Magneto/Storm/Sentinel Discussion


#1

This team has become more an more popular these past few months, so I figured I’d start a thread to discuss it.

Personally, I don’t find the team to be very strong at all. From a Magneto standpoint, assuming you choose Sent-y, all you have are drones to cover your rushdown. Even if you land a really clean hit, you don’t have as many reset options as you would with a c. lk-friendly assist, and you don’t have an unmashable tempest setup from the infinite.

Although the Tempest > Hailstorm is fast and safe, there’s not much damage to it, because you probably won’t land a tempest unless you infinite to the corner, and try to grav xx tempest from there. From there, you’re [probably] going to have Storm/Sent-y/Mag-a. Drones should help keep Storm safe if she wants to rush/run, and hopefully she’ll land that crucial launcher so you can DHC into Sent, and finish the job. But at this point, if youre fighting against Sent/Capcom or Cable/Capcom (Capcom or another good AAA), you’re going to have a fight ahead of you (moreso against Sent/Capcom). Well whatever happens here, eventually Sent will come in, with either Mag-a, Storm-a, or both. Storm can help semi-trap, and Mag makes fast fly combos that much more powerful, but without an AAA, Sent seems kinda naked to me. But towards the end of the fight, you probably won’t be fighting against much (By this time, hopefully at least one of the opponent’s characters are dead).

I just don’t understand this team. It’s not really a Magneto based team, obviously. If you switch Sent to Projectile assist, then Mag becomes more combo oriented, and you have more reset options, and a possibility of an unmashable tempest. But Storm comes in without much cover. I guess it comes down to preference.

So if it’s not a Magneto team, than what is it? In team Row, at least Mag can build meter for Cable, and in Mag/IM/Sent, Mag can be battery for that great DHC(s).

I guess I just haven’t seen it in action, so I don’t really understand the strengths of the team. It seems like MSP, Santhrax, and team Scrub all beat MSS.


#2

Hmm, I don’t feel comfortable with MSS because the assists suck with this team. It just doesn’t fit in place.


#3

mss has style and thats about it, its weak because it doesnt have good assists, basically. i can see how its appealing in theory especially with sent-A because its a magneto team with the two best characters on it and a “c.lk” assist, but it just doesnt play well.


#4

mag/storm/sent is a real strong team because most dhc’s are strong. storm/sent dhc would kill a character, and the others do good damage. sent with mag projectile assist is great.

plus xx with drones makes that character 20x more offensive, if xx happens to be mag or storm then that’s pretty deadly. they take full advantage of the block stun that the drones make. plus drones assist is so abusable that you can call that shit through 10commandos or whatever else. only thing drones assist has to worry about is cable or some hails, but which assist doesnt.

mag gets out of trouble faster than anyone dhcing to storm, and then storm and sent kill everyone pretty cleanly except another storm or sent (except sent vs cable which is 50/50).

when you guys say “good assist” for mag, you probably mean psy, and a real good mag can play without psy or an aaa. no shit, with an aaa mag’s a lot more deadlier but youre stuck having psy or assist character in there. but m/s/s you have sent fighting at the end not aaa. drones are good enough rtsd no need for psy unless you’re not planning on fighting to the end.

all 3characters build meter faster than anyone else or at least build it fast enough.

the only open weakness there is cable vs sent, but even then sent vs cable isnt as lopsided as it used to be, plus cable loses to him if he’s got no levels. and if he uses levels on sent, mag and storm own a levelless cable 100%.

m/s/s beats team scrub and team row, but has a hard time with santhrax or storm/sent/cyc. storm/sent/cable vs mss is probably stormsentcable’s favor… and msp loses to unless its msp shit happens.

mag/storm/sent’s got no free wins, but it’s got 0 true weaknesses… except strider/doom but then that’s a whole lot of crap about perfect striders and shit…

lat.e


#5

MSS doesn’t beat team row. If anything this is a 50/50 fight, though I’m biased and say row has the edge. As people said before, the tempest DHC into hail is actually pretty shitty damage. With row, start sent on point, and you have an ugly game for MSS.


#6

while we’re at it does anyone like mag doom sent(a or y)


#7

couldn’t you just s.hk+drones->hypergrav->tempest?


#8

It’s strong because the DHCs are good? That doesn’t make sense to me. Does the team become significantly worse without meter?

Drones are good. I’ll give you that.

