Mai has one.
Thanks for posting this btw
That’s the same thing I replied in the Dreamcancel forum.
You forgot to mention Robert must have one of the best raw Neomax of the game, doable with 2 bars using the 3 buttons tigerknee trick.
I don’t even think this character got ONE bad match-up.
He also has some pretty decent normals. St.CD is quick as hell with good range, j.CD is good for air to airs, cr.C anti-airs, cr.D is cancellable and very long ranged, f+A is an anti-air launcher, f+B is a low, shit the list goes on.
Spent some more time in practice mode with him today, trying to squeeze out better damage for the meter spent. He can get 404 damage with a single meter, 480 something with 1 meter 1 drive, and 850 damage HD off 4 meters midscreen. This is just sort of preliminary exploring of what he can do. I’m sure there’s better HDs out there. For now the numbers aren’t spectacular but they aren’t weak either. I just wouldn’t put him as an achor until I find something more efficient. He looks strong to me as a point character.
Could you please elaborate on this tigerknee trick?
Also, for some combos you could look at the Robert Garcia thread.
When doing the neomax in the air using B+C+D, Robert activates HD mode in the same time, so only 2 bars is spent (King can do the same, but her Neomax kinda sucks, so…).
The tiger knee is just doing back+up after the motion to do it as soon as Robert leaves the ground.
Robert may have everything, but his version of most things are weak, and in real match situations hurt the character. His command grabs have startup and no invulnerability, so they lose to hitting buttons for defensive attack/throw os off say an empty jump setup or just someone reactionary hitting buttons in general, so delayed reactionary low B or something would beat his run up low B/ command throw mixup. They much commit to blocking which massively brings down the situations where the throws will work, and even the EX does not lead to great damage due to scaling. He has a command cross-up, but his jump is floaty, making it one of the easiest to guard in the game, and along with the command grab problems and no overhead, he could have problems hitting a player with good defense. His dive kicks have some tricks but they are in no way good enough to say ‘he has a divekick’. He is not Yuri or Rufus haha.
The best thing about him is his fireball and dp + b flying kick game, hands down. His fireball travels at the best possible height to zone in this game, and his dp is good. Neutral jump cd is good too. But that becomes a liability when many players choose Mr. Karate point. The same applies to other zoners, but I think all other zoning characters have better options up close than Robert does in this game. If you were to switch Robert to another position, you are now weakening your team so the point that you may as well remove him because you just aren’t getting the most out of him being on point. The purpose of him on point is that you want to maximize the amount of time he lives, by zoning, building meter and keeping a lead to set up for the rest of the match. He is not the type of character to enter the trenches with the rest of the brawlers to be killed in a few hits + 1 HD combo.
Updated personal tier list for KOFXIII
EX Iori is in the S tier now… because, the player can resort to many play styles with the likes of Iori much like you could with 98… sort of. A very nice QCFx2+P which is a nice finisher for 1 stock combos and damaging! Beautiful to watch! Nice variety of HD combos and tools. The resident swiss army knife! Use with caution!
Robert is bumped up a tier. Why? Ask Air Lancer and cygnus for more information - a standard character through and through. (Despite seeing him almost every time I go online). Lots and lots of helpful command moves, too.
Elizabeth… Betty goes up one tier. She is very solid, does a lot of damage easily, two DM’s for a good cause, several counter moves, quick meter building… and last but not the least, she possesses unique mobility.
Saiki goes back down because he suffers the same problem as Leona does: The majority of his special move aren’t even safe at all. Also, Saiki needs to rely heavily on his zoning tools to be super effective.
Goro is in the A tier area now. He has several anti-air options, easy combos, and he is a very good grappling, much like Vice and Clark is. (Especially Clark 8-). I swear, there is something about Clark destroying people with his auto-guard throws in general that just makes me laugh… even if I’m the one suffering from it because the way he attacks is funny to me).
Ash is bumped down a tier - Not that it means much… His normals are kind of stale, however.
Again… if there are any problems please feel free to make corrections about the said characters (I got a feeling I should elaborate on Betty’s, Leona’s, and Goro’s placement a bit more). Just so you guys know… Mature is on the brink of getting bumped up one tier too… her tools are really nice. But, she lacks command moves…!
Mmmm…i have to say, really? on Terry’s position, i definitely think he is a solid Mid Tier, there is no way he is that low, he has great normals and great Ex Moves, his chains and super moves are relatively easy to land, his air to air combat is not bad at all, has a terrific wake up move, sure, he has issues, like the fact that his HD combo and neo max is kind of bad but aside from that, i think he is a pretty solid character.
