My Complete Tier List:


#1

This list is currently “in progress” hence I am posting it here.

I need some help on some of the lower tiers, cause I really don’t have any awesome players around here playing low tier characters (infact, the people in my area…mostly suck…including me somewhat).

DO NOT worry about getting the tiers in order…let’s just get the people in what tier right!

I forgot who made out the original list…it was some guy on another tier thread I posted. I mixed it up a bit to what I thought was right.

Give me your OPINIONS PLEASE!

So without further adu, here it is:

This is the current but highly debated MvC2 Tier Listings.

This list assumes the best possible player in the world is playing each character.

You can certainly beat Sentinal with Felica, but a halfway decent Sentinal will probably beat the best Felica in the world.

Take note that people who have assists better than their current category are noted.

Tiers are not currently in order.

AAA = Anti-Air Assist

The GOD Tier:

Storm
Sentinal
Magneto
Cable

The Top Tier:

Strider WITH Doom
Cyclops (AAA is GOD Tier)
Iron Man
Spiral
Dr. Doom
Blackheart

The Second Tier:

Strider WITHOUT Doom
Dhalsim
Cammy (AAA is Top Tier)
Guile
Tron Bonne (Projectile Assist is Top Tier)
Rogue
Captain Commando (AAA is GOD Tier)
Mega-Man
Iceman
Ken
Juggernaut
Colossus
War Machine (AAA is Top Tier)
Metal Wolverine
Bone Wolverine
Psylocke (Assist is GOD Tier)
Servbots on Balance Assist WITH Doom

The Third Tier:

Anakaris
Jill Valentine
Ruby Heart
Gambit
Felicia
Silver Samurai
Captain America
Spider-Man
Omega Red
Hulk
Venom
SonSon
B.B. Hood

The Fourth Tier:

M. Bison
Morrigan
Chun-Li
Ryu
Akuma
Charlie
Sakura
Jin
Shuma-Gorath
Amingo
Hayato

The Crap Tier:
Marrow
Zangief
Sabertooth
Thanos
Servbots on Balance Assist WITHOUT Doom

The Joke Tier:

Roll
Dan
Servbots ON Projectile / AAA


#2

There’s several things you overlooked in your list, but I don’t have the energy to go over it right now, so I’ll just do some random notes.

  • Ken is not substantially better than the other shotos to be in 2nd tier while the other shotos are in 4th tier. Ken might be bottom 2nd tier or top 3rd tier because if the opponent can’t stop you with a beam, he can rape assists. That would place the other shotos in 3rd tier IMO. If you want to rank shotos, it’s Ken, Sakura, Akuma and Ryu in order. But they are too close together to split that far apart, and each has something the other lacks.

  • Marrow is way too low. She has good rushdown pressure ending in bonerang which gives her too much frame advantage. If she has meter she can punish assists on sight no matter where she is on the screen. She has excellent priority on her normals and the fastest sweep in the game. IMO she is the second best standard style pixie in the game (next to Cammy).

  • Chun-Li is too high. She has nice rushdown and all, but when every hit is likely to get you 5% damage it’s not really worth it in the end. Also Dhalsim, Guile and Captain America are likely too high, and Silver Samurai is too low (you can’t call assists on a loaded Samurai which means if he has the lead and your rushdown is less than amazing, he can crouch block all day and win).


#3

IMO, Morrigan and Jin deserve a promotion… Morrigan can get good rushdown with her weird air-dash, while Jin’s assist alone is justification for raising him a tier. Not to mention that he actually has good damage combos, a good cross-up a/c, and attack angles + priority that rock.

But his AAA is the best justification. :wink:

But I can only make a case for Jin. Morrigan, however, should be a little higher IMO, having played her, seen her in vids, and listened to the SRK people long enough.