Magneto gets out as fast as anybody else with a 1 frame startup super. But why is that a good quality of this team? Because then you have Storm/Sent coming in? Why not play Storm/Sent/Commando to begin with? Then, you start off with Storm (no real counter), and you can run for 5 seconds and build meter. From there, you have a potential 1 hit kill, and you didn’t have to waste time playing Magneto.

Basically you’re saying that having Sent as a point character last makes up for making Magneto worse on point. I guess its like that Storm/Sent/Capcom vs Storm/Sent/Cable. I prefer Psylocke, but I guess that’s what this thread is for (debate).

This would be great if Strider or Cable was your second or even third point character. But none of these characters need meter to fight, unless you’re talking about the strength of the DHCs again.

Sent with 2 projectile assists is most likely going to lose to Cable/AAA, even if Cable doesn’t have meter.

How does MSS beat row? Team Row starts Mag off with 2 viable assists., while MSS leaves you with drones. Now I’m not saying drones are bad (they aren’t) but I’d prefer Mag with Cable AAA + Sent-a. But lets say that it’s a 50/50 match, Mag vs Mag. Then it comes down to Storm/Sent-y vs Cable (with meter)/Sent-A. I can see this going both ways. If Storm/Sent has 2 meters, one clean hit could = gg. But because Cable has meter, it’s possible that one clean hit = gg for Storm or Sent. That’s my take on the matchup.

How does MSS beat Team Scrub? Assuming neither team button switches characters at the beginning:
Sent/Capcom beats Mag (armed with only drone assist) clean. You agree with me on that, right? From there, if you bring in Cable, you have Cable + meter (hopefully, maybe not though) with Capcom + Drones against Storm/Sent. I think Cable has the advantage again. Drones to lockdown, Capcom to fight rushdown. If Cable does lose though, probably to Storm/Sent DHC, you still have Sent/Capcom against Sent/Storm. That’s probably in Sent/Capcom’s favor, too.

How does MSS beat MSP? What keeps MSS from getting rushed down? Drones don’t seem like they’re enough. Maybe if you button switch to Sent first, then MSP loses, but even then, it’s Sent without AAA. Mag-a is a great assist for Sent, but I don’t think it helps very much against getting rushed.

Not too sure about the win ratio between those teams/pairs, so forgive me if Im mistaken. That’s just how I see those matchups.

Ah, I didn’t mention it because I don’t use it. It’s unmashable?


#9

dhc from tempest to hail isnt any more shitty damage than any other super off of a hail, except maybe jugg or bbhood or ironman, but then you exchange the little bit more damaging super for a less mobile or deadlier character.

but mag needs one hit, he’ll get more damage cause he’ll do the infinite till around 40 hits tempest to hail, that character is almost dead. and roundhouse to hypergrav tempest with drones is unmashable…, so unmashable tempest canceled to mashed hail does almost kill you if not kill you damage.

the only advantage team row has or m/s/sent is cable aaa when sent is in vs the other sent. m/s/s has probably the more important thing of the 2 teams, storm. let’s say for arguement’s sake that mag doesnt get a hit on sent, once mag dhc’s to storm that team row cant do anything anymore.
plus team row is more reliant on calling the cable aaa, which will die if it’s called at 2 or 3 bad times. m/s/s’s sent helps with the damage when mag launches the assist or storm hails cable, cable aaa is easier to kill than sent ground assist…

instead of getting into an even longer post it’d be easier to say that mss beats team row is just to say storm can run all day and team row just cant do anything to stop her.

but if m/s/s doesnt run, and mag doesnt get his hit, and team row is on a good day maybe it’s a 50/50 chance. team row is more aggressive especially the way row plays it, but m/s/s is just more prepared as an allround team.

late.


#10

MSS does have a few improvements on Team Row, having watched Rodolfo’s transition to MSS-A over the last few months first hand. (It’s kind of funny seeing people still calling Mag/Cable/Sent-A “Team Row” when Rodolfo himself hasn’t been using it as his primary team since Tips and Tricks.)

The first improvement is that it eliminates Cable as a liability against Storm/Sentinel. This is a liability in several ways. The first is that with Cable there, Magneto has no simple and safe way to get out of the matchup with Storm… which is a matchup he’s usually going to lose. No safe DHC, no easy exit that won’t get a character killed or maimed, meaning Magneto often finds himself being run into the ground… it’s win or bust, and more often the ending is “bust”.

The second liability is that once Magneto (usually) dies, Cable has to try to come back. In most other matchups, this isn’t a problem; battery/Cable/Sentinel is a team dynamic that is nearly as old as the game itself for precisely that reason. Battery can be considered relatively expendible, Cable comes in with the meter the battery put up for him and blows shit away. However, when Storm/Sentinel has just gotten done killing Magneto, often largely for free, Cable finds himself frequently way behind, by most of a character’s lifebar by the time he comes out on point. Sure, it’s on Sentinel, but Sentinel has an AAA, Cable doesn’t, and Sentinel is under no obligation to really do a lot at all because he’s ahead. Sentinel’s job, in this instance, is to basically just not die. If he can manage to kill Cable as well, neat, but if he just lives long enough to DHC back to Storm without blowing the lead, he’s done his job. From there, Storm can run until the cows come home, and Cable can’t typically do a lot about it without risking getting himself killed the same way Magneto already went out. Sentinel can try coming in as well, but usually the other Sentinel’s got a better AAA than Cable-B behind them, so that’s also an uphill battle.

With MSS, both of these elements change entirely. Magneto can exit safely to bring in Storm at any time he wishes; he’s under no pressure to deliver. Then you’ve got a Storm/Sentinel of your own against theirs. And if you do happen to fall behind, that’s also another element in your favor – Storm/Sentinel isn’t a liability waiting to get run away from for free if the other side has the lead. The team both allows Magneto an escape and it allows a fallback plan for getting the lead back… althoguh yes, the tradeoff is that Magneto himself has somewhat weaker assists and is, to a large degree, on his own for getting his offense going.

Rodolfo has stayed with Sentinel-A on this team in his own going to it, and he’s found ways to make Sentinel-A useful for Storm as well as Magneto. Ironically, it’s Justin who is the biggest “Team Row” player right now… but then, for Justin this almost is a returning to his roots – remember his Magneto/Cable/Cammy days? I sometimes wonder just how much Justin’s old team inspired Rodolfo’s from the start. Full circle? Who knows?


#11

dhc’s are what makes a team in marvel. except for cable since he uses that shit by himself(which is just like dhc’s it’s super usage). the dhc are important because all 3 characters can get in and out pretty safe by dhcing. and the damage on most dhc (aside from lighting storm to shockwave) do notable damage.

it’s not the point of the team becoming worse without meter since every team (except a t.bonne team) needs meter. another big part of this team is that each of those characters can fight with out meter, BUT they can get meter so easily and fast and are much more deadlier with it that supers are an issue.

and it’s not that im saying basically having sent last makes up for having a mag that’s “worse” on point. i said that this team has 3 strong characters which work well enough to compliment each other as a team AND alone.

mag beats cable and sent. he loses to storm/commando, and smart storms.
storm has no bad matchups.
sent has no bad matchups except cable who is 50/50 and a good mag

sent’s best assists are: commando, mag, cyc, other aaa
storm’s best assists: commando, sent, cyc, psy, other aaa
mag’s best assists: psy, sent drones, cyc, rocket punch, other aaa

even if you dont have personal experience, just in knowing the game of mvc2 like counters and shit, it’s clear that the main weakness would be storm/sent/commando.
and that’s what i said santhrax is the only team that would beat m/s/s pretty well.

but you said why not play santhrax instead of wasting time playing magneto? because magneto can fight storm. against storm commando it might be harder but he’ll still deal out some damage, and again will dhc into storm. then you’d have to just wait for santhrax to call out commando before doing any real attacking, or get sent in. there are game plans even to mismatches

when it comes down to it it’s all about who gets that hit, like you said “…I can see this going both ways. If Storm/Sent has 2 meters, one clean hit could = gg. But because Cable has meter, it’s possible that one clean hit = gg for Storm or Sent. That’s my take on the matchup…” , it’s all on the individual players. i can see many team matchups going both ways depending which team gets that first hit or fucks up guarding their assist.

