MvCI Meta and Tier Discussion


#901

You should tag most of the time. Your strings last longer and makes bad strings more safe or potentially safe

The only bad use of tag that I see is people that tag out their 70 percent yellow health character for their 10 percent yellow health partner just to extend their block pressure. Which is dumb because if the opponent somehow counter hits you or mashes super you just lost your character for no good reason. If you sitting partner has danger low health you shouldn’t be putting them back in the fight other than to combo into something that will kill


#902

Anyone else been using tick throws a good bit? I can get some ambiguous setups by dashing through people trying to roll away. Wasn’t sure how good throws would be with how bad they scale but as long as you can get cheap set ups off of them it makes it worth it.


#903

Don’t forget throws remove all red life. One throw can be a game changer.


#904

Reality is overrated as hell to me. I actually prefer fighting reality stone users over soul and space because there are teams using it that really have no business using it. If you’re moving around the screen correctly, you can ignore reality stone spam in neutral, and if you play characters like Spidey or Gammora you can nullify it completely and punish for a full combo. It seems universally useful at first, but only because most opponents are trying to brute force their offense instead of using their movement/tools to force a mistake. My current team of Spidey/Carol doesn’t give two shits about reality, and there are ways for just about every character in the game to deal with it if it’s not being used for oki pressure or left/right shenanigans as intended.


#905

Reality definitely doesn’t have as strong of a comeback factor as soul stone… fuck soul stone, it brings a dead character back with waaaaay too much health, and makes you ride out the 2 character at once thing for far too long

power stone might be good too for a universal GTFO option into big damage, and ToDs on activation BUT I might be crazy here but I don’t think it works properly in training mode… I think if you have your stone set to “automatically refill” you can do impossible power stone combos because the gauge doesn’t properly deplete. Set stone to 100% and it seems to function as normal.

it’s just a suspicion for now. I forgot to test it last night but when I sat down trying to figure out some Cap Marvel power stone stuff I could only do like 7 hits before a full gauge was empty, and I’ve seen a Chun Li power stone combo where she does 20+ hits with the gauge just ticking down as normal


#906

What’s the list of characters that shit on Reality surge in neutral?

Gamora, Rocket, Carol, Jedah for sure. I would guess Dorm, Strange, Strider, Thanos too. Who else?


#907

The web zipper, of course. I don’t know shit about Spencer, but I assume he has something as well. Hulk and Nemesis can armor through it too.


#908

Ultron, anybody with armor that can move forward with it.


#909

Spencer is very mobile, but Reality surge does a pretty good job of contesting the space he wants to move through, and his grappler and Reality negate each other on clash. I wouldn’t say he’s great against it.

I would have thought Spidey would have similar problems, but thinking about it he’s faster than Spencer so I guess I can see it.


#910

Spidermans webzip ignores projectiles so he doesnt care at all about it. Any character that has that ‘feature’ or easy access to armor should be able to wreck reality surge. Definitely add Thor to the list.


#911

Dante takes a big poop on reality surge. Teleport air backdash pretty much throws you out of the entire path of the surge and lets you decide to move in or just do it again to keep running away from it. Air play and J.hk can snipe it pretty well. Teleport into rain dance can hop you up and over the surge and shoot it out of the air. Devil Trigger thunderbolt shits on it also. You can just jump up and shoot towards it and it can easily eat up 2 surges on the screen with one bolt.

Funny enough I think Ryu does well against the surge as well because his beam is very fast start up after the initial charge. It pretty much hits full screen as soon as you let go of the button. Since everyone jumps in the air to shoot the surge jumping up and beaming pretty much covers the entire vertical and horizontal space it could come towards you from. Charging and shooting the beam happens fast enough where you can punish the surge from full screen on reaction. You’ll hit them before they can recover to block and get the surge off screen. Plus shinku hadoken reaction punish.

Captain America can carthweel through it and then tag in your partner. Your partner will come in way far ahead of the surge and then can just pressure the opponent with throws or buttons.


