Last Dread Dust?

cody

#1

I mostly use U1 because of it’s comboablity, I know U2 is great though, and I know it is a good punish ultra. I’m just wondering if anyone can link a guide for U2 or if someone could pretty much sum up when you should use U2 instead of U1.

Note I already know that U2 is a good fireball punish ultra, but I’m looking for more uses than that. I’m starting to think U1 is all around better but I see U2 used a lot so, any help would be awesome.


#2

first, i believe U2 does more damage, but tahts only if you get all the hits. thats pretty much all i know. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:
oh and also, you can combo from ex bad stone (maybe it has to be CH but i forget). also, U2 is much MUCH faster and has way WAY more range. near the end of Super, i just picked U2 by default unless it was adon or …yeah just adon for me


#3

you can combo off it with a counter hit crhp xx ex rocks, ultra 2, you can also combo off it with a counter hit f-mp and a counter hit s hp, timing is trick but top level codys pull it off , i only use ultra 2 in a couple matchups, rose, chun li, vega, ibukil, basically what ends up happening is a option select there backdash becuase those characters use backdash a lot, landing it raw is best ideal situation, i rather use u1 other matchups becuase you can always rely to combo from it. i always fine myself trying to look for a way to land ultra 2 with fireball characters and never end up doing so and it takes my mind off the match,


#4

u2 has 7 frames start up and a long reach, making it perfect to punish various moves. blocked shoryuken, headbutt, blanka ball, hell even a blocked sweep and various more. it also does quite a decent amount of chip damage, and is unavoidable for many characters. further you can combo the dust part to kill a low hp opponent after nearly everything. in particular after ex zonk. won so many matches for me…
u1 is just a “mere” damage increase, because you could combo into mk ruffian / f.hk, ex cu for damage aswell (not as much tho), while u2 gives you entirely new utility.


#5

Well it seems like it’s pretty much preference. I can land his U1 pretty easily in almost every match, and I just like ultras you can combo into more than punish ultras. I know you can combo into U2 from a counter hit but that can be pretty hard opposed to h.ruffian FADC or EX Zonk FADC. Regardless I’m going to start using U2 a little more to see if I can find some “tricks” in some match ups. I think the speed at which U2 comes out is one of the best parts about it, I think with some time I can find which match-ups are suitable for U2 and which are suitable for U1.

Feel free to post your opinions about either Ultra though, because I feel like Cody is one of few cast members that has 2 good ultras for many different reasons.


#6

I’ll just list pros and cons of each ultra.

Ultra 1: Final Destruction
**
**
Pros:
[LIST]
[]Combos off of:
[/LIST]
[INDENT=1]1) Ruffian Kick -> FADC[/INDENT]
[INDENT=1]2) EX Bingo -> FADC[/INDENT]
[INDENT=1]3) Well timed Anti-air Bad Stone[/INDENT]
[LIST]
[
]Invincible (I don’t know exactly how many frames)
[]Great as an Anti-Air
[
]More reliable in terms of being able to connect
[/LIST]

Cons
[LIST]
[*]Slow Start-up
[/LIST]

Ultra 2: Last Dread Dust
**
**
Pros:
[LIST]
[]Combos off of:
[/LIST]
[LIST=1]
[
]CH F+MP
[]Cl. MP (Strict timing, 1-frame link)
[
]CH Cl.MP (You get +3 frames)
[]EX Rocks
[
]Cl. HP (Meaty)
[]Knife Cr.HP
[
]St. LP (you seriously need some god-like timing with this though)
[]CH Cr. MK (Meaty)
[/LIST]
[LIST]
[
]7-Frame start-up. Fast Punisher. If used up-close to your opponent and he tries to jump away, he’s gonna get hit no matter what.
[]Trades projectile hits with Ultras such as Guile’s Sonic Hurricane, Ryu’s Metsu Hadoken, Sagat’s Tiger Cannon, etc.
[/LIST]
Cons:
[LIST]
[
]****Stupidly punishable. If you try to anti-air someone with it, very few times it will connect the whole ultra. If it doesn’t, your opponent will be able to recover in time is guaranteed to punish you.
[/LIST]
I pick U1 over U2. I hardly ever use U2 because of how vulnerable it leaves you. The only times that I would use it is after an LP Criminal Upper(sometimes they think they can punish you). Another time is if they have a few pixels of life left and I want to chip them to death.

