricing would be $20 per shaft

You can order direct from me by PM’ing me here or emailing me at D2nd_Pryde@yahoo.com

Edit 12-21:
Some users may have seen the last post by me on this thread along with the picture of a prototype shaft. Well that model was thrown out the window… and replaced with one that has even more grooves for more compatibility :smiley:

Thanks to many generous users across a handful of different forums, the new shaft now supports the following sticks:

Suzo 500
Happ Competition
Happ Super
IL Eurostick
IL Compact
and the T-Stik


#2

You should do it, especially since you’ve already done the legwork. I’d recommend posting on the shmups forum if you don’t see enough interest here.


#3

Even though I don’t have that stick I would be interested in helping out if you did a Kickstarter or Indiegogo for it.


#4

If you needed funding you could always take it to Paradise Arcade Shop etc to resell.


#5

already have a modded suzo but i’m supporting this because #stglife

but really, good idea, you have my support


#6

Thanks guys! I’ll check around the shmup forum if nobody wants one here, but even if I don’t get interest I’ll still have one made, yet it’d be nice to drive the base price down if people who also wanted one show interest as well, pretty much killing two birds with one stone :slight_smile: .


#7

So, I noticed you released the CAD files for this. Are they under any particular license?


#8

Not right now.
I do want to have these open to the public should they want to create their own, where in this thread I would just be the medium for people who don’t have access to the resources to make shafts to obtain them. However Seeing the contagious drama from a few days before I’m currently conflicted as to how I want to approach this. What would TT’s recommendations be?


#9

I have no idea because there will be license abuse regardless of what goes on. I personally like BSD and GPL2 licenses but they’re for software.

http://www.ohwr.org/projects/cernohl/wiki

This is basically GPL for hardware in a way. GPL3 for software sucks, but GPL2 was pretty good by many people. This is a similar spirit. Say you release your documentation, then someone copies it and makes a product. Good, that’s ok with the license, but that product also has to be open source so someone else can then do the same. Any modifications must also retain the same exact license, so say someone made a shaft with 4 mm thread instead of 6, or used imperial. That shaft would then have to be released under the same exact license, and someone else can then do the same.

Here is a good FAQ to read over.

@sharpfork‌

Thoughts? What do you think about the CERN license?


#10

Oh, and you can also come up with your own license if you want, but pre-established ones have probably more legal know how put into them.


#11

I bet Bryan at Paradise would be more than happy to help get these done since he makes all of the random shafts and has the manufacturing contacts in place. I had a customer approach me about doing a small run of custom shafts and doing a low volume run without previous business was challenging when it came to pricing. Ultimately, doing around 5 would have made them $40 a piece.

As for the licensing/availability of the files, I can’t speak with any authority, but if you took the time to measure it and design it you can choose to do what you want with those numbers and the cad files. IMHO only those with deep pockets or a desire to add niche products to a shop would really want to take them and use them for a run, this kind of thing is usually beyond the feasibility of one offs because of its cost prohibitive. Frankly, to avoid drama… I wouldn’t make them publicly available.

My only advice, if a shop wants to run them, they should come to you and work out a deal. Make sure you get a signed contract for a set number of them to be made with a commission and be non-exclusive. That gives you flexibility in the long run because you keep the original files and can choose to not do another run with them. Also keep in mind that these aren’t terribly difficult to measure and do on your own… if you have a a pair of calipers and an og shaft.


#12

QFT. @"Jasen Hicks"‌ you are absolutely correct about the difficulty to make a model such as I have, so then I don’t think there should be a problem if its that simple to make. If someone does take it and sells it as their own then so what? They used a high schooler to get what they could’ve made on their own, and possibly better to boot. To be honest I couldn’t care less. What I am attempting to make is already for a niche audience, so it’s not like some pot of gold sitting here, its more like a tiny nugget of silver for those who have an eye out for it.

The more I think about it the more I just want to leave the files there. I mean Tech Talk should be more about seeking improvement through collaboration with others, and I don’t really want this to turn in to something that defies that spirit. This is a forum after all, we come here to discuss things of interest, where in this case that would be tech and, more specifically, hardware. While this may be ignorant I do wish that this forum can help inspire others to create and modify what is provided, the same way I was inspired by the various contraptions previously unthought of coming to realization when I first made this account 3 years ago. I feel that such ideas can be achieved through open source to allow people to create their own variation; one person shouldn’t be the judge of what should and shouldn’t be made, nor should a sole person try to limit it if the sake is for the development of the source where they seek to improve upon or take in a completely different direction that nobody would consider.

