mini rant


#1

When you play s\s, you can totally change the team dynamics and counter setups depending on what type of AA you have. Aside from the top 3, matrix, thrax and s\s\cable, there are also great s\s teams that don’t get much play. Like s\s\ken or s\s\guile. Both of these AA’s are great when used properly but there not going to be like the top 3 s\s teams. However, you do create different attack angles along with different types of priority.

Guile AA for example will hit a flying sent anywhere on the screen as long as your character is grounded. The robot simply can’t dodge it, also it will track fairly well and it has decent priority. His d+fp has god like priority and will beat anything the top tiers throw @ him, normal for normal wise iirc. J+rh rivals sents air game, TK flash kicks for manuvering him into awkward angles, qcb+kk is instant and it dhc’s into hsf. The one con about guile AA is his shitty block stun which becomes a big factor. He’s only really safe on hit and guile will land right in front of the opponent when you call him full screen which is an easy spot for him to get juiced. If he had a little better block stun, he’d be played more I suppose.

iirc, whenever guile AA hits an assist you can reset hail pretty fast. Guile AA on hit doesn’t sent them off the screen like capcom\cable would.

Ken AA is also another great one. Even though it has poor fwd movement, its upfwd angle is deep. Not to mention that ken AA is invicible all the way up which is a big plus. He tracks good, he does much better block stun than guile which storm can follow up and from 25% screen, he will land behind the opponent even when blocked high or low. He covers his own exit when called right. Ken on point with these 2 assists can be kinda of scary. You can lp dp behind storm\sent assits and do somehting invincible into a layered attack string. c.lk+storm, command roll is an xup. Also if you use this as your staple w\ either storm\sent, you instantly protect your assist because its on the opposite side now. DP’s can be cancelled into super, dhc so he can dhc out with an invincible move. Shoryureppa is instant as well which makes for another easy dhc. Against every character but cable, ken can get lucky with dp’s +assists for easy pins. If they try anything to hit you, ken goes through it even assists. The only bad part about s\s ken is the actual sent\ken part. You should probably use ken as an extension of the robot since he doesn’t combo well with the robot because his lack of fwd movement. However using him to counter assists or using him for his invincible angle is god like. ken AA does 26 pts of damage for all 3 hits which is more than capcom and cable. One con is that dhc’s into ken don’t really work well. LA, LS can combo into shinryuken but storm has to be in deep w\ the opponents sprite and nothing combos from hsf right. Other than that, he fits well imo. He’s not capcom\cyke but he does offer something.

if you catch point and assist in this combo, they’re done. c.fp, sj.lk, rh tatsu, you can lp before you hit the ground to juggle assist right above the ground, shinryuken, hail. If the robot is there, samething up to the lp part after the tatsu, shoryureppa, timed hsf and kill from there. The ken into storm is like 99% not exactly a full kill but hey, i’ll take it.

s\s as a duo is just too damn strong. All they really need are AA’s that function well and can provide the type of chemistry needed to be effective. Ken\guile both have great AA’s with nice properties but some minor problems plague them but not enough so that they shouldn’t be played. There AA’s force options that your can use to your advantage. Its not capcom, cable or cyke but there AA are good enough to be used for advantageous opportunities. IMO, I really like s\s\ken over s\s\guile for only a few reasons.


#2

cammy and ironman can really work well with this team. imagine having both storm and ironman to DHC to? that shit’s crazy. cammy’s aaa is about as effective vs. sentinel as guile IMHO. It hit’s instantly. personally, i think she’s a beter overall character than ken and guile though.


#3

I like s\s\im. Dope squad. My one gripe about s\s\cammy is that cammy takes damage like the bitch she is.


#4

use sentinel to cover her ass.


#5

Yo i know AAA are better, but S/S/T…Ouch!!! Stupid Tron


#6

i agree wit mixah…cammy’s AAA is killa…it beats out alot of other assist


#7

Agreed. Plus Cammy is an overall better character than Ken and guile imo.


#8

you have to really look @ the whole picture when you try to compare variations of a team by AA.

cammy is great for counter calling, quick for an aa, invicible iirc on startup. Her point play with s\s is rediculous but shes lacking a solid dhc aside from her kba which is damn near impossible to dhc into hsf. When you dhc early on it into hail, it only does a little bit of life since the bulk of the combo is the actual slam into ground where you can’t dhc anymore. If you take her kba and you don’t have bar, you can’t dhc but you get hella life for it. So one of her best damage tools is neutralized unless you have bar to burn. Also, cammys kba is her main tool against the top 4. They can’t stop her from doing her kba. Again, a main tool of hers is gone because you need the bar to get out. Guile\ken can strictly use there bar for dhc’s because there point damage play is higher than cammys outside of supers. They’ll take chunks off a character with the right ac’s.

