Matchup in AE: Gouken vs Sagat

Standard issue stuff here, ask questions, answer questions, post what you already know.

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[]Don’t go into fireball wars at the start of the roundas his Tiger Shots startup really quickly.
]Throw Gohadouken when he mucks about with normals from far away.
[]Try to do some Demon Flip into Parry to during fireball wars to throw his rhythm off.
]Get him to the Corner and Poke him.
[*]Watch out for his Kara-Tiger Uppercut!

I find staying just out of range of Tiger knee where you can punish it with a cr.hp (think start of round distance) will make zoning sagats seriously uncomfortable. You can c.HP just about any jump in at this distance and he can’t knee you without a full punish. They are scared to throw fireballs in case you jump.

Zoning Sagats will back themselves straight into a corner, which is where you want them for your high damage mistake punishes

the best thing about fighting sagat is that c.hp is the only anti-air you need.
sit in front of him and let him jump.
when he stops jumping, just get ready to jump on him.
if he tiger uppercuts a df parry, or tigershoots when you jump, you win.

Tiger Knee beats all of Gouken’s flip options and all jumpin options that would result in +frames on landing.

it’s a great move against gouken, but he can’t hit everything you do.
if he times the knee to hit df kick, you could have df thrown him.
if he times the knee to hit df throw, df kick will pause you while sagat squirts out the back door.
if he is just tiger kneeing the world, 1 neutral jump can hurt him badly.
the point of my post is that sagat has trouble jumping on gouken because of c.hp.
gouken has a much easier time jumping on sagat.

uhhh what about st hk?

its really good.
but, if you compare just air defense, gouken only needs one button while sagat has to deal with your tricks.
i’m not saying gouken rolls sagat, or even has an advantage over him.
i think it is a pretty even fight and my favorite thing about it is sagat’s limited options to jump on me.
i played weaksauce in ranked last night and he was doing some awesome stuff with sagat, but he couldn’t jump on me for free because i had c.hp.
the characters that can jump on gouken give him fits.
sagat isn’t one of those.

demon dlip parry works well on sagat until he gets meter. ex tiger upercut will fuck up demon flip parrt. Also I thing sagats standing RH hits twice so that might do it too.

ex uppercut, two-hit, and tiger knee all beat flip parry. Generally don’t bother doing it.

nothing you do is going to work every time.
demon flip parry is pretty good against sagat.
if he’s hitting it, do a short one and then try to punish him!
if he was expecting a fireball when you flipped, a lot of times he’ll just crouch to block the kick and parry can recover quickly enough to give you a throw.
if you don’t do it at all, it’s never going to work.
that’s like saying “don’t jump” or "don’t shoot fireballs."
also, look at what you are risking vs. what you are getting.
a good df parry can lead to a full punish.
i wish there were more sagats right now.
gouken had a better match against vanilla sagat than he does in a lot of today’s matchups.

Sagat rolls Gouken if his reaction isn’t trash and he knows his options.

Sad but true. Faster fireball, better anti air, better zoning, better armor break and better wake up. Two things give Sagat weakness. The size of his hitbox (or hurtbox if you will) and his walk speed. A good Sagat player can basically negate the walk speed issue with his focus cancel and tiger knees, so that leaves one glaring weakness and that does not save the day for Gouken, and Gouken’s hurtbox isn’t that much smaller.

i disagree.
the only time i lose to sagat is when the player is very strong.
the loss never feels absolute and i can usually trace it back to my own decisions.
if sagat inherently beat gouken, i would lose to bad sagats and get frustrated when my opponent picked him, like i do with yun.

Emblem is one of the few Sagats who does just completely own me…if you have PSN, seek him out.

emblem being a good player is not evidence of sagat having an advantage over gouken.
gouken’s design works well against fireball/uppercut styles, especially when he can ride an uppercut with ex df for a full punish, like he can against sagat.
also, sagat is tall enough to allow you to use air tatsus on him; that’s fun!

Ha, air tatsu is cool against him. Two players of equal skill…I think Sagat still has the edge though.

The match isn’t horrid. 6/4. Sagat has all the necessary tools to have advantage on Gouken. Gouken has nothing truly safe vs Sagat and Gat has answers to all of Gouken’s stuff.

Probably common knowledge, Sagat’s Angry Scar adds Armour Breaking to his next uppercut.