Sonson might make it higher… but not mine… mine dies to Sentinel, even if she can randomly rape good Magnetos. :frowning:

Tron Jon


#4

shuma and sak are better than spidey and hulk

marrow is wayyy too low

akuma is better than ryu

charlie ***s guile for free… moonsault slash is rushdown… guile can’t rushdown. sonic hurricane doesn’t cut it just to say that guile is that much better than charlie

sentinel is higher than storm, IMHFO… fastest fly, rushdown, highest defense, 8 hit combos that do 80% life, super armor, semi infinites, unblockable, ***ership. storm has rushdown, runaway, chip damage, hailstorm, and LA


#5

Alot of what I’m about to say has already been covered, but:
Marrow needs to move up significantly. She’s Third Tier for sure. She can punish assists really well, and the wierd properties of her Bonerangs can trip people up a lot, and helps her fight Spiral (Marrow isn’t a Spiral counter, but she fairs well against Spiral thanks to her Bonerangs amongst other things).

M. Bison, Morrigan, and Sakura need to move up one tier. They all have abusable strats and tacs that allow them to at least beat everyone else in your Fourth Tier. Morrigan has a good rushdown, enhanced by her strange air dash. Sakura also has a good rushdown and one of the few good dash assists, plus when she turns Dark, she can really put the hurt on and gains that no-lag teleport. M. Bison has a lot of safe chipping patterns from what I hear, and some good comboes.

Ken and the other two shotos are too spaced apart. IMO, Ken should stay Second and Ryu and Akuma should move up one. At the very least, Ken should drop one. As Dasrik said, Ken isn’t that much better than the other shotos. I think he should stay Second Tier though, thanks to some good assist punishing abilities and the instant statup on Sho-Reppa-Ken, plus the good Anti-Air.

Felicia, Silver Samurai, Omega Red, the Hulk, Venom, and SonSon are all Second Tier. SonSon has some crazy cross-up options and some good comboes, including being able to combo her staff super at the end of her anti-air move for some good damage. Her anti-air is a good assist, too. Venom can hang with all the other Second Tier mainly because of his Venom Fang. The move has no punishable lag and good start-up, and can really be abused when you learn to use it right. The Hulk has a safe Gamma Charge and some simple but high-damage comboes, plus his dash-j.sk is crazy good. Silver Samurai is most definitely high Second Tier. He can’t be thrown while crouching. His Shurikens do good damage and good chip, as does his Triple Shuriken super. Ramaiken is really good at punishing assists, and he can combo from his Ice super into Ramaiken for great damage on the point character. His normals have great priority. Finally, in his ice form, he gains better-than-Sent defense. Omega Red is an unusual character. To be honest, I know little about playing him. But I do know he’s a good battery character, he gives StriDoom a good fight, and Omega Strike is relatively abusable. Felicia, on the other hand, is my pet character. She outright counters StriDoom, as long as she has an AA or Sent behind her. She’s a great battery. Ground chain -> Sand Splash is highly abusable against most characters. She can punish assists with Hyper Sand Splash, as long as her point opponent doesn’t have a really good dash (Mags, Cammy, the Wolvies, etc. are unsafe, as is Cable thanks to that damned pistol shot). Hyper Sand Splash has stupidly quick start-up. Felicia can even hit Mags off of a blocked c.sk with it. Her fp throw builds 3/4 of a meter. Her s.rk has abusable priority.

I also feel like Hayato should be Bottom Tier. He has no projectile/beam moves, meaning he has to play rushdown. But he has poor speed, a mediocre dash, and no air dash, double jump, triple jump, wall jump, or teleport. Basically, he’s a rushdown character with poor mobility and nothing to help him get in. I’ll grant that he has good comboes, but his odds of landing a hit are slim compared with similar character, and he has nothing to fall back on if he can’t land a hit.

No. Guile is higher than Charlie. Guile’s ability to throw air Flash Kicks gives him a ghetto double jump, and he can even take on Storm with that (see Zaza). Guile also has a good rushdown pattern with ground chain+cover assist -> fp Sonic Boom, cover assist hits, repeat. And Sonic Hurricane is better than Crossfire Blitz, plain and simple.