Also, she has weak stamina. A combo that would normally do 25% to cyke\cable\capcom\guile\ken would probably do 40% if not more on cammy. So shes really handicpaed there. comparitively, I can can call cable\capcom twice for every cammy call since her stamina is much weaker by relation to damage. How many times can you actually use your assist w\o it getting nuked or putting yourself into a bad spot where your forced to cover it? everyone assist gets hurt over the course of the fight and the stronger your assists stamina is, the better off you are. I’m not saying s\s\cammy sucks because s\s\AA is going to be god like. Especially if that AA can fight top tiers. All though cammy having bad stamina is real good reason to shy away from it.

and yea, cammy may be a better character than guile but not by much. Like a 1-2 character difference. Guiles up there as a character.


#9

Forget the theory Marvel bullshit.

How many guiles do you see rank high, by comparison to Cammy? I’ve never seen a Guile rank in a tournie, but I have seen Cammy. You can’t go by “OMG OMG DEFENSE!” because look at Strider. And Storm / Magneto take slightly more damage as well. You’re saying that she’s not as good because of defense, yet, she wins in every other area? That’s bullshit.

As I’ve said in the past…

  1. You can’t tier characters based on theory Marvel. (or for any fighter)
  2. You can’t tier characters based on player mis-execution (eg. Sentinel’s not lower because ffly takes too much practice)
  3. You can’t tier characters based on “who’s playing” (eg. Wolverine’s not ranked high, even though Zaza can rape)
  4. Tiers don’t mean shit in terms of what plays and what wins. Tiers are only what characters are used the most.

#10

Shout: You’re absoulutely right (about guile. He’s underated as shit) , but, her low defense simply means that you would have to be more chareful how you call her out imo. IIRC she stays in around the same amount of time as guile when on AAA, but cammy does have invincible startup (alot) and I don’t think guile does.

Edit: plus, honestly, I find her just better on point than guile. which makes a huge difference for any assist.


#11

thats not theory marvel. Cammy needs her kba to truly run over top tiers. w\o it, her damage output isn’t nearly as high. Take it away from her and she goes down the tier ladder a little. Shes handicapped a little on s\s because she can’t take advantage of her kba if she gets snapped in early or you don’t have bar. Which is possible because storm likes to dump it. Now if shes the last character alive, balls to the wall but in the team dynamic aspect of it, shes handicapped.

just because you seen cammy place high that makes guile obsolete? comparitively, how many cammys do you see played over guile? then it goes into how many of those guile players were actually good enough to compete against good players. Cammy is much easier to play in compariso to guile but that doesn’t make guile any less deadly. Just tougher to play.

josh wong is a big name up in NY i believe or that region. Hasn’t he placed high up there with guile as his AA. I’m sure I heard he ran s\s\guile and cable\sent\guile and doing pretty well with it.

storm and magneto get away with bad defense because of their overheads and pure damage output along with air dashes that enable them to completely control the screen. Magnus drops you in 1 hit, storm just flat out rapes. Strider and cammy don’t have overheads or airdashes which means there options are totally different so comparing them is totally irellevant. and for the record, strider sucks against anyone who know hows to beat it.

her crappy defense means you have to be more careful with it. Of course. Your inclined to cover your assist every time but it means more if you fuck it up. I’ve been playing marvel for 2 years seriously and I can’t really remember a time where my assist never got hurt. When your forced to protect your assist because it gets baited or you called it wrong, you have to take an extra step to cover it which gives your opponent time to take advantage of your extra move. Against magnus\storm or sent\aa variations, thats hella life IF not the game.


