[MTUP] M. Bison (Dictator)

fei-long

#1

I had brought up my opinion of Fei’s matchup with dictator in another thread and Nosone suggested we take the talk here, which I thought was a great idea.

Here are my reasons as to why I feel this is a one-sided matchup in favor of Dictator.

  • Dictator’s Forward and Roundhouse prevent Fei from closing in with either Chicken Wing or far Rekkas.

  • Once in, you would think Rekka pressure would be ideal in this matchup for Fei but just like everyone else in the game, if you anticipate Rekkas, just focus and that takes care of that.

  • Normally I feel confident with Fei’s great reach on playing footsies mid-screen away, but I feel the risk versus reward is skewed in Dictator’s favor here with his crazy normals.

  • Once Dictator gets the lead, I feel he can run away and sit on it with little effort.

If you disagree/agree lemme know your thoughts. If you have specifics to counter M. Bison’s play, please share those too, of course. I’m fairly set in my opinion on this matchup but hope I’m wrong haha.


#2

I play Bison and I feel this match up is pretty even. But as long as I have range and EX meters, Fei’s not going to really get much damage in.


#3

I posted this in he other match-up thread since this didn’t exist before lol, good thinking.

Bison’s not the toughest match-up in the game, especially thanks to his lack of a good reversal on wake-up. Yes, his EX Psycho crusher can get him out of sticky situations, but he has to burn meter for that and it usually won’t punish a cross-up

Bison’s typical game looks like this:
–Walk back to build a charge or crouch charge and spam Devil’s Reverse to build meter.
–At a moment when you commit to an unnecessary move, he launches scissors, slide, or Psycho crusher to catch you during recovery.

–At mid range, he jumps over to cross you up with his knee.
–To confirm into a special he pulls: cr.LKs x3-4 XX LK Scissors, cr.LK x1 XX LK Scissors again (Why? Because it’s totally safe.) Block this until he pushes himself out of normal range. He may also use jabs to confirm this.
-----> On hit or block with a cr.LK, he may walk up and throw instead. Throw tech can beat that, and it can also beat his 4-frame cr.lk.
–Standing HK/MK to zone you out since it’s fast and un-punishable. Use MK CW to fly through this with invincibility.

–Long-range= more Devil’s reverse for meter and sitting on a charge to bait you. You can’t punish these directly. Rather, keep moving in on him and force him into the corner where it’s no longer an option. If he comes towards you with Devil’s reverse instead of retreating, consider it an opportunity to Flame kick counter.
–Devil’s reverses Fake Out, which whiffs in front of you, allows him to go for a throw. Tech this, flame kick or jab on reaction.
–Headstomp. Neutral jump HK will beat this if you jump early or neutral jump MK if later. Retreat jump kick if really late. Forward/Backdash will give you an opportunity to punish hard.

–Teleport at strategic moments to force you to whiff. Use caution.

Fei meet’s Bison’s pressure with his own rekka pressure which can come more spontaneously. As far as Focus being the end-all to random Rekkas, I’d try mixing them up a little since they do come out pretty fast; unless he’s waiting for it, there’s no reason why he should have his fingers ready on Focus. You can also throw two Rekkas out at max range instead of one, or just cross Bison up if you’re close enough.

If Bison gets predictable with his jump-ins, Flame Kick> FADC them either on sight or on reversal. This will make him more wary of jumping in. If Bison does get the jump on you, let him finish his dial-a-combo up to the second LK Scissors, and watch for FADC combo breaker moments as cue to Flame Kick, CW, or tech a throw.

If you manage to force Bison back into the corner, don’t be too aggressive about rushing in. Wait within Rekka range to find your opening. If he’s spamming HK or MK, walk as close as you can and try to fly through with MK CW. His kicks both start up in 6 frames, have 3 frames of activity and 14/16 frames of recovery. Contrast this with Fei’s 10 Frames of invincibility on his 16 frame attack and you’ll see why it works so well for many Fei users here. You can do this on reaction to a kick and hit Bison since you have a total of 9 frames to react for a clean hit.

Up close, Bison’s reliable reversals are EX Headstomp/Devil’s reverse, EX scissors, EX psycho, and Teleport. Both forward moving EX’s can be punished and he knows that. EX stomp can be deadly if you whiff a Flame kick, but can otherwise be back dashed. Teleport can be punished on Dash> Rekka or HP rekkas if you’re not committed to an attack.

