Low Tier system potential


#1

http://www.mypicx.com/01242009/mvc2_low_tier_rules/

the one on the left is the basic ratio system with red boxes around some of the ratio 1’s that I think are cheap.

the one on the right is the same but i just block out the characters that i personally think are the lower tier in this system.

I’ve put in a retarded amount of work with the low tiers as well as shoultzula, this is my personal list though.

this thread isnt about why i shit on ur char or whatever, it’s just a reference for someone who might want to build good teams. I dont have much low tier tourney experience but i spend probably half my time playing marvel with this crap.


#2

What I think would be a fun thing to do would be to hold local tournaments every week or every other week and every next tournament to ban the most used character from the previous tournament. Should be fun in my opinion, especially once only around 20 characters will remain.


#3

nice list, i just made one or two little amendments no biggie

I like low tier a lot, its funny how the tiers are more crowded at the top than at the bottom with no big 10.

I think Hulk is good though :]


#4

mike has captain america blacked out. I like him. Very good AA that does good life, good priority on point, good bnb, great back dash, instant overhead, double jump, flip is invincible. He’s got tools to make something work imo.

hayato probably deserves a little bit more respect. He’s got some things that help him out but I like capam over hayato.

hulk I like too but mike brought up some good points. You can use cheap shit like cammy\hulk to get a fast DHC on either the point or helper for some quick life but if the hulk has to make a come back, the chances of that are slim if played properly. He’s only good in a few spots. When he’s dhc-ed into and then he has the life lead forcing the game to come to him. The other is when he’s the 3rd character. As the last character, he’s not your mid game strength. You can give that spot up to a better character and you can hor his dash type helper for easy assist damage. Also as the 3rd, he’s got stamina and in most cases, you’ll have bar to do damage.

my 2 cents.


#5

sure cap has a couple of the basic tools.

He has a horrible zoning game, very hard for him to punish assist, avg projectile game at best, decent normals and shitty mobility(the flip is ok but it doesnt exactly help out vs projectile floods)

The best tools he has are a double jump and his normals, hardly a noteworthy character imo. his assist also goes too high making it more difficult to cover.

hayato is funny and all but i dont see him using jump forward + normals and ground plasma string+ helper to get in on the better duos and teams.

they are blacked out for multiple reasons.

30 characters competitive characters left is a crazy number for any game.

the only crappy characters that i left in there, bbhood akuma venom and thanos, each do something well and each are much better than the characters that i blacked out.


#6

I disagree about Jin and Sabretooth.

Jin may be ass on point but his AA is good enough to make him usable.

Sabretooth isn’t that bad. His assists are decent and he has good speed and damage output. He’s one of the few low tier characters who can easily do half life damage without an assist.


#7

I’ve seen your vids mr goat, you know what you’re talking about w ur low tier.

i’d like to ask have you ever tried jumping in on some stupid char like bison or guile with tooth? he has no air priority whatsoever. even though i personally love his damage output, i dont feel like he competes with most launchers and zoning games…

I will agree that jin has a useful assist(2 of em) and a couple good supers, however plz keep in mind that i simply said i dont use him to build my own teams. his point game is so crappy even with his gdlk airthrow :[

remember everyone, one of them is my own personal preference, the other list is a basic list that i didnt really modify.

my personal teams

bison(puff ball)/ruby (spike)/sonson aa
bison(same)/gambit(proj)/sonson aa
omega red throw/morrigan balance/sonson
thanos(proj)/jug(dash)/collosus(aa) funny combo w this team

thanos on point, clk,s.fk+collosusXXbubble, dash in b.fkXXbubble then qcf+kk

after u combo into collosus, he lands behind the opponent and pushes the character into you, no pushback for a moment basically, lets u get a rep of b.fkXXbubble, does around 132 pts. that rock super is crazy

post up ur low tier squads using this system Dgoat…


#8

lol, it’d just be:
Cammy (AA)/Filler (with decent assist)/Sonson (AA)

My low tier game revolves around Cammy. Once she dies I’m kind of screwed.

