ITZ Been Real

gouken

#1

What up folks…

Just curious… Am I the only Gouken user who is thinking of maining Oni?

He is insane.


#2

i thhink if you know how to block he’s pretty average. that said i ate about 50 cross up slashes tonight so right now he’s pretty godlike


#3

im planning on using oni and gouken. switching between them in endless. i love them both


#4

Yeah, but he can hit confirm to any damn thing. Gouken just doesn’t have that luxury. :frowning: His wake up is SUSPECT though, but I can understand why they did it that way b/c otherwise unless he does something stupid it is almost impossible to punish him.

Event though, I’ll probably find a good use for it with adjusting to the distance, I agree the new range on lp palm is dirt shit. From what I can tell, they took about 3 frame traps from him, that shut a good amount of the cast down if they didn’t have meter. :frowning: Ahh… well. More Gouken Flips!!!

LOL… I played with him at bit earlier and was messing around with his links to target combos. etc. etc. His jump arc and cross up game with normals is similar to Goukens. I’ve ever played with a character who can do a lot of hit confirm etc. through target combo’s aside my 3 day stint with Ibuki… and that bitch had too many.

Regardless I’m using Gouken, but Oni is a problem and he is def. getting played. A LOT.


#5

@iam - fuck, thats why i stopped using guy, ibuki and duds lol my memory is BAD and i am NOT gonna remember all those target combos lol fuck that shit in the ear.


#6

Oni seems fun as hell to play. Am I the only one who is less than ecstatic about how Gouken plays in AE? I may be over-reacting and we may figure things out but initial impression is that he didn’t handle the transition too well. Oh well, despite everything Gouken will prevail!


#7

im with you. when i play gouken now, it kinda hurts my dick. new palm is meh but i’ve been able to work around it as it has saved my life some. but i haven’t done any training with new gouken yet, just went straight to ranked, that’s my training.


#8

At first I was about to break my controller over the new lp.palm, but I’m over it. EX tatsu locking is so yay it makes up for it. I really hate not having that lp.palm for armor breaking when people are trying to focus through my straight fireballs though. mp palm is just toooooo fucking risky.

I’m forced to use my normals more now is all along with tatsu. I’m doing ok.


#9

i hated the new gouken for a second… a couple of weeks at the arcade beat it out of my system though.


#10

I had the same train of thought towards the end of the launch day too IAM…but I am going to use Oni as a secondary. I did damned good today with Gouken’s new shit. The cl.st.mp to cr.lp to lp palm is SAFE (except to projectile supers like Ryu’s). Yeah Oni has a lot of hit confirms, but I have lived without for this long, so why would I need it now? But yeah, Oni is cool. Seems a little limited at certain ranges though. I DO like target combos, but Ken has had that ish forever lol. A few of my friends who aren’t a part of this forum highly recommend Oni as a main…but I will have to respectfully decline and use him as a backup.


#11

I’m waiting on the hard disk, I dont have space on my xbox :\

Sounds like AE Gouken isn’t as great as people thought he would be.

My worries about old LP palm and parry nerf seem to be substantiated
If things really prove troublesome, I guess I’ll have to go to my secondary, Fei (He was my 2nd before AE announcement k???)
That said, I can’t wait to try out Makoto, the twins, and Oni. I’ve been messing with Makoto and she was already fun as fuck.
Juri is kinda fun too.


#12

New gouken is almost as good as I wanted him to be. Kongo changes don’t really matter to me but the lp palm nerf hurts his extended combo ability because mp palm doesn’t combo from a cr.hp that isn’t almost point blank. I hoped it would have tatsu range so you could buffer it in footsies to break focus attacks without thinking about it but I guess not.

Lp palm was not safe to use in footsies. Occasionally it works to throw out but it was srk or ultra-able of reaction as well as neutral jumpable. Overall a poor risk reward ratio even if u had the safe palm spacing down raw without the fireball cover.

Ex tatsu is such a great anti air and he reaaaaally needed it. Save your meter and get that ex tatsu reaction anti air down.