Phew, with all of that said, yes Bison can mix things up on you pretty well, but there’s nothing stopping Fei from crossing him up most of the time, pulling a jab>tenshin, or throwing random Rekkas when he’s idle, assuming you’re not telegraphing that you’ll throw them. This fight is all about spacing and avoiding Bison’s footsies since Bison’s tools aren’t the scariest in the world (no SRK> Ultra to worry about and damage output is average/equal to Fei’s). Even if he knocks you down, his damage really ends there.

Final judgment is a 5-5.


#4

Agreed with all said here, but dictator has no serious anti air. Meaty but safe jumpins makes most bisons burn EX bar to escape, and a well timed crouching HP stuffs scissors kick. Pretty even match up for me.


#5

KrsJin you forgot the most important thing. As soon as Bison enters his walking back animation the front half of his hitbox just disappears. A lot of stuff that would normally hit will miss Bison if he’s walking backwards, even simple block strings are escapable by walking backwards even if Bison is backed into the corner. This combined with good normals and lk scissor kicks makes Bison able to counterpoke everything with ease while doing some chip damage with lk scissor after which he will just walk back to make just about everything whiff and get another easy st.mk counterpoke. If it wasn’t for Bisons weak mixups and damage and his not so solid wakeup game this match would be extremely bad for Fei. I consider this to be an almost 3-7 matchup


#6

As a Bison main, a few frame data corrections:
cr. short is 3 frames
st mk and hk should be 5 frames


#7

Oh my bad lol. The main point is there–what do you think?

[edit] I went by the Frame chart on the SRK wiki–you’re right on the 3 -frame kick, I guess it just feels slow to me. On the chart it says that s.MK and s.HK are 6 frames though. What’s the deal?


#8

I think it’s humanly impossible to do a mk cw on reaction within 9 frames. Especially considering that you’d have to start the CW motion at frame 5


#9

Why frame 5? It would be 9 (or 8 as the case might be) total for the s.HK from start up to the end of active frames, with an additional 16 frames for recovery. If you react to a whiff imperfectly, you can still force a block out of Bison (unless he’s twitchy and launches a counter perfectly). I think you’re assuming to launch right when being hit and right within range; that may not work as consistently. This threat is to force Bison to stop whiffing the s.HK to zone you out. If he stops, then you have your opening for random Rekka or whatever you choose to advance.

[edit] Made me think for a sec. If each input is 1 frame, then you’d have to buffer at least the initial portion (HCF) in anticipation. Small caveat I suppose, but the point is still to get inside Bison, not deal direct damage.


#10

I think this match up is 5-5 and maybe even 6-4 for Fei. You can say that I really have this match down pat. But then I have quite a bit of experience in this match since my cousin mains Bison and we usually play each other a lot…I’ve also played a good deal of SG Bison players. Honestly, Fei can match and counter almost anything Bison can throw at him…Sure Bison has more HP and does more damage but Fei just has better tools in this match. Fei’s rekkas, cr. MK and cr. HP are good tools in this match but MK/HK CW will beat Bison’s st. MK/HK and flatout neutralize his offense…being efficient w/ connecting cr. LP > rekkas after HK CW though is also a major plus; your main objective is to knock him down and make him use meter to try and escape your pressure. Anyhow once you land a CW, the Bison player will most likely do the following:

  1. Reversal EX Psycho crusher: in which you block and punish w/ HP rekkas(yes, you will get ALL 3 hits if you time it correctly; just wait a bit until bison’s body fully crosses over to the other side and then start doing rekkas and it all should land perfectly)…Learning how to properly punish EX pyscho crusher is VERY VERY important in this matchup as it takes away his only safe reversal.

  2. Teleport: Simply do another MK/HK CW after landing a CW lol. He will teleport, reappear and eat another CW!!! This option is pretty cool b/c even if he tries to reversal EX psycho crusher, he will go right through your CW lol; you’ll be safe and he has just wasted a chunk of meter. If he teleports, he eats another CW so in a sense, you’re knocking 2 birds with 1 stone.

  3. Block: Once he realizes that you can punish his EX psycho crusher and his teleport, he’ll opt for the safest option; Blocking. This is a good thing b/c now it lets you continue with your offense and most of all, now it enables you to start using Tenshin.

  4. EX stomp: Sometimes they will do this after getting hit by a CW but honestly, this shit is super easy to dodge and see. Becareful though b/c if you do another CW after landing a CW, this might nail you…although it will fly right over on some occasions. It’s pretty risky overall for him so you can bet most good Bison players won’t be using this much.

