Hey I’m willing to make a Necro tutorial vid. Anyone would be interested in this idea? Also if I do it, make suggestions of what you’d like to see in there? Thanks.
If you do it, please put in chara-specific stun juggles (the most damaging of course). Cheers!
corner juggles after jab hook, throw, SAIII, command grab, b.fierce, etc. Useful stuff.
Corner mix-ups. Necro’s links/hit-confirms.
I’d like to see a video that visually demonstrating Necro’s playstyle, what he needs to do to win, how other’s own him (so that potential Necro players can know what to look out for/what not to do), move analysis, BnB’s, and a cool cinematic direction.
Heck, a small series of videos would be GREAT, FBA’s addition of CPS3 support has gotten me back into SF3 (GGPO + A2 has been an obbsession), and I was looking hard at Necro for a project. (Fell in love with A2 Sim, and the stretchy maddness, and I want more of the same elongated pain…)
Necro and sim share a couple of similar long range attacks, but besides that…their playstyles don’t really have much in common. Necro CAN annoy at long range, but with no fireball/reason or way to make the opponent jump his long range pokes become less useful. At certain matchups he has an excellent midrange presence, and is what he really should be known for. His objective against nearly everyone is to corner the opponent, he has possibly the scariest corner game in the right hands. Really underrated(misunderstood?) character.
Hes got the drills too! Super fun happy time! instead of fire… electricity! Can catch you in an annoying throw if your not aware! Has strange physical coloring! Has a petite woman who cheers him on!
Necro, the uber Sim!
I’ve started to pick up Necro. So I would appreciate it a lot if you could add stuff like general strategy,throw setups,Bnbs,resets,mixup tips and corner juggles. That would help me a lot!
Necro is a character with serious comeback potential. High stun and a solid corner game mean he can pull off a lot of last minute victories. His long-range pokes tend to be under-utilized as well. c. MK, for example, is very annoying when used properly because it forces them to block at a range where they’d normally be safe.
That being said, he’s got nothing on wake-up, so you better be good at reading high/low, or you might get knocked down and never get back up.
The main thing with Necro is not to be predictable. I know that applies for every character, but Necro’s specials tend to be difficult to punish, and they all sort of flow together in a way that makes it easy to move from one to another, so people often fall into the habit of just trying to blitz the hell out of their opponent. That works fine up to a point, but it makes you parry bait for better players. Use restraint. He has one of the easiest hit confirms in the game with b. MP, so you don’t always need to be flailing about.
My advice for the video is to be careful with your music selection. I know everybody wants to go with their own personal tastes, but try to find sometihng that won’t turn your audience off. A lot of people will just close the window if the first thing they hear is death metal blaring or something. Keep the framerate consistent, don’t compress the sound to the point that it’s painful and consider adding captions ala SlimX/Thongboy’s videos. They do a lot to help explain what you’re trying to show, and they give you an opportunity to entertain the viewers with your sharp wit and keen sense of humor.
More Necro Tutorials on YT are ALWAYS welcome. The main one online isn’t very long or particularly useful. It also focuses almost exclusively on SAIII, which seems rather limited to me in its applications (I DO realize that it’s generally considered his best overall super so I’m trying to use it more to intimidate other players).
Edit: WORST MATCH-UPS and how to deal with them (the twins, Chun, Makoto, etc.).
Corner mix-ups, juggle opportunities, combos, etc. are useful, but mostly I’m interested in learning more about pushing opponents into the corner or keeping them within Necro’s ranges that are best for him, while simultaneously not being too predictable: that seems to be my BIGGEST problem with him since he has many attacks with slow start-up. I tend to get knocked out of a lot of his pokes because they almost all get beat easily or trade at best (but seldom in his favor).
Pino is REALLY good at being unpredictable w/ drill kicks, for instance, as he jumps over opponents (not just opponents knocked down after super/Snake Fang command grab thingie) and just generally confusing players with good runaway and seemingly-random aggressive pursuit tactics when he suddenly needs to change his playing style, mid-match.
If there are dif ways to play Necro (besides which super’s selected), I’d like to try all ways and maybe blend them together so my opponents don’t even know what kind of player they’re facing (e.g.: controlling the distance between self and opponent, pushing them back or cornering them).
I hope this makes sense! I’m still rotating between him, Alex and Dudley for the time being to try to give the superior opponents my best offer for a challenge, while I’m learning.
What you using to record? FBA Shuffle has a neat AVI record feature and if you’re doing a tricky combo, you can keep on reloading state over and over if you mess up. It doesn’t slow don’t like Mame the more you load state! Its really handy, if your not using a Capture card, I suggest this! :woot:
Hey Blaq that’s awesome that you’re making a tutorial. My only advice…make sure you tell the viewer what buttons you’re pushing. Some people don’t. >_>
I cant emphasize this enough. Its rather annoying to see an awesome combo & have to find the actual input somewhere else.
hm okay I’m gonna write all my potential notes in the video here. They’ll be scatterbrained, just whatever I think up as I get it. Thanks a lot Ramza for the AVI idea with FBA so at least now I can start working on it. I just need to know how to implement button showing and/or text, and I’m set.
It’s really important to practice half circles a LOT while/before playing necro. This is crucial. Most of necro’s most important combos have to be canceled from a really fast move (ie: b. lk, c. lk) straight into a half circle. You only get a split second to hit confirm it too (just as fast as makoto’s c. lk x lp hayate confirms) so if you can do the half circles quickly, at the very least you’ll have an easier time confirming the hit.
