My 1 Issue about EVO2k7, 3s - 1 game

Evo Championship Series
#1

So, i just like to know whos bright idea it was to make 3s 1 fuckin game. Ok, lets name all the super long games that take forwever. CVS2, the communities most hated on game…it gets 1 game of course. SMASH BRO’s , after this year, it has been proven that this is the new LONGEST GAME champion. No other game out there takes longer than this damn game. 5 stocks AND 2/3? Yet the evo staff decides to make 3s 1 game wtf? Tekken DR, which has been proven to take forever due to the fact peeps turtle like a mofo, still…2/3 no complaints. 3s might as well be as fast as ST, its easy the 2nd fastest game in the entire line up. Oh but yet EVO Staff figures eh…lets do 1 game for these bastards. GARBAGE!

I got DQ’d into losers cause i was told “by staff member” that it was ok for me to go eat and come back, my name wouldnt be called. Come back about 30 min later and half the bracket is damn near done because EVO Staff decides 3s should be 1 game. WHACK! Things need to be set in stone and EVO Staff really needs to start figuring out a way to have these brackets run smooth so they dont run into time restraints.

This was my only beef about this years evo, other than that shit was coo =)

J-Cole

ps - 3 Cheers for another shitty version of ST. lol GG Sirlin, better not fuck up HD ST =P

#2

No arguments here.

The big problem is that our schedule was so jam packed that if the tiniest thing goes wrong we run behind schedule and have to make compromises like this. We’re exploring ways of fixing this for 2008.

I think smash was great, but 4 - 5 minute smash games is way too long. If smash returns in 2008, we will adjust the rules so that the average game time is 2 - 3 minutes. I’d like input from the smash community on ways to make this happen.

#3

Easily the worst part of EVO for me.

I do understand that 3S is very popular and is the reason why it got turned into best of 1. Yet I would think EVO staff would anticipate that, especially with online registration. Were there that many last minute registrations?

I also heard Smash (eventually?) got turned into best of 1 before finals, and they are not too happy about it either.

I said this before in another post but hopefully this is something that will dramatically improve by next year. I still liked EVO overall.

#4

CvS2 and Smash are both ridiculously long. They were both 1-game, too, though.

3S 1-game was lame, but there was nothing we could do. The reason we have to change the rules at the event is because we have no idea how many people will be in the tournament until 10 minutes before it starts because of emergency registration. We though we had enough time to run a 2/3 3s event based on online registrations, but that plan was blown out of the water when over 40 more people signed up at the event.

There’s no way we can fix that unless we know exactly how many people are coming to the event so we can budget our time accordingly. Look for big changes in this area next year. We’re toying with lots of ideas, including eliminating emergency registration entirely and making everyone register (and pay) online. There are some disadvantages to doing this, but there are big advantages too (e.g. we can show you the bracket a week in advance and tell you EXACTLY what time you need to show up to play, to the minute).

Ditto on HD ST.

#5

yes, i like the online registration online and the ability to show people the bracket. I am ALL FOR this idea. If some wanna argue that they dont have credit cards to pay online, then go get a money order, or western union or a friend to pay online for them. Plenty of ways for people to pay online so we can clean this event up and have it run as smooth as a babys bottom or Julian Beaslys bald head =D hehehe :wink:

J-Cole

#6

My #1 suggestion would be to drop a game if not 2. VF and DOA have both turned out to be terrible tournament games for us. The # of entrants is always low and I even read on a VF message board today that the players question the point in even playing the Japanese.

One of the biggest problems is how to organize pools. The Smash community only plays smash and during their pools - everyone was either there or went looking for the person they had to play. With all these stupid fucking side tournaments going on no one is ever where they need to be. I don’t know how many times I had to wait for someone to finish playing their game in marvel team tournament or guilty gear singles tournament.

I’m at the point now where I would rather just drop 1 or 2 games, ban all side tournaments and with the left over room focus more on things like Hsien vs Amir, Justin vs. Duc Jr, etc on the big screen.

Derek Daniels

#7

I didn’t watch Third Strike at all but one thing that I did notice about some of the other games is that people would play their match and then go away. This resulted in names being called over the microphone looking for these people. Sometimes matches can go long but that doesn’t mean that anyone can leave because they think that it will be a while before their next match. If you paid to enter a tourney and you know that it is at a certain time, devote the hour or so to pool play so that everyone can get out faster. I did like the the announcing over the microphone but once everyone is accounted for the mic should not have to be used. If someone is available for their first match and they are not available for their second match then put them in the losers bracket. It may not seem fair but they should stay if they don’t want to be eliminated.

Sometimes people have to use the restroom and that is fine as long as they inform the person that is coordinating the bracket. Everyone who attends needs to make an effort to make the tourney run smoother. One other issue is people not letting the coordinator of the bracket know who won the match. this should be the responsibility of the winner of the match or just have more judges at the TV’s during the semis to record the results.

#8

3s, CVS2, and GG should have turned 2/3 as soon as the pools ended. VF, DOA, or both really need to be dropped.

#9

Concur. If it weren’t for BYOC, more matches could have been played. All the TV’s used for BYOC could have helped expedite 3S, SSBM, CvS2, TDR, and MvC2 pools.

Instead of allowing people to host ‘side tourneys’, maybe you can incorporate them into the Evo Championship Series. Not something random like Pokemon Revolution or anything like that, but I’m talking about the MvC2/GG Team Tourneys. There were over 40 teams for the Marvel Teams Tourney. Big enough to get slotted for a spot in the schedule IMO.

Dropping games with low entries will help too and in turn replace it with something else like GG Team/MvC2 Team tourney. That way, there isn’t a reason players miss their pools in 3S/TDR/Etc due to participating in another tourney going on at the same time. You need to be at your appointed bracket/pool or risk being disqualified. I ran bracket F for 3S and I made it run pretty smooth. People who got DQ’ed never showed up at all to their bracket or left and never came back or came back too late. You can only run so many game in the bracket until you cannot run anymore until that person plays their game and that can possibly hold up 3 or more matches! Too much time wasted. Be there or be peaced out by DQ.

So you have these options:

  1. More TV’s/stations
  2. Drop the least popular game or two
  3. Incorporate the ever popular side tournament (like MvC2/GG Team)
  4. Ban side tourneys since you can add them to the main schedule
  5. Get the big money/grudge matches in the schedule well in advance to fit it in the schedule for ‘Special Events’

-Rotendo

#10

My suggestion for smash bros in another thread was make the game 3 stocks. I don’t think time really matters since nobody is turtling for timeover. Game is straight rush down lol.

#11

I think a way to solve this is to make Evolution a four day event.

Friday: Pools and Semis (GG, DR, MvC2, ST)
Saturday: Make-Ups, Pools and Semis (SSBB [1 Game], CvS2 [1 Game], 3S [2/3])
Sunday: Make-Ups, Side Tournaments, and Special Events
Monday: Finals

I do not think side tournaments should be banned. It is what attracts a lot of people.

Also, this year’s Evolution should have started at the 17th and ended at the 19th of August because I know a couple people missed their first day of college because a lot of colleges start at the 27th. It might not be a problem if you live in California, but it is a problem if you live at the EC. I didn?t come this year because I didn?t want to miss my first day of college. I might make it next year.

#12

I think if people were playing matches on all tvs at all times, a lot of the problems would go away. I think this happens because the pools just look like a random crowd with players/ non players / wanderers etc…

The judges can’t DQ people, cause they can’t be 100% sure if they really are there, the players aren’t quite sure when they are playing, so it just becomes a mess.

With a big event hall and enough tvs, I think the answer is to move away from that arcade style setup where everyone crowds around a couple machines fighting with the actual players for space.

In most sports there’s a play area, bench for players who are in the game and not playing, judges area, and spectator area. Everyone knows where the action is, and where they are supposed to be. So here’s what i was thinking:

  • Make the pools look more like a pool: section off the areas and put chairs in for people that are in the pool, so it at least looks like they are supposed to stay around. Spectators are not allowed in the pool area, however they can be in the middle area (assuming the pools are still on the left and right sides of the room).

-Add practice time (only for the players in the pool) before the pool starts, so that players have a reason to be there early, most people don’t want to play their first match cold, so they will probably be there. The lines will be shorter than byoc and they can scout the comp if they want. As the semis start for the current game, the pools are converted to the next game so practice can start.

  • Once all this is in place, you can finally introduce the instant DQ. Not in the pool area at match time, DQ, end of discussion. If you have a reserved area with private practice time and still can’t at least show up before the tournament, you obviously don’t want to play.

  • Since you can’t leave the area, you can’t chase down your stick, so everyone will have to get their own.

  • Everyone in BYOC can do what they want, but if players are playing there instead of in the tournament, they just get DQ’ed for not reporting to the pool. BYOC doesn’t have to be cancelled, players just have to now pick what they are really going to play and not just register for the hell of it.