#6

There is a thread about this… But anyways

Really Strider is fine without doom. I really dont even understand why people only think he is good with doom. Yes he does more dmg with doom however, strider by himself is extremely effective. He is just stronger with doom.

I really think you should take out GOD tier… I think thats over doing it a bit.

My other opinions.

Omega red should get a huge boost. People like yourself overlook him and think hes a piece of crap…

Jin is strong no questions he needs a boost.

The people are the crap tier should be looked over again. I really think they could be played well. And people like dasrik tap into their powers and really show what they could do. Even Jwong plays marrow and owns Team Scrubs…

Silver Sam and Gambit also need to be looked at. For one silver sam is an assist killer no questions about that. His ability to add damage with fire for only 1 bar is great and is overlooked. Gambit is also very strong because his assist(proj) and he can take on sentinel any day with trick card and cajun explosion. Royal flush is very nice because you can hit them while on the ground. Which is great from gambit card xx royal flush.

I feel that if Iron Man is top tier on your list why isnt War Machine. He is just as good. Also I think Iron Man has better AAA assist then War Machine and that WM AAA shouldnt be considered Godly.

Psylock is questionable. I feel that she should be lowered even though she can be played its best to put her lower.

Sakura, Akuma and Charlie and Morrigan should also be looked at. I think that they could be easily 3rd tier on the list. Ryu should stay at 4th because he isnt as strong as ken and akuma as someone said.

Colossus should be lower. His assist is deadly because he owns people like capcom easily. But I feel that he isnt that good to be tier 2.

And servbot with doom tier 2…? Look that over.

Juggernaught should be tier 3 along with colossus. Too slow and very open. He can kill assist but aside from that hes not as good as hulk.

Tron Bonne Top Tier Assist only? WHAT THE? Its better then that…

(EDIT)
After reading and thinking a bit I came to the conclusion that there really shouldnt be a tier list. Yes, maybe it helps but at the same time its just there. Cable can be owned by a guile or marrow or anyone. Every character can be played well and can hang with anyone on “Top Tier” or your “God Tier”. People like VDO, Dasrik, and Joe Zaza show that to us.


#7

You probably dont really undestand tiers then. Basically, they’re just saying which has the most tools and the highest PROBABILITY of winning in a given match-up. Of course, the win-lose ratios will change on the character skills, so tiers are assumed to be played by people with similar skill. A person in Tier 1 will beat tier 2 more often than not, beat tier 3 quite a bit more on average, and totally rape crap tier almost always. But ALMOST is the key word.

I also feel ruby heart could potentially be moved up. Omega Red definitely needs to be moved up. Guile and Dhalsim are fine in my opinion though.


#8

No lol I understand Tiers. I’ve been playing fighting games for a very very long time. Just the fact of having them just bugs me. Everyone has the same win ratio and it really comes down to the player.

Yes Ruby heart is strong, just because shes a pirate? Uhh heh.


#9

:slight_smile:


#10

I dont mean to insult you, but not everyone has the same win ratio. Characters WILL determine, especially in a game like this, the amount of times a person wins. If the person is playing equally skilled people, and they’re using… say Wolverine/Bonerine/Gambit, they’ll have a smaller chance of winning than a person playing Magneto/Storm/Psylocke, because their characters simply have more options.

Anyhow, you may grasp it, and I just may be misunderstanding you, and I apologize if I insulted you, but regardless…

Ruby Heart is a pretty good character(I like ninjas better anyway). She has decent air manuverability with Schwartzelle, can fill the screen with a LOT of shit, has an instant start up super, can do huge damage with her ghost super in DHCs, has good lockdown and chip with doom, and is a good battery.


#11

Strider isn’t just stronger with Doom, he’s significantly stronger with Doom. Strider is still good without Doom, but a much larger portion of Top Tier can beat Strider if he looses Doom.

Colossus with Hyper Armor becomes deadly. Armored Colossus can even take on a decent chunk of Top Tier. He just becomes a meter black hole, too. His shoulder tackle move is really good as well.