I see this useful against
[LIST=1]
[]Zangief (if he lariats or misses a Pile Driver)
[
]Projectile-happy characters
[]Dive kick happy opponents (gotta have good reaction to time their landing, they are usually -5 or so)
[
]Teleport characters (Use this as an option select)
[/LIST]
In the past, I have landed U2 on jump-in attacks, but that requires pretty strict timing too. Usually, they have to be at exactly 45 degree angle when you start up your Ultra. It hits when they land.


#7

Great post man thanks, it pretty much summed up the way I feel about the Ultra. I mainly made this thread in hopes that some people would post some of their experiences with U2 and why they like or don’t like it. Again, nice post. Hopefully some more Cody playing peeps will come on here and post what ultra they mostly use, and why they think it may or not be better.


#8

U2 all day

Like Zukuu said u1 is only a mere damage increase and it has a chance of whiffing even if you do the FADC>ultra purely based on the distance that you do it which is unreliable, its horrible start up also makes it not useful for any other situation other than the FADC combo. I would only use U1 for Adon, Zangief,viper, Fei long and Rufus since U2 serves little purpose vs characters like this.


#9

U1 is a better choice on Gief. It’s a free ultra anytime Gief jumps (and he will).
U1 also is better on dive kick characters minus rufus. Easy roundhouse ruffian>FADC>Ultra. If they’re smart, they won’t keep jumping around. U2 is better against Rufus for EX messiah punish or a punish after OS EX messiah.

Only other character I overall recommend U1 on is Adon. Otherwise, U2 is much better on punishing half the stuff the rest of the cast does.

Why U1 on viper? You can OS U2 on Viper’s wakeup.


#10

I see what you are saying but if you are relying on a punish to use your ultra, doesn’t that mean you have to kind of rely on your opponent making a mistake? I know on reaction you can punish stuff but that is easier said than done. Unless we are talking about easy stuff to punish i.e. *missed DPs, *missed ultras. I’ve seen so many Codys not use their U2 because the opponent isn’t making the mistakes needed to use it, or they use it on reaction but act too soon/late and they get punished.

It’s all situational I guess because you said that U1 is good against Gief because he WILL jump, but if he doesn’t? I think U2 is good against Gief because if you can bait a lariat you can just kick the dust and punish all day.

I also notice that Sasaki uses both ultras, but I see him (I haven’t watched every single Sasaki fight ever) use U1 a lot and he lands it often. On the other hand when he uses U2 I see him use it a lot to just end people with low HP mostly on jump-ins.


#11

U2 is great because it fills a gap in utility Cody normally has. U1 can’t do that.


#12

lol, perfect example. in high level play, nobody is gonna do a random srk or even a missed ultra, theres not gonna be times to “punish moves” you gotta open your opponet up with frame traps which can lead to a combo to ultra 1. , ultra 1 is just better, nobody is gonna do a unsafe move at high level play, as i said before the only real way to land it is it combo into it or option select backdashes on certain characters,

also you can land ultra 1 off of crack kick if you are really good you can combo into ex rocks crack kick ultra 1,

also a way to land ultra 2 is combo into ruffian fadc crack kick ultra 2 just the dust hits and sometimes that will kill you opponent.

what it comes down to is perference, if you want to play “looking” to punish your opponents with ultra and end up not hitting it off becuase on high level play your not gonna land it most of the time or spend your time trying to frame trap your opponent to combo high damage or ultra.

the way i play with cody is i try to stun the person as fast as possible and when i do i focus attack ultra, usually ko’s the opponent. especially if you dizzy them with a jab or overhaed, if its a stuf with a long combo i go for a reset


#13

Can you explain? Elaborate a little bit?