#912

Seems like it just sort of erases some characters, and others don’t care.
Guess that’s cool since you have 2 people, but have to hope one of them gets around it. Doesn’t seem like it affects the characters people think are top either so I guess that’s cool too…


#913

So there’s something like 14 characters who who beat Reality surge by doing the stuff they want to be doing anyway, and at least another handful who have some sort of known tools for working around it.

Kind of makes you wish more people complaining would just branch out to the plethora of things that counter pick it.


#914

So who are the supposed characters that get bodied by reality surge any way? I’m trying to think of some, but can’t. At least as far as to the point where you would need to switch in another character or make another team to deal with it.


#915

Soul Surge ignore reality stone as well.


#916

Interesting. Soul surge seems to be one of the few projectiles that doesn’t nullify it off the screen, but simply passes through it. I wonder if that’s because it’s technically an attack instead of a projectile. It can also reaction punish from a range and give you free life.


#917

But, for example, if Ghost Rider is chilling in the back controlling things swinging chains doing some stray damage, why should you switch to do extra damage and put your self out on the front line just to potentially get countered, when two seconds ago you you were in the back playing a safe keepaway game?

The point character still has potential to control or survive in the neutral without a partner, like the imidiate thing you shouldn’t be doing is “spam spam spam switch, spam spam spam switch…” Yes it works and it’s winning people matches but I don’t think it’s the intelligent way to play the game, it’s just the safe way of surviving the current scramble everyone is put in.

Eventually solid teams will be formed, stone matchups will be understood, and those long switch strings will become predictable, baitable and punishable. You have to remember by switching you’re not only protecting your self, but you’re changing the matchup as well and you might find that switching is actually unfavourable, to instead fight in the neutral longer until a better opportunity comes along.

There are no assists anymore, the point character has to provide the assist, which means good neutral and stone play is highly important in making things 100% safe, which at this current time they’re not. You know, one wrong switch into an invincible character could be a 40%a/20%b loss of life in a happy birthday, just off a hyper that tagged you both, all they have to do is react to the blue flash and you’re coming in pressing buttons. You switched for nothing.


#918

Yeah it’s pretty much one of those it’s going to work until it stops working things. People probably aren’t using stone storm guard cancels enough as that’s pretty much the only way to get out of the tightest stuff like beam super lockdown and could potentially set up HBD’s on obvious tags. Just since people don’t understand enough about the characters and teams it’s relatively “safe” to do.


#919

I’ll try to explain this as easily as possible.

Question:

OUTSIDE of matchup considerations, what’s the most basic and important thing to create or have when conducting offense?

Answer:

Frame advantage. Specifically upclose frame advantage.
Frame advantage leads to mixups, mixups lead to damage, damage leads to you winning the game.

Tagging correctly is basically ALWAYS going to give you frame advantage so it’s something you should always be looking for.

Yes there are bad tags. No you shouldn’t be tagging as fast as possible, you should be looking to tag as much as possible to get frame advantage though so you can go into your mixups more freely.
Tags are actually a lot like assists. When you pressed assist in older marvels you still had to protect your assist. And you still have to protect your tag in this game as well.

Now, matchup consideration of course take precedence. If I’m Arthur I don’t want to take on Dante or dorm, or if I do I want to rush them down because I don’t want to leave myself open to easy teleports… but those are matchup considerations and outside the general scope of the conversation, you really should be tagging as much as safely possible to be giving yourself the best chance at mixups… ESPECIALLY since moves that move your character forward are basically auto in moves unlike older marvels where a forward moving assist wasn’t a free way in.


#920

What’s the logic behind this list? Like why Thanos shits on it? Teleport? Then you’re missing other teleporters.

Gamora or Spiderman, while they can negate the projectile, it only works at a certain angle which the other players should never put themselves unless they’re retarded. Like what can Gamora do if you’re using the surge above her?