That’s Servbots on Balance assist with Doom. With Doom at their back, Servbots on balance can safely force opponents to block Servbot Swarm. The swarm does massive amounts of chip damage. Also, Servbot’s small size makes them harder to hit and combo. Servbots on balance w/ Doom also counters Sent.

The main thing about Juggy is his Headcrush. First of all, it has instant start-up. Secondly, glitched and fully mashed, it does 80% damage to a normal defense character. Cable so much as flinches against Juggy, and he looses 80% life at the cost of one meter. Juggy also has some abusable invulnerability frames. He can use the one-frame invulnerability on Juggy Punch, then cancel to Headcrush and let his Super Armor eat the next hit to slam his way out of traps and such. Also, calling Sent and then Headcrushing is safe 90% of the time.


#12

Quit hatin’ on Hayato. Yes, I believe Hayato is low tier for a reason. But you’re wrong in your assessment.

First… you are wrong about Hayato’s dash. It certainly is not the beastly dash of Magneto, Cammy, or Servbot. But it is distance, not speed, that limits it. Wavedashed, it is fast. Additionally, his dash-jump increases the distance of his dash, and if you combine that with his j.hk, he has full screen reach off of it.

His aerial mobility does really hurt him. If he had an air-dash, he would be easy to rank him higher… but he doesn’t. Finally, the biggest problem he ends up with is that he does not have a good AA move. There is no substitute for a good AA. Low tier, and for a reason.

On the other hand…

His moves are not lacking in speed. His jump-ins are long enough range that he can often use them without fear of retaliation, and continue immediately into low hits, and plasma combos. Does this work against those used to Magneto style rushdown? Depends on what they’re trying to do at the time. If he can get a ‘single, solid hit’ in, he can deal half damage easily, provided you have decent execution. With DHCs, that can be increased. His air combo has good damage (for an air combo) as well, if you time it so all 6 hits connect consistently. His launch and trip have great range if not great speed… His Plasma strings are powerful as well, if you can manage to find somewhere to fit them in.

Finally, he has the ability to punish assists, so long as he has a safe DHC waiting in the wings, and can manage to get the opponent in blockstun (or hitstun :)). Doing half damage damage solo to an assist while the point is helpless, or better, caught, isn’t something to laugh at. (With the DHC, it’s much safer, and more damaging.)


By your standards, which is, equivalently skilled players using different characters, Hayato would rank low 3rd tier, at worst. Everyone he gets beasted by is in 2nd or better, and everyone he trades with in the 4th tier of this list, people are arguing to promote.


#13

Ya you are misunderstanding me. Its ok though.

Anyways

I knew about Juggs but even with head crush.

Ya Colossus is a beast but run away or force him to block some way will waste it. I’ll play with him more and experiment. I’ll probably see some things that are good in him.

Hayato is good… Even though some moves leaves him open hes really strong. Plus its really nice to bring out his special “Raging Demon” really flashy and shows n00bs up.

Strider meh… even though he gets a big boost with doom I really think he can beat top tiers on his own. Orbs especially helps. I will also try this vs top tiers.


#14

I said “mediocre”. Mediocre means average. An average speed dash on a rushdown character spells trouble. Also, that dash-j.hk is telegraphed a mile away and is easily countered with a well-timed AA.

But if he whiffs them, they’re quite laggy and easy to counter punish.

Under your circumstances (a safe DHC waiting and gets the point opponent in blockstun), every character can punish assists.


#15

I think tron jon and everyone knows what that means. :lol:


#16

Most characters in the game function primarily as rushdown. Yes, Hayato cannot play keepaway… but most characters do not excel at keepaway, and do so only to break the pattern of their rushdown, or their opponent’s. An average speed dash on any character can spell trouble.

Second, mediocre refers to below average or barely average. His dash is certainly not exceptional, but by taking the time to call it mediocre, you are taking exceptional note. It is neither poor nor great, but wavedashed, it is fast.

It seems to be lost on a lot of people that you may have to dash more than once, jump more than once, and block at the end in order to catch another character. Why do you count it as so essential that you never have to block on approach?