Filler= Chun Li (expansion), Sabretooth (Projectile), Bison (Puffball or expansion)
Without Tron Rings or Doom rocks to counter her, Cammy is going to be a force in this format.

Sonson AA is too good.


#9

Cammy = block low + roll. :looney:

Insane launcher priority and AAA i will admit however.


#10

if cammy throws you and you roll, she creates ambiguous angles during your dash like magneto.

she can clk in the middle of ur sprite for a late switch

she can clk or clp + assist and then that will push the sprite thru u after u cross them up, 2 crossup…

shes impossible to block if you roll :[


#11

Yeah thats true, but it just turns into a guessing game at that point. If you wait to roll until the dash up, then guess right and call psy, it can mean cammy eating it just as hard if she tries to force the issue.

Her corner game is really good. And i wasn’t giving honorable mention to those post roll game shenanigans for sure.


#12

Hey, maybe I am not using mypicx.com correctly due to my unfamiliarity with it, but I don’t see anything when I follow the link. Sup?

A reference to build good teams. Like, we post the characters we are interested in and you help with team dynamics amongst the system?

there was something else you wrote that I wanted to ask for more input on, but I have to find it real quick and quote it…

here we go:

plz elabor8

Also, I agree that Sabre isn’t a defective char:
-he has gd poke range
-1 button walk-up, 2-hit launcher
-nice recovery on block for his main 2 specials used for forward movement
-good ground speed
-he is fairly large, which can work against him in most cases, but also tends to give him a plus as far avoiding most x-up scenarios based on jumps from some low-tiers when he is standing (e.g., shoto j.hk sf3esque x-up)
-he can set up OTG scenarios in at least 4 different ways: c.hk, qcf+P, hcb+P, throw
:u: couple that with a projectile assist that gives him more liberty to move in and out and slash about, and he is quite a force

I tend to play Sabre in Tooth-proj/Hood-proj/Hulk-dash (mix on vidness’ vidkill)

with hood proj on-screen, his freedom can be deadly to most low-tiers: he can throw you into it air-to-air at NJ height; he can land a KD and force you to block it on roll; he can pull multiple dash up attempts (~3) behind 1 missile call; he can use hcb+P to break out a mild 50/50 in regards to blocking the missile; it covers his ass vs most assists and even vs most clean hits which allows him to get back in and possibly retaliate off of it; FS into missile runs into a near 100% DHC set-up into Hood

and with Hulk-dash, he basically gets a nice 1,2,3 string into a fairly safe Birdie call poke that lets him use the shots to:

a) break up whatever hit you landed on him in the midst of him calling her
b) use it to layer on a Hood missile call and move in

main thing i miss on that team tho is invincible aa, but the trio still does rather well; sabre’s qcf+P gives him the choice to avoid air-to-airs in favor of missile call x-up into super, qcf+p xx super, dash-up OTG, walk forward/backward for roll mix-up to let you re-guess for the next s.fierce + missile, etc, etc

also, he is not a meter hog and builds meter rather well for the duo/trio super kill

I like him.


#13

Easier said than done.

See 3:15 for an example of what Mixup is talking about re: rolling


#14

http://www.mypicx.com/01262009/mvc2_updated_bum_tier_list/

I updated it one more time

the characters in gold are the best characters imo(anakaris and chun li are the two ratio ones that i put into this category)
the light blue char are the other r2’s that are good
the red characters are the r1’s that are good
the characters that are not highlighted are r1’s that i feel still compete but not as well as the red r1’s for whatever reason

venom has really good mobility but has no hitboxes for above his head when sj’ing or air to air, bad launcher…

thanos has crazy supers and stupid good assist, when u put him with the right duo’s(thanos/jug is easily the best) he is really silly, no airthrow but he also has good mobility imo.

I’ll elaborate more in another post.