I do appreciate both yours and @Moonchilde‌ 's concerns, however I don’t want to betray my original intentions of my project which had this IC had stemmed from, which i have quickly summed up above.


#13

With that being said I decided to compare the measurements I found and took my own. Do what you think seems best with these TT

Spoiler

https://arcadestatic.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/image9.jpg?w=225&h=300

https://arcadestatic.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/image1.jpg?w=225&h=300

https://arcadestatic.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/image2.jpg?w=225&h=300

https://arcadestatic.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/image3.jpg?w=225&h=300

https://arcadestatic.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/image4.jpg?w=225&h=300

https://arcadestatic.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/image6.jpg?w=225&h=300

https://arcadestatic.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/image7.jpg?w=225&h=300

https://arcadestatic.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/image8.jpg?w=225&h=300

https://arcadestatic.files.wordpress.com/2014/10/image5.jpg?w=225&h=300

took these during an earthquake drill at school lol.

I have updated the model as well, increasing the depth of the flathead slot, reducing the thickness of the disc that sits on the pivot, changed said disk’s diameter by a little bit, and reduced the height of the slot for the LS-32 C Clip by .25mm.

Prices have been updated with estimations for 2 levels.


#14

I also agree that working with Bryan ( @armi0024‌ ) from Paradise would be a good way to get these out to market for more than just a limited run. Paradise services more than just the fighting game community after all.


#15

I still don’t see the harm in releasing the shaft models under the CERN OHL. At least that still fits the spirit of your intention, which is sharing information and improvement upon it.


#16

I was reluctant to do so because the original shaft I had modeled was based of the schematic from emphatic, who uploaded the schematic from the BYOAC forum in a post by kowal, in a post I found when trying to figure out how to mount a Suzo. In the end I changed several dimensions to match the requirements to mount in my HRAP. It didn’t sit right with me to have a license for that, and this interest check was not really to generate sales but to get the price down per unit since I remembered sethian0‌ and others across various forums had wanted a shaft. However it seems like I might have angered kowal in the process of this, so I was unsure to license it since I didn’t want people coming in guns blazing, essentially restarting the SLG debate.

This is what led me to verify myself by doing what I originally should have done in the first place: measure my own Suzo shaft. The dimensions for the shaft to c-ring slot, and c-ring slot to shaft base were the same as what I found, with only a difference in .25mm for the height of the c-ring slot. Thus I made a new model previously, changing some of the dims again. The new model in the original post reflects some of these changes. Being spoiled in this age where information is so readily available probably made this even worse. I had only intended for the shaft model to be used in my STG stick, and since I just made my wordpress I didn’t give much thought to uploading the files. When i got the quote for a one off I was surprised when I shouldn’t have been, and asked for a price for 10, which lead me here.

If anything I just wanted to get the shaft into the hands of the people who couldn’t make it nor buy it since Kowal had disappeared.


#17

It’s still based off your work, and if you CERN OHL it, then it will still be available to those who want to make money off it or whatever. So let’s say Kowal gets mad, well, nothing is stopping him from taking the source files, making a shaft, selling it, and including the source files with the license attached.

Plus, say you don’t want to be responsible for selling them after a year of manufacturing them. This enables @armi0024‌ to keep producing them should they be a good seller and maintain the product, and all he has to do is include the source files. Or, it gives him the right to tweak them and release variations of the product, such as long shaft, short shaft, whatever.

Otherwise, with it being unlicensed it could cause issue in the future if these things were to actually get sold.


#18

ill take 2x (if they are metal and they are the same as kowals, dimensions wise)


#19

Dims are different from Kowal’s. Shaft height has been reduced by 5mm, and the disc to keep the shaft from falling through the pivot is half as high. Also the C-Clip slot has been moved 5mm up the shaft so you don’t have to use the collar that sit above the pivot.
Also yes, they will be stainless steel :slight_smile:


#20

Does this mean I won’t need to do this mod: http://www.emphatic.se/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/suzo_o_ring.jpg (the o-ring on the crappy plastic piece). Full mod article: http://www.emphatic.se/?p=870