Yeah please, do this is a great KEN thread. I am open to spread the Ken love.
I know you asked Golden Gunman but I figured I’d give my 2 cents.
If you’re opp. throws a fireball, juice kick over it (use RH juice kick), connect with c.Strong xx Shoryu-Reppa. This is pretty easy to connect; even if they block the juice kick you can push them back with c.strong, c.foward, c.RH, hadouken. Of course you wouldn’t want to use this on characters with a fast recovery. I really like to use this against Sagat (O.Sagat has fast recovery so I don’t use it against him).
Remember to only use the juice kick sparingly, unless you’re certain you have near perfect execution (comes out 19/20 times).
I’ve changed up my overall game plan once again in order to master Ken in a different way. Instead of basing my game around mix-ups, knee bash, and rush down tactics. I’m learning how to play defensively with Ken (in casual matches, not strictly playing to win); this has actually helped my offense because it allows me to see opportunities for attack that I had not previously seen i.e. I was too busy contemplating what the other player’s options were before; and now I wait and see. Thought that might broaden some horizons.
why do a lot of people prefer O. Ken?
Better DP (more invincible frames
Better Fireballs (beter speeds, faster recovery)
No crazy kicks. (no “oops” shit I did not mean to do that…)
He plays more into the traditional fire ball trap game the N.ken…
I would not say he better (maybe a little worse) then N.Ken…But really, just different.
Do the Super Turbo versions of the dragon bros even have invincibility frames on their dragons?
I was under the impression that their dragons were just really high priority. (like Sagats TU)
Both Ken and Ryu have invincibility frames on their jab DPs, hence why you see so many people using their jab DPs to let fireballs pass right through them.
Is it confirmed anywhere they are invincible on their DP’s? I ask because I know they can be kicked out of those DP’s during the same points at which they can also pass through FB’s.
While i’m not 100% about this but I think the information is confirmed in the YBH or on T.Akiba’s page. If anyone who knows this stuff better then me can correct this then please do.
Maybe invincibility frames on new characters work different?
For example if you put O Ken DP against new Ken DP O Ken wins clean, (no riding out period) as if N Ken had no invincibility. That leads me to believe N Ken doesn’t actually have invincibility. (or perhaps he has a small amount of start up invincibility but after start up the move is just really high priority?)
Y.B.H. pgs. 8, and 14 Ryu has 8 frames of invincibility for Jab DP, as does Ken. These frames are complete invincibility frames i.e. nothing can hurt you. There’s an additional 10 frames of invincibility but some moves will still hurt you (hit boxes). O. Ken might have more invincibility frames than N. Ken causing what you described.
Hope this Helps.
That makes sense. A DP doesn’t hit for 6 frames correct? So essentially new DP’s are invincible for the startup where the old DP’s where invincible for the entirety of the ascent.
Multi hit Throw LIMIT
I haven’t found any data containing the precise number of Consecutive hits in a mult-hit throw for each character. Here’s what I’ve done:
N. Ken Knee Bash 12 hits avg. of 10 hits each time.
Gief Stomach Crunch 9 hits; face crush 11 hits
Blanka face bite 12 hits
Boxer Headbutt 10 hits
That’s all I’ve tried and I’m wondering if a limit exists. This was tried on AE on dummy (opp. for each was Guile).
The timing for the throws is the same for all characters. The most effective way is to focus on tapping back, foward as quickly as possible and focus on pressing short, foward, RH in that order as fast as possible. I found this technique works for me. I didn’t find the answer to this question anywhere including the YBH (although I can’t be 100% sure b/c I cannot read Japanese). I’ve even held the CPU in holds for up to 9-12 hits. It’s easy once you get the timing down.
I also understand that a Human Opp. will try and counter; it doesn’t have much of an effect unless they also know the proper timing.
If anyone knows the exact limits please post for each character.
You mean counter mash the throw?? I just wiggle left to right and piano hk,hp,mp,lp,lk or hp,mp,lp depending on how my hand is positioned when i’m in a multi hit throw and i usually shake out in 2-3 hits.
Hey, I’m just getting into ST, playing N.Ken because Knee Bash is awesome.
I’m having trouble doing his hit confirm (shortshortsuper) I know the command, there was even one day when I had it down, but now I can’t do it…I dunno, I just do short short nothing. What’s the timing for cancelling into the super?
Oh and about the Knee Bash…I was watching Mattsun, and after a knee bash, he seems to always do jumping short. I know that that’s a good tick into knee bash, so my questions…
What’s a better tick, jumping short, walkup kneebash, or jumping short, crouching short, walkup kneebash?
What else can you do with a jumping short?
And finally, how easy is it to get out of kneebash ticks? Do you need to do reversal DP/counter throw or is it easier than that?
Thanks in advance.
For the super link question, are you whiffing jab?
I never really use jumping short, I use jumping jab so you gotta ask others about that.
I think it is all DP/CT but someone has to back me up on it. Im not a 100%
Reversal move / throw is the only way to get out of any good tick throw setup in ST period. That’s why Knee Bash is so good, it’s often quite possible to win the round after landing one knee bash if you can mix-up well enough after it.
Although you could always counter the tick as opposed to the throw if you think it’s coming.
How about N Ken’s air hurricane kicks? There’s one version of the air hurricane kick that has a really short arc and is great for getting next to your opponent in a hurry. Is there any trick to getting the short arc air hurricane kick out?
I believe that’s called the juice kick and I’m not sure what the trick is.
Basically if you’ve ever played CvS2 then you should know what a short jump is. You can perform a tatsumaki kick while doing a short jump (there is no short jump in ST, however the timing is the same i.e. you can do a juice kick in CvS2), it’s very fast and difficult to do at first. It’s really easy once you get the motion down. All you need to remember is to never let your thumb (center of your thumb) leave neutral on the D-pad. As for using a J-stick it’s much easier, you just need to get the motion down. Do NOT practice doing the 225 degree motion in reverse (example Fei Long’s windmill kick or Sagat’s Tiger Knee), it’s faster to just tap up+towards and then QCB; this will also improve you’re accuracy.
I love that version of the AHK. I try to use his overhead for mix-ups after hisknee throw,j.jab ->AHK, or during a combo. I havent played much competitive ST yet. Is this an effective method, or is it easily countered?