I can help out with squads but the main reason for my post was just to highlight the teams and characters that are good(imo).

i personally dont really like building teams for people so maybe the bulk work to select from will be good enough.

i disagree about tooth being viable but thats just the way i see it, low priority, no air super, limited approach angles, limited mobility. even with his good points i just dont feel like he is unique enough or strong enough to use.


#15

I like Venom over Spiderman. His lack of a good air to air and bad launcher don’t matter that much since he should be staying on the ground anyway. His air combo is garbage so it’s not like you’ll ever use his launcher. All his combos should be ending in qcf kk for insane damage if you’re not in the corner. I haven’t tested this out but I believe his standing and jumping roundhouse do hit above his head and can be used as a ghetto anti airs. Besides, jab venom fang is too good!

Why do you think Felicia’s not viable? I suck with her but theoretically, I can see why she might be good. 1 frame supers are always useful.

Anakaris should be ratio 2.


#16

assuming anakaris would be moved to ratio 2…and dhalsim/juggs also (eliminating any easy curse infs with some actual nice characters [also…dhalsim may be eventually banned?])

I have anakaris/silsam/sonson so far…

-snake superxxlightning is nice…also a safe DHC afaik
-silsam ground assist is a ghetto tron assist…oppotunity for mixups/positioning for max damage snake super (also possible to combo a curse using SJCs or overhead+silsam shit)
-some nice DHCs all around…corner or close mostly (lightningXXmummyslap super [hold down then juggle them up and down alternating P and K of same side]xxPOW [maybe others])

silsam with sonsonAAA seems nice…defensive, lots of AAA hits into lighning super?

it would be a mostly defensive team. silsams assist wouldn’t be as good defensively as some others…but meh.anak/son can hold there own I would say…then you would capitalize the situations you can put your opponent into with anak/silsam or sonson mixups.

otherwise, not too many good anakaris teams I think. I’m thinking of some possibilities with charlie, ken, colussus, akuma (2 low HP characters…ugh), maybe jin or marrow (like gabe).

but other cool teams. rogue, charlie, guile, ken, collusus are looking fun to me. felicia too. will prob dabble with a modified ruby team. team VDO is too fun, but prob wouldn’t play it too much, especially at tourneys where THE VDO is there

too bad no one to really try a nice ratio system low tier matches with…otherwise I would have some for those occasions.


#17

Still don’t see an image, but that’s cool. I get the general idea from your post of info. Look forward to the development of low tier what-have-you in further vids. pC


#18

[media=youtube]pmUmyH7dcDA[/media]

srsly 0-0

venom has some nice combos and a really easy airdash. spiderman just has that bullshit on his hitboxes, he has the crazy ass regular jump game + zoning and airdash setups.

spidey and venom both have good assists tho.

beats, you building some more cheap ass teams, i swear anakaris has no place in the low tier stuff…his priority is toooooo high…+samurai is pretty damn annoying. i like that team:wasted:

about felicia, imo she’s just another jump around char with low priority, weak mobility,weak mixup.I will admit she has good specials and supers. Like with sabretooth or any other jump around bum, low priority = limited use in my opinion.

somone like guile who has only basic sonic boom and basic movement with his instant flash kick, he still does incredibly well because he has a shitton of priority.

In basic situations, thats all these characters have going for them(or against them)


#19

A+ gold

Best character video I’ve seen in a long time.


#20

iunno mixup, I think that would have to be tested. with his somewhat bad mobility/low defense I think it might balance out.

especially with them quick characters that have high/low/inside mixups but also have mobility. though no tron to really make some damage…who knows. just be careful of using an assist to hit anak at the top of the screen…cause he can stay there (I did it a for a few secs against VDO in our MMs [whenever Flapp will youtube them matches…]) some projectile shit can be a prob too

borken ass launcher though :slight_smile: who knows, you might be right…but I think dhalsim would have to go before anak mos def

snake superXXgamma crush hurts…

launch, late collossusAAA call, sj.hpxxcurse, collossus hits, curse hits hurts also…

that is the cutest evil dictator I’ve ever seen…but I must beware