Other notes to consider:

  • Walk Bison to the corner where you will have the advantage; use lots of neutral jumping as you’re walking him back to the corner to mess up his scissor kick zoning game. Punish all jump in attempts.
  • After you block a LK scissorkick, counterattack with a CW…don’t let him get the momentum on you. You can actually cross him up if he tries to go for a cr. LK > LK scissors and if he tries to dash back, you nail him. Don’t be too predictable though b/c he can answer w/ EX stomp.
  • Punish blocked EX scissorkick w/ EX flamekick.
  • Be patient; Fei can sit back on a life lead just as easily. Unlike Fei, Bison can’t really start an offense w/ out having you come to him since he’s a charge character. At the most, he can either only jump in, do a random cr. HK slide, or dash in and throw. Learn how to appropriately defend against these options and you won’t really fear Bison’s offense at all.
  • Jump Neutral A LOT to screw up his scissor kick zoning/pressure game. J. neutral HK > combo of choice against any mistimed scissor kick.
  • Tensin is REALLY useful in this match up once you’ve got Bison on the defensive. st. LP > EXTenshin works great here. If he tries to jump after blocking your st. LP to escape the tenshin trap, try doing st. LP > st. HK which will hit him out of his jump frame. Even better, if you do st. LP > LK/MK CW, you can beat all 3 of his escape options of jumping away, dashing back, and teleporting away!!!
  • Use Fei’s cr. MK to go right under and counter against Bison’s headstomp followup where he comes down w/ both hands. If you have meter, do Cr. MK > Rekkakenshin for big damage.
  • Once you have Bison corner trapped, watch for EX pyscho crusher(block and punish with HP rekkas) and EX devil’s reverse(punish with EX flamekick).
  • Learn how to block his j. HP and j. MK fake cross ups. This can be a bit tricky at first but once you get enough experience, you can just feel what direction you need to block and it won’t be an issue.
  • Most importantly, you have to read your opponent. Some will spam moves more than others and some turtle more. However at the end of the day, Fei has all the tools to win this matchup.

#11

great explanation, thank you sir!


#12

great post Tsua, I also feel more confident now (still need more actual practice on your solutions lol)

I used to get punished by ex PC when i try to pressure after a cw, but then i switch to block and punish him with rekkas, or even super.

I’d like to rant again on FeiLong’s ultra. It’d be much more useful if it travels as fast and as far as the hp super. Right now you really need to time and space correctly to punish a blocked ex PC with an ultra.

Dunno if you can still punish the new PC in SSF4 with reakkas yet (longer hit box?) Hopefully it wouldn’t have any major impacts.


#13

Sorry guys Im stupid. 6 frame startup for mk and hk


#14

can someone that claims to be good at fei play against a friend of mine… he plays dictator and guy … lives in texas…

pm “clutch city 95”

if you can record the games — would be nice =)

playing vs him makes me want to quit fei :crybaby:


#15

on SF4 PC there’s “IbizaDance” Bison. I simply CANNOT find a way to beat him. So frustrating :\


#16

btw above friend plays on xbox


#17

I’d love to take the challenge!!! I feel like I’ve fought some very good M. Bison players and I find this matchup quite in Fei’s favor. I’m gonna add him and see if we can set up some matches.


#18

Thanks to Cross-up PC from Bison, this match-up is tough. Even if block, homeboy is safe from FP Rekkas(Only if both hits from the PC hits I believe)And if you want to avoid the chip damage, you have to do a Reversal Chicken Wing that leaves you on the other side of the stage, basically resetting the match. Bison having EX also is another headache. This is a match-up I play very, very carefully. Cr.MP is my good friend against this bastard(Takes out Knee Press at start up)to get close, including the CW.


#19

awesome :nunchuck:


#20

Well I had some games with him last night and yeah, he’s very frustrating to fight against for sure lol…the first 8 or 9 games, I won pretty decisively but later on, it was more back and forth with him winning some and me winning some but I’d like to think that I still got the better of those matches. Later on, he adopted a total turtle playstyle though which is fair I suppose but honestly, I could’ve turtled too but it just wasn’t my style…staying at the back of the screen and just looking at each other isn’t very fun so I tried to make him fight and in the end, I got punished for it. Next time I’ll be sure to wait him out lol. GGs though. Again if you fight a turtle Bison, turtle him down too once you get the life lead…don’t feel like you always have to be pressing him just b/c Fei is a command character and Bison’s a charge character. I guess I should take my own advice eh haha?