Fixed… Terry is… pretty weird in this game…
I don’t think he is that weird…in fact i think he is too basic and probably that’s why he is underrated, i mean, people is probably always searching for the characters with the mixups or best hd combos and all and that’s perfectly fine, however, when it comes to basics, Terry is the way to go (ok, to be fair, Ryo is the way to go and Ex Iori because you can play whatever style you want with him) but still, Terry has some great tools as well as some shortcomings…but as bad as Maxima? not a chance.
Also, as a big Leona player…i don’t think she is A tier, neither Athena, would like to share your views on them?
The damage output of Terry is kinda crippled in the wiki because they start all the combos with St. C. Using St. D is much more efficient. There is no problem hitconfirming either because of the followind down forward C.
HD combo with Terry is a bit tricky because you somewhat have to do something different depending on your position on screen. But with 2 bars he can score close to 800, and up to 900 with 3 bars. Ok, it’s not Takuma, but it’s doing the job.
Terry’s damage isn’t great (unless it is those tricky HD combos mentioned above) and he is based around frame traps and not solid mixups. He has some nice cross up set ups but even if the ydo land the damage you get for the resources you spend isn’t that fantastic. I don’t think he is on the same level as say Maxima or Mai but he isn’t one of the stronger characters in the game. Still, he is really annoying and can get you playing really stupid if you start hitting too many buttons against him when he forces you to block.
I like Goro in A. He is great at rewarding guesses for very simple execution. Some very good buttons up close to frustrate people. I think he is a really good pocket character to have for tournaments for certain matchups and against people who may not have faced a decent one before. 3 bad guesses in a row and your gone… very demoralizing.
Saiki still deserves to be S in my opinion. His zoning game is just so good, not enough people play him.
Leona is pretty decent at controlling space, I am not quite positive to where exactly I would put her atm but somewhere around A-.
Ralf is pretty meh… B+ish maybe A-. His buttons are a little overrated (still really good just not as extremely godlike as some people make them to be). Great damage for the little resources he has to use… but hard to open up people sometime. I wish he could combo off his normal throw in the corner and make his st. C hit crouching characters.
Chin should be a little higher. Nothing to do with cafe ID’s opinion on him… but Chin is pretty good.
Bored at work so i made one as well ^^. Sections are S, A+, A, B, with the top row having a slight edge. it gets pretty hard after the obvious choises tho. Feels good to finally play a great 2d fighter with good balance.
After some time spent in the practice mode, I came with this with Terry (starting with low chain lights, stand C or D, jumping. The standard starter for low chain lights is cr B, cr B, cr A, cr C) :
1 bar : 300 to 370
2 bars : 425 to 500
50% Drive : 300 to 370
50% Drive 1 bar : 385 to 450
50% Drive 2 bars : 450 to 540
That’s for the non HD combo. For these, like I said, between 750 and 800 with 2 bars, and up to 900 with 3 bars.
My tier list: http://www.mmcafe.com/tiermaker/kof13/index.html#ya0-trar2te22sdl4v9r6ued90a94w9g8xg190je91bx4wj42uhq91i36vegbphg2sd46vjs6vf54vgt4xlf6ugg6ul393k34vcn8xb28yie4wbg6vlq4vg7bqes6vmq918l4wkp2sne4vfq2rce2s-bkf
Note: it will most certainly change
I question every tierlist that doesn’t have Shen on the highest tier level.\
And there’s no way you can have Clark on the same level as Shen and Kim.
Edit: Joe is actually pretty strong and I’m not sure why hardly anyone uses him except Hare Goro, who makes him look S tier.
I think it was only Lacid/kmg that said this, don’t make up things.
MAD, Koogle and Lacid made some lists
Joe just isn’t very good unless you know his TOD combo. That’s all he’s got going for him aside from good shoto-style zoning and a frame trap with his Fireball.
Shen is not top tier. His damage is good and he’s really easy to use. That’s about it. He doesn’t have the amazing air control or footsies that can shut you down in the corner like Kim. He doesn’t get 800 damage with 1 drive and 2 bars like Hwa Jai. Etcetera. He’s definitely good, but I’d put him in the lower end of the top tier spectrum.
I’d actually place Clark at high mid-tier.
Updated tier list
- Mature is bumped up one tier. She possesses so many options when it comes to offensive pressure. She fits into every position easily, has impressive normals, block strings, reliable methods of opening the opponent up and breaking their defense.
- Raiden is bumped up a tier. His priority and defensive game is insane. He also fits into any team position and is quick to juggle the opponent. Players should really be on the look out for general rush down tactics, along with his speed.
- C tiers no longer exists due to the overall nature of the game…