-Emergency registration puts you in losers bracket: I think this is a serious enough penalty to get everyone to register online, while at least giving people with true emergencies a way in. If the pools still have 4 spots, they at least have a shot to qualify.

Im not sure i would put the entire bracket up, but at least put who’s in each bracket, so that people can vote on which bracket to put on the stream / big screen.

#13

Yeah, no. Not all of us have that kind of time. Some of us do work for a living.

#14

I originally started posting here, but it got too big, so I moved it to it’s own post. Head on over and check it out. Great feedback everyone.

Read the Evolution X post!

  • trag
#15

I really hope the BYOC casuals and side tournies don’t go away. The casuals are a lot of fun and help get you into the swing of things. I’m mixed about incorporating the side tournies. On the one hand, if it was a “real” tourney, it might get more people to play the SNK games or A2 or whatever. On the other hand, I could easily see only a couple side tourneys being chosen and having some group (Maybe the SNK crowd) just be ignored. That’d kinda suck.

Here’s a crazy idea I just had for making it easier to get people to be at their games on time. You know those buzzers that you get when you go to a restaurant and they have a wait? Get some of those and then have them buzz you when the match before yours is starting. That should give you about 5 minutes to finish taking a leak, watching your friend play his match, etc and get over to your station. I suppose this could be problematic if people take off with the buzzers. But honestly, I doubt that’d happen too much.

Another thought I had was to get some of those stock market style LCD text screens and place them above each station. This could be used to let you know what is being played, who’s up, who’s up next, etc. It’d also be great if BYOC people could use this to announce their side tournies, etc. When I got to EVO on Saturday I was asking all over the place where the ST 3v3 was happening. Nobody seemed to know. And I don’t think it happened because most people had no idea about it :sad:

Anyway…just some random thoughts.

#16

That all sounds like gold to me! :tup:

#17

Just to be clear - I wasn’t suggesting removing the BYOC area because I play in that area a lot. I was suggesting that side tournaments - such as Team Marvel or even GG Singles be banned from the BYOC area.

Derek Daniels

#18

I think I’ll come in here.

Let me help you in making this clear. Arcade ST is dead. It’s not a game with a small scene or a weak scene. It is a completely dead game. 90% of srkers never ever played the original ST machine and 95% don’t give a damn about the oh so small hitbox changes from each version in comparison to the arcades. My statistics are probably wrong. They are too small.

I’ll bet good money that ST HD wil not be arcade perfcet. by now we already know this is impossible. Emulator are not arcade perfect, and none of the dozen versions ofd the game are arcade perfect. ST actually has more entries than CF because it looks a lot like HF, that everybody played, and because the scene has reborn in the last year due to CCC2. You better get ready to play the new and diferent ST HD at Evo, or to get all versions of ST taken out of the tournament. But ST as you knew it is dead, dead forever. Get used to it.

You may say that Japan has an arcade scene. Besides not being played at SBO, all japanese tournaments are single game singel elimination. They suck much more than Evo for 3rd Strike. They should be as dead as ST.

I am all for taking some games out. VF, DoA and other wild guesses have failed. Take them out. Even Smash has its own scene with very little relation to the SF community. Its like Halo. Popular and, except from the extra money and extra trouble, pointless. I am in favor of testing new games like ST HD, since you guys dream about keeping the fighting game scene alive with new games, but that’s it. I would even get rid of GG as an official tourney. The scene is so small and they don’t really care about winning for the most part anyways.

I don’t think banning the side tourneys is the best idea though. Side tourneys are way for all people to enjoy Evo. You can also take mre games out of the official list because people will throw side tourneys for them. You may limit it though.

And, about people not showing up on time, just disqualify them. Once you start disqualifying for real people will learn. There will be a lot of complains about it at evo2k8, but everybody will learn how to behave by the time evo2k9 comes out.

All IMO of course

#19

Since we’re gonna be “testing” new games, let’s get Arcana Heart FULL in there. It comes out October 11th and will be the newest thing in America and so far, people are showing interest.

Dunno how STHD gets to qualify as a new game and GG doesn’t. Oh right, because of Remix Mode. Because the hardcore ST crowd has no care in the world for that version. But, whatever…

#20

BYOC is an essential part of EVO, which is already lacking in organized spectator activity. Banning side tournaments is one thing, but the problem at Evo never seems to be lack of tv’s but rather lack of players being around when their name is called to use the tv’s already there.