BNB: c. lk xx lp tornado hook , b. lk xx lp tornado hook, b. mk xx lp tornado hook, b. mk xx ex tornado hook,
any cancelable move into snake fang,
any cancelable move into ex flying viper,
b. lk -> b. mk -> snake fang,
b. lk -> b. mk -> ex viper,
b. lk -> b. mk -> any rising cobra,
b. lk -> c. lk -> snake fang
Corner Combos/Pressure Section
Necro has an interesting property that many other characters do NOT. He has multiple moves that can be juggleable while the enemy is in the corner for extra damage. It’s these very same moves that make Necro extremely dangerous and scary when you have them in the corner.
The moves that are juggleable in the corner are:
lp tornado hook
The most important and usually safest move out of this list(and also one of the scariest when used right) is the lp tornado hook. lp tornado hook can be comboed from his fastest normals and can always be juggled afterwards. Every character in the game can be hit with at least 1 db + hp after one of these hits. Hugo/alex can be hit with 3 afterwards to b. mk. Mak/remy/Q can be hit with 1 -> b. mp. Urien -> s. mp. Dudley, necro, shotos, oro,12 -> jab. (Special thanks to Coreografo for these combos and notes). Each of the moves afterwards shown are essentially resets and can be utilized to further pressure the enemy. Most often after a reset, you walk forward and do some more mixups to destroy your enemy. However, if you dont proceed with caution that same attempt can be used against you. More of this will be discussed in the next section.
Corner Pressure relating to distancing and timing.
You basically want to get them in the corner above all else and keep them there. This corner pressure and ideal is what you can use very aggressively to win matches. However Necro has very limited priority, so you want to utilize mindgames and pressure more to force your opponent to make mistakes (especially when they’re in the corner), and then take advantages of those mistakes and take the match with ease. To do this you have to learn and understand the Necro sweet spot and his various timings. Necro sweet spot is a space that’s roughly a bit closer than a c. mk from Ken, but farther than a throw. This sweet spot is your most deadly tool in the art of pressuring and hopefully destroying your opponent. For example, after one of the aforementioned combos on Ken (ie: lp tornado hook -> db hp -> s. lp) you reset him with the s. lp and can walk up to him during his air recovery. If you walk up to him too close, he can throw you, srk you, or c. mk you. All of these things aren’t too good to have happen. They knock you down and allow ken his chance to get out of the corner, so you can’t let that happen. Instead after a reset, block low in the sweet spot. Any srk he throws will whiff (yes even ex srk), c. mk will hit but do nothing to you ( you can also parry forward afterwards in case he cancels into something to push you out) and throw will whiff and you can counter him with a full corner combo for free. This distance is also very crucial to know, understand and play around with. You can also back up past the sweet spot and stop any potential jumps(c. mp/ b. hp), punish any forward dashes with b. mp xx sa, b. lk -> s. mp xx sa, etc. and then they’re back in the corner just for trying to get out.
edit: After looking over my notes, I’m not really sure if I can really describe necro in just 1 video. Maybe I should make a couple. Like one for combos, one for resets, poke strings, etc. Necros a lot more in depth than most people realize, and it’ll be hard to put it all out in one go. Also, how much information do you guys think is too much information to put in a video? I didn’t have a Necro tutorial video when I started just a bunch of Sugiyama/Pino ab7 videos, and I dont wanan cripple potential/current players by telling too much without them learning him. If that makes any sense.
No problem BlaQ. Happy to help! Can’t wait for it
Based on my own experiences, strategy is my toughest problem for Necro, in terms of regaining the momentum, if there is such a thing. I feel forced to turtle a lot with him, getting knocked down seems worse for him than most, and due to his low priority–as you mentioned–I often get stuffed with nearly every move with which I poke or whiff. As a result, it seems almost mandatory to know how to deal with certain normals from higher-tier characters that beat his own normals. If he HAS any normals (in the air or on the ground) that DON’T get beaten too much in certain situations, that’d help too. It seems SOOO important to know when to attack and when simply to zone and bait w/o attacking to trigger a missed reversal (dashing or walking backwards or forward slightly, or using his drill kick for defensive/evasive purposes, e.g.).
Choice of super alone seems to affect Necro’s strategy a lot–resets/juggles/AA vs. stunning someone and other factors.
I’m not too worried about combos cos after a while you start figuring out the follow-up potential of his jugglable normals and their set-ups, but more info on damage scaling for his combos would help in making decisions on how to use meter (threat of having it for more options vs. max-damage capitalization on the opponent’s mistakes, although trying to decide which course of action is more intimidating at the time is probably just intuitive and cannot truly be taught).
Feedback on this guys?
I don’t mind, im just looking forward to it
I think you’re making perfect sense and I’m sure we all appreciate your concern for not overwhelming new and continuing players
I JUST had a thought: if this idea of my own makes any sense, maybe if Sugiyama or Pino does anything really well, you could use clips of their matches in your own video to illustrate good tactics such as positioning or zoning.
Most videos seem to have a sentence at most, per set-up, and a few show arrows and/or input commands, using pictures of the stick and 6-button layout at the top of the screen, and then show a video that follows the pictures. I think that helps sometimes but otherwise, you could just write a line or 2 to describe the steps/timing for setting up a combo or something else.
I’m afraid a friend already NOTICED the Necro sweetspot but I didn’t realize it and I need to RETHINK how to play this game in general. This idea of yours sounds VERY helpful and intriguing. I already know zoning is important for ANY character, of course lol, but if you can pin down his ideal range against opponents in general, that sounds like the MOST important strategem of all!
Well, I’ll wait to hear back before I continue my blab routine.