Makoto vs ChunLi

makoto

#1

How does Makoto beat ChunLi?


#2

After playing more I’ve discovered that I think Tanden Renki is the best super to use against her.

She does her super … block… parry that last hit… activate. karakusa -> fierce -> fierce dash attempt to repeat

if successful with Tanden Renki activated:
karakusa -> fierce -> fierce dash -> karakusa -> fierce -> fierce dash -> fierce overhead
will completely kill ChunLi

Is this the super you all use against ChunLi?


#3

I would use seichussien godanzaki.

if you happen to block her super ( i never seem to run into this) parry the last hit then do her SAI. I think that would do more damage… or the abare tosanami too… i guess.

taden renki seems too risky. esspicly since when your combo is over you have another 10 seconds of eating highpriority moves. :stuck_out_tongue:

ive had luck using well timed axe kicks and hayates after a wiffed back and fierce (quickly.)

and i say use SAI one becuase it isnt exacly easy to karakusa chun li, but hitting her w/ a c.short is.

then again, i dont play any expert chun lis, so this all might be bullshit. :lol:


#4

actually, I always thought SAII was the super of choice because:

  1. It is hard to land a c.short on chun

  2. You’re gonna need the healthy dose of EX’s to keep her on her back and not walking back and forth to play footsies.

Chun’s hard because you can’t dash in on her (c.jab, c.forward, back fierce all give makoto’s dash problems). She gets to c.jab out of a lot of karakusa ticks. Biggest problem? Once Chun builds that meter, she gets to play footsies, and as we all know, makoto plays pretty poor footsies.

Good thing is that once you get her knocked down/pressured, she has fewer escapes than Ken or Yun.


#5

you can do her fukiage and knock chun out of her ex spinning bird kicks right?


#6

Against chunny, the key is to keep knocking her down and dunt let her build that meter. Her s. strong can stuff those wake-up ex bird kick, so it’s good to mix it up as chunny gets up. SA2 is the way to go against anyone IMHO. I’m just such a big fan of that super :smiley:


#7

im not sure if anyone else plays like this

but anyone hardcore about the lowkicks and such, ill use SAI(coincidently the only super im consistent with), turtle up a bit.

pretty much if your quick enough, just about anyones croucing forward is punishable by SAI, i’ve done against shoto’s alot who whore the c.forward. it may be a one shot deal, but i think the damage gives you an edge to work with, and if u have that super meter built up, itll make em think before throwing it out…

yea its worth trying out…


#8

My two cents on this:

  1. A good Chun won’t let you block a SA#2. That’s the whole point of the low MK link – you have so long to see if it hits or not that you don’t need to waste a meter. Basically, if you’re playing against a good Chun and you see her super, you can be damn sure you’re getting hit by it.

  2. Anyone with a decent sense of the game won’t let you keep grabbing them with a karakusa after a hayate connects. Don’t rely on this.

So with that in mind, here’s how I play a good Chun with Makoto:

Like anyone, you have to rush her before she has meter, cuz once she does, she’s a hundred times more dangerous. When she whiffs shit on the ground to build meter, time a jump in or knock-down poke. When jumping in you’ll usually have a sense of what Chun will do – most will anti-air, in which case you can parry it, or you can do Makoto’s flip kick (qcb+K). Depending on how you time the flip kick, it will trade or beat Chun clean. If it does beat her anti-air, you can continue to combo after a medium flip kick, so if you have SA#1 as Makoto, use it.

The whole point is to get her on the ground. Once she’s there, it’s a guessing game, and that’s what Makoto’s all about. If you’ve got a SA#1 ready, your opponent is a lot more nervous about doing a wake up move. If Chun wakes up with EX bird kick, you can punish it the super.

Basically it’s a game of stand strong, low short, or command grab. Usually I do command grab first. After that first time, Chun is more likely to do a wake-up jump (usually straight up if she’s in the corner), a wake up EX bird kick, or guess a parry (high or low).

  • if she jumps - parry then command grab or parry then super (or low short, super), or parry then throw (puts her on the ground). (The best thing for Chun to do after jumping is nothing – wait for Makoto to attack and then parry it or if Makoto does nothing, land and throw. More often than not you get a teched throw which resets the match. That said, most Chun Li’s jump up and try to do a late roundhouse.)

  • if you think she’ll do a EX bird kick - early stand strong snuffs her. If you time it right, you can combo into super. If you time it wrong, best case you’ll knock her on her ass and you get to start the guessing game over, worst case you trade and the match resets.