but really, storm/sent vs cable/sent, i just dont think cable will get the hit on storm unless she messes up. i mean when i say she owns him, she rapes him. only cable meeting her at sj with fc to ahvb will get her, but that’s still just trying to catch her or outsmart her, not a sure fire tactic to deal out damage to her. besides once storm’s got 2levels she’s going to kill cable by either baiting him or rushing…

with team scrub: mag beats sent. only if mag is careless will he get raped by sent/commando. maybe can play a zoning game and keep mag away, but then that means sent will be calling out commando too often and mag will be able to launch the assist fc fc combo to it which does do good damage. if sent is trying to cover commando with sh, then mag has that opening to sj sh sh into infinite or snapback, if mag continues the infinite he’ll do it to about 40 hits again then dhc to hail, which take off more than half life of sent. if mag does a snapback then he will either rape commando or commando will waste supers to get either cable or sent in which will make cable nothing cause he’s superless or make it mag vs sent again.

with msp: mag with drones if called right should make mag pretty safe, even if he gets hit by psyAAA, the msp mag will have to block the drones. drones do more damage than psyAAA, so if they trade hits, psy will have collected a lot more red than sent and one dhc to hail storm and psyAAA will be dead, or close, meaning psyaaa wont be called out anymore unless it’s protected by hails, which means they’ll lose meter and m/s/s will have the advantage.

in short… if mag and storm keep the drones ahead of them while rushing, there’s not much msp can do. even cable with drones can stand a chance against msp, not a big chance but the defense that drones put out are very good.

with cable vs sent that’s just depending on the players. i think it’s 50/50.

late.


#12

MSS is pretty much my favorite team right now(i don’t even play tron cept for fun)

Reason?

It’s extremely hard team to kill off at pretty much every point in the fight.

I like how magneto can take his time since his primary assist isn’t dying anytime soon. Sort of a backwards approach to what everyone has done with magneto teams from the beginning.

Basically sent g = a patience team

sent a = rush rush rush

Insert character/storm/sentinel has always worked so no probs there.

Mag’s death combo with this team should be

Launch+drones triple fierce combo and drag out the infinite.

Storm/sent-a against sentinel/capcom is a wierd fight that i’ve been working on(rowtron inspires me with these wierd teams)

Seems really too hard at first but i’m starting to treat it like an easier mag/sent-a matchup, sent can’t drop capcom without risk of a SERIOUS counter assist typhoonXXhail.

Makes him play a little differently imo, also dropping the rocketpunch and doing the straight airdash behind set-ups works really well with storm for some reason.

I’m absolutely blabbering…back on track…

The match-ups magneto has trouble in the beginning of the game(seems to be what you’re shaking your head at…asking why even use magneto…)

Storm/sent/cable or cyc*

if the storm is running, esp with sent-a it obviously is gonna fuck up ALOT of the gameplan so huge notch against it right there. Basically you lose dash behind psylocke when somone is coming down. With drones i drop them at the bottom of storms sj descent and go for cross-ups and blockstun set-ups for more rush, it’s ghetto but it works if you know all the potential set-ups as they land.

With rocketpunch, i have no fucking idea how to use it to catch her, i wish row would post…

MSP

This damn team gets free dash in psy to blow through ALOT of the teams set-ups(sent-g), thats the large issue here. With sent-a, you’re even more vulnerable from above yet you have counter assist to balance it out.

But

If the msp tries to sj airdash fp,fk your sent-a you can go up for infinite for free while the hitbox is on sent.

If msp gets the lead, ricky is pure proof, storm/psy can run really well from this team too.

Scrub*

I think mag teams have a nice advantage against scrub JUST because of the much debated(recently) snap-out issue. Sure sents gonna blow through the drones ALOT but it doesn’t even matter really, recently mag’s been getting in and snapping him to death…

With sent-a i don’t really mind the fight, counter assists here and there, beat on commando a little, he loses life FAST and counter assist tempest hail takes off too much…

I’m being brief and lazy but at least look it like this

mag/storm= top team the whole time the games been unlocked, why the hell not add that beastly character.

to sum it up, it’s my fave team bc

Gives mag a patient route through alot of fights(the reason why it doesn’t FEEL like a magneto team, you gotta be slick)

sent has more life than any assist(no more fuckin psylocke disapearing acts)

Storm/sent: no need to comment:lol:

This is a team for those who have an extremely good magneto

P.s I’ll get u row :mad: :stuck_out_tongue:


#13

MSS does not own MSP. The reason why is because MSS doesn’t do that much damage if the MSS(mag=Point charac)lands a hit on MSP(mag= point charac),it wouldn’t do as much damage as MSp would do to MSS. Even if the MSS is being patient(which means wait for MSp to rush down then sent out drones etc…),MSP could just find another way to rush MSS down,instead of to dash in to land a hit with Psy. MSp could just sent out storm’s pro then sj airdash over then RTSD.
MSS does not own team scrub. The reason while is because it won’t be that easy for MSS to rush team scrub down with Mag,since commando’s anti. If Sent is out first,then MSS will have a much harder time to get in.