OK… so you telegraph the dash-jump, block the AA instead of hitting, and either call your own, or land and hit it with a combo. While you telegraph the move a mile away, you don’t actually commit to it until the last 5 feet. Even when he cannot follow up, he has lessened the distance his next attempt will have to cover.

First, there is no reason he should whiff them. Whiffing moves is, in general, not a good idea. Almost all launchers and sweeps in the game are punishable if whiffed. This is mitigated only by the fact that many characters can follow with lag-less specials. And that only shrinks the window of opportunity… it does not close it.

Second, he should be using them at their range extremes, except against people who have instant screen / ground covering supers… at which point, he should stick to less dangerous moves, or only use them to counter. The launcher is safe against most falling opponents, because the way it travels means that the higher the opponent is when he hits, the less recovery he has to deal with… and most characters do not have instantaneous, straight down, range heavy moves to counter with.

The sweep’s biggest weakness is startup, not its lag… and the fact that it is rollable.

I’ll concede that, but point out that it is ridiculously easier to accomplish this scenario with Hayato than with most other characters.

Gotta go. :slight_smile:

Tron Jon


#17

But most every other character has something that they can fall back on if the rushdown isn’t working/won’t work. Hayato really doesn’t.

Okay, I just looked up “mediocre” in the dictionary. It said “usually used disparagingly”. I’m sorry. I thought mediocre merely meant average. I didn’t mean to insult.

I meant that the opponent is now ready for the j.rk, will be expecting it, and can wait on the AA call until Hayato actually starts the j.rk. Even if the opponent does call the AA early and Hayato does a counter-call or follows with a combo, there are other things the opponent could do to counter that too.

The plain and simple fact is that Hayato has far less options in this game than any other character (except the joke tier characters). He’s 100% limited to rushdown, yet doesn’t have the speed or mobility that a character like that needs. His range and priority on his normals are good, but his moves lag badly. He can’t punish assists if he has less than two meters. He’s without a doubt a sub-par character. Look at the (IMHO) remaining Fourth Tier and then Crap Tier.
Fourth Tier:
Charlie, Jin, Amingo, Chun-Li, Shum-Gorath, possibly Morrigan and Sakura.
Crap Tier:
Thanos, Sabertooth, Zangief
In Fourth Tier, Morrigan, Sakura, Amingo, Charlie, and Chun-Li all have better/more reliable rushdown patterns. Shuma-Gorath also has decent rushdown abilities which, at the worst, break even with Hayato, and at least it has the unblockable DHC to fall back on. Jin doesn’t have good rushdown, but his moves have higher priority and do better damage, plus he has the unblockable Blodia Punch and the easy cross-up Blodia Vulcan to fall back on. At worst, he trades with Hayato, too.
In Crap Tier, Zangief beats Hayato through simple abuse of Super Armor. Hayato beats Thanos because simple jump back blocking owns Thanos. I’m not knowledgable enough on Sabertooth to make a comment.
Hayato belong in Crap Tier. I’m sorry, but it’s the truth.


#18

You wanted opinions.
OK 2nd tier -

(I think the 5 below - in no order - would make up high 2nd depending on where you put BH and WM)

Megaman
Dhalsim
Rogue
Omega Red - 2nd tier without a doubt
Ruby Heart

Silver Samurai would fit into 2nd tier - needs lots of meter though and lacks mobility
Guile maybe,
Cammy

Bonerine might fit in too. Wolverine - no - I don’t see much to make him in the same tier.


#19

No gambit? Why do people diss gambit… And silver sam can handle his own. He does shit load of chip because of his darts. Plus 1 bar can get him flame sword which increases dmg a shit load… Plus he gains bar while in this like strider orbs. He cant chain the lighting so only 1 or 2 bars is fine.


#20

Sakura should rank higher… though she lacks some speed her B&B combos deal exelent damage , has an non flying screen causing infinite (very easy by the way) a corner combo that drains health like a bitch an anti tri-jump super i’ll say enough to make her bottom 2nd tier. just my opinion though