#12

IMO the only reason guile is a tad bit hard to play is because of his charge moves and slower speed…but if a gud cammy is snapped in she has the capability of a lock down with storm and sent…guile on the other hand…NAH… and cammy throws are rediculus…the PP throw and a OTG…not to mention that she has a double jump…if she doesnt have a super,by all means double jump combo and a throw…and if you dumb and not tech hit or roll she can reset it…thats just my opinon…CAMMY is so much better…im not downing guile because i can play with him to but uhhhhh…CAMMY/AAA


#13

what are u guys trying to argue here.

the difference between storm/sent/guile and storm/sent/cammy is so minimal when u have your storm or sent on point. And for the most part you will be counter calling ur assists so be able to cover your assists shouldn’t be a major problem when your opponent is blocking. I don’t know about the properties of guiles assists, what it cuts through or not, but cammy has invincibility until she makes contact with something solid so you trade in damage output for abusability. You can knock storms and sents out of their hyper move. Guiles assist comes out with a wider attack and maybe its slightly easier to connect a hailstorm too. Guile’s AAA is like anti-sent but you will be facing other characters not just sent plus cammy AAA will hurt sent too. They both have ground hyper moves that you can DHC out of and connect storm or sents hyper moves. when your talking about mid-teir AAA the differences are not as significant. This is like a quasi-version of aruging which is better, santhrax or matrix.

**if your talking about when your down to your last character near the end of the match, cammy > guile is so obvious. **

storm can’t do typhoon xX hailstorm, sent cant do stomp patterns just to get chip damage and anyone else with laggy moves gets a KBA to the face.
cammy has more air mobility and easier resets.


#14

it becomes theory when you obviously don’t know how to play cammy, and making false pretenses against her in an argument.

First, it’s not difficult to dhc from KBA.
Second, Its not her primary weapon against the top tiers, it’s her primary weapon in air combos, but cammy has a lot more than air combos.
You literally make it sound like KBA is her only attack. It’s not like cammy players go around doing KBA to counter other shit. You have no idea how to even play her.

Seriously, and don’t you dare put words into my mouth you little piece of shit. i never said guile’s obsolete. You know what? I’ve seen three people play cammy, and all three have placed. i’ve seen countless people play guile, and i’ve seen one place. That’s not good odds there. Justin wong doesn’t ever place with his guile low tier team, but he does it with his cammy one. There’s more players, but at 7am, that’s all i’m willing to even think of. placing high with SS/Guile is a LOT DIFFERENT than placing high with Cammy / Cyclops / Tron, like Justin does.

Strider and cammy have instant overheads man. watch the DJ-B13 video. You might NEED an assist, but you can instant j.lk with strider for an overhead, and j.lp with cammy + assist. you get free air combos with cyclops.

“strider sucks against anybody who knows how to beat him”…
EVERYBODY SUCKS AGAINST PEOPLE THAT KNOW HOW TO BEAT IT. That’s like saying an all-star college baller sucks against Iverson because he can easily beat him. What the fuck is that?

Seriously, you’ve got some really bad arguments there.

EDIT:
one more thing… 25% on guile, but 40+ on cammy? the fuck are you on drugs?

get storm to do a basic air combo on guile, does 40 damage (hk, sj, magic, hk) now do it on cammy, shit does 45 damage. It’s NOT THAT MUCH DIFFERENT BUDDY. Not to mention, in combos that invovle random hits, like Hailstorm, Lightening Storm, AHVB, and Tempest, she takes LESS than guile on an average, since she’s much smaller.

Get your shit straight before you start making comparisons.

EDIT2:
you should feel embarrassed, that even captain dipshit himself, sealhunta, has you completely beat out.


#15

Girls, Girls calm down now, there is no reason to get upset.

Mixah, the point he is making about kba is not that it’s cammy’s only weapon, but that you CAN’T dhc from it HSF, and the Dhc to Hailstorm is really only for the switch because you can only DHC on the first hit(which does like 1 fiecre.) So in other words he’s saying that you can’t get big damage off an air combo dhc.

Now then the difference in stamina was his other point, i believe he was saying as an assist, if Guile takes 20 points of damage, cammy takes 40 points. I don’t how accurate that is, but i get that he is trying to show a difference in stamina.

their AAA, Guile’s comes out at a wider range, and actually goes to the top of the screen because of the blade(i think), Cammy’s comes out at a wide arc, and is invincible to i believe the point where she goes over the nj screen. The touch part about Guile’s is that he lands next to the oppenent for an easy hit, but the same goes for Cammy. Protecting both is the same.

Finally, thier point performance.

i believe cammy is better vs cable, and Guile is better vs Sentinel…thats all i can think of.


#16

storm/sent/sonson

sonson is fun she sucks on point but who cares her aa is awesome!


#17

kba cause you to fall straight down, so you CAN DHC into plasma ball. why do sent players always forget about that super?


#18

its not even worth the energy to constantly post back to this thread anymore.

edit: its funny how you tell me to go watch the djb13 strider video when I helped make it.


#19

Irony…

In russia, Video watches you


#20

dude, whatever. i heard you got a beastly strider. whatever… but other than that. shut the fuck up.