#14

did yoo jus not read the post? … .

i lovers mss… . although i never play it in tourney… . remember yoo always have whack inf call drones dash under short short tempest reset. … it’s like tron! . …

peace… .


#15

NO,i didn’t read everybody’s post. I just scanned through it. The sent drones then dash behind is getting pretty old. If it works on good players,then i think it’ll only work on them once. I doubt it’ll work on them twice. ALso,Mag+tron= Shitty. :slight_smile: . Mag+PSy is totally opposite.


#16

That comment alone puts you into retard status…Read the posts…


#17

Sorry, Wanderer, you just put an “I don’t know WTF I’m talking about and I’m too lazy to bother reading the proof” tattoo on your forehead with those last couple of posts.

MSS, in either version, can do plenty of damage with Magneto on point. (For shorthand, I’m going to call the version with Sent-Y MSS-Y and the version with Sent-A MSS-A.) With MSS-Y, a hit with Magneto is pretty easy to set up st. rh/drones/hyper grav/tempest DHC hail. This is unmashable, and does just fine in the damage department, quite up there with anything MSP is going to do… and once you’ve done that, you’ve still got Storm/Sentinel waiting in the wings to do even more damage to the next poor slob coming along.

MSS-A’s only real unmashable is poke/poke/Sent-A/tempest in the corner, but that simply isn’t where this team expects to do its damage with Mag on point anyway, any more than Mag/Sent-A expects to do much tempest on Team Row. Sure, it’ll take it, but that’s not what it’s aiming for. With MSS-A, Magneto is aiming for infinites, resets, and punishing your assists when you try to stop him. Mag/Sent-A can reset very nearly as well as Mag/Psylocke can. Hypergrav/tempest is still out there, and although it’s mashable very few people are going to mash out of it 100% of the time. And once you’ve gotten a reset or two, you don’t worry about actually leaving it mashable, you can just immediately cancel to hail and make sure. When Magneto doesn’t have to worry about leaving the meter for Cable, he also is more free to do stuff to assists as well. I can’t speak with a lot of intelligence on what these things are but I’ve seen it done in various creative ways that are hard to relate in text. In addition, the rocket punch gives Sentinel a little bit of pause quickly for both Magneto and Storm on point, and even stupid little things like calling Sentinel and throwing random hyper gravs can do a lot more to throw a Sentinel off than one would think.

It’s not a team for beginners in either version, it takes a lot of work to make Magneto effective, but the tools are there in either case. Safe DHCs all around, fairly painful DHCs everywhere except Sent-to-Mag, and not having to worry about punting the game if Magneto lays an egg against a team with Storm on it are all big things.

The matchup with Storm/Sent is still a bit bad. Sent/Commando is probably going to give either version troubles, but you need a safe DHC as your third char. A very good Strider has a serious shot at killing the entire team by himself, but there aren’t exactly a lot of those left any more. Personally, I rather like BH/Sent/Commando against this team as well, but if you think sj. rh and inferno/HOD are BH’s main moves, you think Commando or Cyclops are more important assists than drones, and Magnetos actually survive your first solid hit with BH with this team, then this may not work as well for you. That tends to disqualify 99.9% of the BHs out there. Even at this, I’m not going to say that I think BH/Cable/Cyclops would work – the infinite into tag into AHVB will kill on the first solid hit as well, but I think BH would miss the drones too much.


#18

It depends on how’s playin’ wit MSS. Row is Ill. M.A.G. from H.P. plays that team…but he’s weak. I play MSP. I told that nigga once I kill mag it’s pretty much over when I Guard break Storm and snap in Sent. Sentinel is weak without an anti-air.


#19

MSS pwnz


#20

Stilt, i’m pretty sure about there being more unmashables with sent-a in the corner.

After fk grab, c.fk+sentXXtempest

Also there is another one, re-jump i believe…something like

dash down combo, re-jump lk,sent,fp tempest…bleh, another player can clear that one up djb-13 has some nice stuff in his vids.