Is it possible to win a tournament match without RSF?

Greetings all, I made this sort of Q and A faq about playing fuerte without learning the RSF loop…

Q:What is RSF?

A. RSF is combo loop with fuerte that racks up alot of stun damage but is a very difficult move to pull off in the heat of a match
the acronym “Run, Stop, Fierce” refers to a standing fierce attack and then immediately peform a habenero dash, stoping and repeating the loop agin

Q: Do I need to learn RSF in order to win?
A. No, but it does help agaisnt some of fuerte’s harder match-ups, really would not reccomend it unless you are confident it will work; even veteran players sometimes may drop it doing the string

Q:im not that great with fuerte. is there any secret to using him without that RSF thing
A. what you want to do is watch your jumps, figuring out what will work agaisnt your opponet and what won’t…remember it all depends on the player so always assume your opponet knows some high level moves…you really don’t want to be in a poke string war your easiest string would be…lay off the tostada presses… using to many the opponet will figure out…remember all it takes is one round for someone to figure out your playstyle

Q:will fuerte be any good in SSF4? do you think they will remove RSF?
A. Im hoping for some new normals or increase the speed of his pokes and maybe some more health. RSF was fuerte’s last trial in Vanilla SF4 but since titles and icons will not carry over from SF4 im guessing there will be new trials…we will find out at the end of April

any input amigo’s?:woot:

If you can’t do RSF, you suck. If you win a tournament without being able to RSF, your opponents suck even more.

sorry for being a dick but i just agree with brainz.
RSF is very vital for you fuerte game.

i think we got the discussion going around here pretty often. opinions differ.

so that would discourage people who want to main him not to? ive made top 8 and grand finals before without it…this is interesting

There is more discussion on the RSF topic in here:

I believe it is almost confirmed that RSF will be intact in SSF4, this has been posted in one of the Q&A sessions with the developers:

Q: I believe you’re progressing with the tweaking, but please, please, please leave in Fuerte’s Run Hard Punch loop!
A: Don’t worry, I think it will be fine.


This is better meant for the rsf thread. There was already a big stink about this in the punish thread. If you intend to play him seriously, you’d best be practicing your Rsf.

In any serious tournament. You need it. You may not rely on it. But just having it. And using it just once it will put the fear in them.

^ This

This, threat of the RSF even if you don’t get a chance to land it prevents a lot of high risk/high damage moves that people will avoid trying if they know you are able to punish it. If you are just getting damage from run moves (Tortilla/Splash/etc), you really aren’t going to be beating anyone who knows the match-up consistently. All of your damage is coming from guessing games at that point, it’s just luck of the draw at that point, and every trade/hit you take, is hurting you a lot more than the damage you are doing to them.

Let’s just put this to rest for the final time please… Yes it is very very possible to win a tournament (even high-level, without RSF).

I know you’re just trying to make a point, but your logic is not good.

  1. " If you can’t do RSF you suck?" At What? At execution of 1 single combo? Or you saying he sucks at all aspects of Fuerte? No he doesn’t suck at anything except one combo…

2.“If he wins a tournament without RSF, then his opponents must suck?” Not true at all… At high-level play it should be very very difficult for you to land RSF… So if he wins at a high-level tournament, and is not able to land RSF b/c his opponents don’t give him a chance, then the top players suck??? Of course not… But then how did he win the tournament? He won using every other option of Fuerte OTHER than RSF.

Now of course I am just playing devil’s advocate. The real answer is you need to know RSF if you are planning to use him at a high level. It does a great amount of damage, with no meter, and builds meter at the same time. And it’s not just needed for the “fear factor,” it’s needed for pure offensive power. Using ambiguous macho elbow on wakeup is a great option and if you catch him even once with that, and know how to RSF, you just got a 5 hit combo in for great damage. But still… Nobody can say something as definitive as “you cannot win without using RSF” because its just not true.

Remember when this topic came up in that other thread and I got flamed and neg repped 4 times?

Yeah fuck you guys.

The general ELF discussion should just be titled “General El Fuerte Discussion, Learn RSF or GTFO”

This is like asking if Ryu can win without a DP. Of course he can, but he is handicapping himself if he isnt using it.

Yeah, but the DP isn’t a difficult move to pull off.

Look, the RSF is a good combo to know because it at least gives El Fuerte a way to rack up damage in a mindgame where he is usually hit and running, so you want to do as much damage as possible whenever you get an opening. The thing is, the RSF is great, but it isn’t essential. In fact, you can go an entire match without it. In addition, there are a few other combos El Fuerte has. They’re easier to pull off and will do just nearly enough damage as an RSF.

So in summary, no, the RSF isn’t needed, but in any competitive play, you will need combos to do any sort of damage no matter who you play as. El Fuerte just has fewer options than the other characters cause he plays a lot differently.

Read my post again and you will understand that I did not answer the OP’s question.

thats a false statement, you cant compare ryu to fuerte…if that was the case then everyone could RSF

and he made a statement back. I understand what you are saying but you have to look at this from another point of view

too bad rep dont mean shit now though right?

Why does this retarded subject keep coming up?? NO you do not need rsf to win with elf, but it helps greatly. At the last evo I made it out of pools with out ever using rsf cause I sucked. If I would’ve known how to rsf would I have made it alot farther then top 60 yes, I could’nt tell you how many times rsf won me a match at ncr. This point has already been made in the other thread if you cant or dont want to learn rsf have fun grinding out your damage for 50 seconds then losing to one stupid fadc combo. Against top players you can only have so many mind games before they figure you out easily and counter you, you need to be able to do the most damage possible at any given time even if its just 2 fierces into slide.

yeah… anyone that knows whats up will not be as scared because Fuerte’s damage is lousy without it. Mindgames will only go so far.

i would agree. yes, the RSF can keep opponents honest. yes, you can do high damage if you can pull it off. however, it should be clear by now that the RSF is not the game changer that everyone thought it would be when SF4 dropped. sure, it might make him better than dan, vega or guile, but that’s not saying much. so, use it or don’t use it. i don’t think it matters much at this point.

I know my win rate went up considerably once I started landing the RSF more reliably.

i’m entirely unafraid of fuerte who can’t punish me with at least 3 fierces. i’ll just keep playing smart and eventually my hits will rack up and kill him before he kills me. even viper does more damage than he does off of a proper guess.

you need RSF.