The close st.mp after divekicks is so beastly, so easy to frame trap boxer jabs and crouch techs. So easy to grab, I always hear the jab sound as my throw connects :slight_smile:

Oni to me suffers from not having anything that allows him to abuse the sfiv engine. Once you learn to block his weird crossup thing and the overhead special I think his offense is limited. Gouken hs dive kicks, they allow him to safely pressure on any knockdown, oni can’t do that. He’s got a srk so his defense is good, he’s like the opposite of gouken, good defensively, average offense. Of course this is day 1 talk, could be totally wrong. All I know his his jump hk is buff


#13

Gouken seems the same to me. I don’t plan on picking up oni though, there might be other hidden things about AE gouken that I wanna find out. Gotta dedicate my time to gouken


#14

Yeah, I just need to put some time in with AE Gouken and figure out how to use his cl.mp effectively. I was just so surprised by his lp. palm nerf. I’ve been able to use it in a few situations but it’s also gotten me in trouble more than once. Also, his kongo is frustrating as hell to use now. The fact that the same attack can require two different kongos depending on if it is meaty or not will take some getting used to. I need to put in the time to figure out his cl. mp. Its a tool I didn’t use very often in Super but if he can use it for frame traps on crouch techers then consider me very interested.


#15

Really unhappy with the Jab Senkuu. Now I can’t punish a blocked Hawk dive and poorly spaced Blanka Rolling Attacks among many other things, as well losing his juggle and FADC combos.
I’m also a little frustrated with his Kongo changes. The whole point in my mind, of Gouken not having a Shoryuken was the fact that the Kongo took out all jump attacks for a price: a good read/guess. Now you have to do that twice for the type of jump attack? Not happy. And I was also against using EX Kongo in general for I believed it encouraged laziness in trying to find out about my opponent: I wanted make it my business to know exactly what move they will go for. Sure, that luxury of being this dedicated player who wants to always study his way to victory will not always be there, and at times, you will go for the EX Kongo because you don’t know what attack is coming - only that one is coming. But it was something I strived to achieve.

While the EX Tatsu seems a more viable anti-air, my thoughts on anti-air with Gouken in SSF4 was that his crouching Fierce and crouching Forward should beat all attacks if you know your spacing. When these two moves fail time and time again, even after countless attempts to space and time them just right, it is then that you should go to the Kongo to beat that specific attack. Of course the reality is a lot different from this ideal philosophy, and I found myself using nearly everything else but the EX Tatsu (neutral jumping Fierce, other air-to-air moves, positioning oneself so as to be able to use the Fierce Hadouken more etc.) for air defence. So, because of that I never even acknowledged the opponent’s falling out midway to be much of a problem, nor was I particularly excited about the new lock-in property. But it’s a very nice thing to have, I’ll give it that.

From a day’s worth of playing, I think he’s pretty much the same in terms of strength: his Jab Senkuu combo nerfs from SSF4 are exchanged for the new combo options with his links and juggle-capable jumping Roundhouse and neutral jumping Fierce; and his EX Tatsu buff may have been in part an attempt to alleviate his Kongo nerf, as well as fixing what should have already been fixed after Vanilla. But that just seems like change for change’s sake, with no sense of direction to make him stronger nor weaker.


#16

I’m all with you on this one. New gouken sucks pretty bad for me. I’m moving to someone else as soon as I figure it out.

EX tatsu = great.
lp palm = good and bad. it’s gonna take time to figure it out.
st. mp = ok
st. mk = ok
backthrow = very bad
kongo = blows ass so hard it breaks half of my game.
j.hp = good
dj.hk = good
j.mp into air tatsu = ok


#17

The jab palm thing is annoying but only when you need it to stun people or vs akuma. Normally I would advocate fadc and the cr.hk to allow you to run the safe dive mixup again.

People lamenting the kongo nerf? You guys are funny! I wonder what you guys were doing in super if you think he’s been nerfed. He’s way better now.


#18

im just need to remember that lk kongo doesn’t exist anymore.


#19

We were playing him the way he had been for the last 2 years or whatever. You just started playing him 2 months ago and decided to play him like he was AE Gouken :wink: Of course you would love the new cl.mp and the fact you never used kongo means you would never miss the old one :stuck_out_tongue: I love the new cl.mp as well, but I do really miss the Kongo.


#20

I think Gouken has too much pushback on his close normals that it is hard to combo stuff after linking!
Oh i faced a couple of amateur Yuns and my goodness, I don’t know what answer Gouken has to them. And these were no pro Yuns. They were just messing about with his moves. Once he’s on you its near impossible to break free. ANY button I touch results in a counter hit!!! WTF? I mean Gouken’s get off me game has never been that good but Jeebus this is ridiculous!