#14

with U2 you now have a new way to deal with projectiles, hell even blocked specials or sweeps can land you a U2 punish.

Can’t tell you how many times I’m gonna get chipped out from a wakeup fireball and U2 saves the day.


#15

There are times Ultras don’t go used. But because that ultra’s there, the opponent has to worry about it as a threat. So if Cody has U2 against Ryu who generally zones with fireballs, ryu can’t chuck them out at a certain distance or else he’s getting punished for it.

Now Ryu just lost one of his most important tools in a matchup because he can’t do cr.MK>Fireball or chuck them out constantly from sweep distance due to U2 sitting there. You don’t always need to use the ultra to scare an opponent. Just picking it changes some matchups a lot. When will gief ever randomly lariat on Cody? Not when most of Cody’s specials are unsafe up close, he’s better off just doing the safe option and command grabbing him. Also with U1, Gief stays on the ground and is forced to play footsies or eat rocks. He still has to worry about fake rocks to bait a jump, which will result in HK Ruffian>U1 or HK Ruffian>MK Ruffian if high enough.

There’s a lot more that plays into it outside of “oh well this punishes this so that makes it better”. How the opponent plays also comes into play. But the general route is that U2 overall has more uses than U1 in most matches. Cody has tools to make characters push a button to punish with U2. It’s just a matter of “are you a good enough player to make your opponent whiff a button or do something unsafe?”


#16

I see what you are saying. I will try out U2 for the next week or so and see how I can fit it into my game. One thing though about Gief I was talking about throwing rocks until he lariats then punishing him for it, but I guess if he is good he wouldn’t lariat he would just jump. Anyways I’ll give it a try for a bit and see what happens.


#17

Most vipers will be spending most of thier time in their air or attacking your from a distance that you can’t use U2 from, so i personally don’t see the use of the ultra in the matchup. Since viper will be doing a lot of burn kicks during this match their will be a decent chance you will be able to hit her with a hk ruffian>U1.I’m not sure U2 is the smartest thing to do on vipers wake, it may be able to catch ex siesmo attempts but if she does her dp the ultra will whiff or hit her airborne so she would be able to punish you after.


#18

If you are aiming for frame traps, Ultra 2 works even better because you can get CH s.hp, ultra 2. and you wont be dependent on having 2 meters.
ch s.hp xx ex rocks, ultra 2 or ch c.hp xx ex rocks, ultra 2. wont be corner dependent.
If you are mainly doing focus attack, ultra. ultra 2 does more damage.

Most of the time viper does burn kick so fast that you won’t be able to AA it with HK ruffian anyway.
You can Ultra 2 through all seismos and it’s easier to punish hk thunder knuckle with ultra 2. you can also punish whiffed mp and lp thunder knuckles easier with ultra 2.

A good gief will do whatever it takes to get through projectiles. Ultra 2 is easier to punish lariat, green hand.
Cody should never depend on hk ruffian to anti-air. depending on the angle and distance they are jumping at, anti-airing with b.mp or s.hk might be a better choice.

Everything is dependent on your opponent making mistakes. if you can AA hk ruffian fadc ultra 1, then jumping was a mistake by your opponent. if you are frame trapping your opponent and you get a counter hit, pressing a button was a mistake by your opponent.

For example, Adon vs Ryu. Adon uses ultra 1 ALWAYS. he lands it maybe 1/10 rounds. If he used ultra 2 he would land it 8/10 rounds. But a good Adon player will ALWAYS use ultra 1 against ryu.

Another example, Cody vs Ryu. There will always be a time when ryu does a dragon punch without meter to fadc to make himself safe. in which case its easier to punish on reaction to a blocked dragon punch with ultra 2. If a ryu ABSOLUTELY refuses to dragon punch without meter to make himself safe then you throw him to death. if he starts crouch teching, then you counter hit him which will STILL lead to ultra 2.