  • if you think she’ll guess a parry - you have to guess an attack, or throw. Generally, I do low short, hayate, low short hayate a couple of times on a waking up Chun if I know they’ll guess a parry. After that, the next time they wake up they’ll guess a down parry, I’ll do stand strong. If stand strong hits (i.e. they guessed wrong), you have an infinity to link SA#1 after it.

That’s my input anyways. It works for me. Don’t get me wrong, it’s never an easy fight against Chun, but it’s less difficult when I employ those strats.

I’ll also say that against a good Chun, these things work decently, but if you’re playing a Chun that can’t get the link and you often block a SA#2, then don’t stress it – a somewhat decent Makoto will murder her. Or chances are you can beat her no problem just by doing cross-up MK with Ken all day.


#9

Wow


#10

What i use is SAII.

All i do is anticapate a back and fierce, which i then use a SAII super to connect.
Followed by a double dp —> 98% stun. Then i have a guessing game to play on the chun li.
Which she has a 25% chance of guessing right on what am going to do.
IF she guesses wrong, shes dizzy… and the round is over for her.

Am i crazy. Not really.
What do chun whores do at the start of a round.

Jump away and charge with the palm. So y am i going to bother trying to rush in on her, when all shes doing is sticking out pokes.
So the first round i always do that super.
The second round they think twice about using random pokes, and thats when i rush down.

Works wonders for me.
Oh ya, I’ve never actually gotten a Karakusa on a chun li before. I dont even bother… rush down on its own is good enough… with all the exs.

Something i do as a rush down is ex hayate, where she blocks. Then i follow up with a jab hayate. Which always beats out whatever move shes doing after the blocked ex hayate. How do i know this. I did some reasearch and found out that Makoto reacovers 2 frames before the opponent who blocked the ex hayate.
So anyways, the sencond time i do the ex hayate and she blocks. I follow up with a kara karakusa (Maybe the only time ive actually grabbed a chun).
THis only works once in a match.
So use it, but dont abuse it.

Oh ya. Just thought that i would add this.
After landing a SAI in the corner. Makoto is in perfect spacing to do a kara karakusa.
Works everytime. (Except on Alex/hugO)
But am sure u all knew that so disregard what i wrote.


#11

Research doesn’t necessarily mean karathrow.com. Really they’re just translating the 3rd Strike Bible which is all tables with numbers on it. So really the credit should go to the publishers of the 3rd Strike Bible. The only thing is, the publisher of the 3rd Strike Bible should be shot, since the 3rd Strike Bible was the worst book ever made (crappy combos, inaccurate data, and CONFLICTING DATA within its own damn book.) I wish there was an All About Book published for 3rd Strike (I got the New Generation All About Fighting Bible and it rocks!) Hell, I’d even take the semi-crappy effort of the CVS2 Bible over the sorry excuse for a fighting Bible 3rd Strike became.


Does anyone else here find Street Fighter stressful?
#12

Oh btw, he said Jab hayate after an EX Hayate. Since Jab hayate is 7 frames, Chun Li needs a move that connects at that distance within 5 frames. Crouching jab works really nicely and gets used a lot around where I play. EX Hayate into a Jab Hayate isn’t a very good thing here, since most people here do realize that Makoto has frame advantage (we’ve been going over the frame data a good deal before karathrow published it) and tend to not try to counter the EX Hayate. They block the Jab Hayate and it’s free super for them.


#13

don’t diss our site. :mad:

:lol: :lol: :lol:


#14

yeah. didn’t read properly about hayate. sorry.

as for the book, framedata is enough for me… i think most people can get (better) strategy and combos elsewhere.


#15

just curious here.
Does makoto have any other kara throwing buttons i can use aside from short, and roundhouse?


#16

About her HK kara throw, doesn’t she kara backwards?

Someone told me about it and i tried it. Looked hilarious with her moving backwards instead of forwards :lol:.


#17

Here’s my tip against Chun Li:

Pick Q, power up, then you can fuck up all you want trying to kill her. Her SAII does like what? 5% damage on 3TQ? (3 Taunt Q)


#18

nice logic.

too bad half the cast rushes q down free, the other half rushes him down for 25 cents.


#19

i totally disagree. Q has the easiest parrying in the game, so there go jumpins. he has jab dash punch with -2 frame recovery…there goes random dash ins. he has great far s. forward, great c. short/c. jab (with +4 frame advantage) and to top it all off, a great kara-throw. did i mention he has great runaway jump back fierce, great fierce Dash Punch to run away. anyway, he doesn’t get rushed down for free at all.


#20

Oh yeah just so u guys know, i tested how much Chun’s SA2 does to a 3tQ…u wanna know how much it does?

Watch out this is funny…

it does…

like ~15%. HOLY SHIT CHUN LI IS SCARY NOW!!! :lol: