Need Help With Ryu Match-Ups zero/vergil

ryu

#1

team is ryu (point,tatsu) deadpool (assist, katana-rama) hawkeye (anchor, triple arrow)

i can challenge zero with mid air hadokens, and super jump hadokens to stop zero’s momentum, but inevitably zero will get in, and the only way i’ve been able to tag a hit on zero is if i do some godlike blocking while he’s in and hoping him to whiff for a punish. is there any way to force zero in the corner and take control?

also i’m having a hard time against online vergils, just in general, and need advice on the match-up


#2

A few things come to mind, but mainly it’ll require you to go into training mode to figure out, recreate, and design a counter strategy to common Zero tricks. Generally Ryu is better off moving on the offensive and forcing Zero to defend against pressure as opposed to keeping him out. Luckily, Ryu just needs one good hit before he can stack on enough damage to make zero bleed or die:

  • Be very good with Shoryuken timing. Use as a basic punish if a Zero throws out an unsafe move (i.e., his j.H right above you).
  • Zero isn’t too good at dealing with rush down, so use deadpool/hawkeye assists to keep him limited in movement options.and to force mixups.
  • Use projectiles more as a way to get free chip damage before you move in for the kill. If you get a free hit, convert to Shinku Hadoken for quick damage, or continue pressure.
  • Against a Zero that likes to use lightning/teleports, if you’re able to read and time it right, throws are great counters to this.
  • Since you have Triple Arrow assist, that works great in forcing Zero off the projectile war. Use this as a way to counter Zero’s zoning and to make him take to the air (Where if he does something foolish, you can nail him with a Shinku Hadoken/hado srk/srk).

Ryu is fairly straightforward in comparison to Zero. However, with proper assist usage to help Ryu to get in, it should help to even things up. Wish I could help out more on this (I tend to run frank/cap on point instead of ryu, so half the time zero is either bleeding/dead by the time ryu pops out as a mid/anchor character with meter to burn).


#3

for zero and vergil i think you have to be patient since their normals are better.

Against Vergil i just throw hadoukens and triple arrows zoning them out. While i’m doing that i’m scouting out the teleport for a possible punish.

For zero try to keep them on the ground and with hawkeye and apply pressure


#4

You cant throw Hadoukens at Vergil… His normals eat projectiles…


#5

Ack, forgot to add in tips against Vergil:

  • Either stay at close range or stay at far range. As Vergil’s normals reach quite far, you can’t stay at mid range unless you want to risk a normal hitting you. Stay in as close as possible so you’re within range to throw out attacks and throws. Stay at far range to zone from (mostly) safe distances. Just be wary of his Stinger normal since he can easily covert to a combo using Devil Trigger. It comes out quite fast.
  • Vergils normals do kill projectiles, but they only do so at specific ranges/frames. If you can keep up a constant stream of projectiles at infrequent periods, you’ll end up winning against Vergil in zoning game.
  • Vergil is highly dependent on meter to kill. Otherwise, he’ll have to attempt multiple resets or blow x-factor to deal the required damage to kill. Keep that in mind if you feel you’ll need to fight Vergil head on and have to attempt a risky maneuver. - Unless you can throw out DPs quickly, don’t attempt to challenge his Helm Breaker move (down + H) in the air head on. It’s safe on block, and the only way to punish it is use a crossover counter or x-factor cancel out of blockstun.
  • If you have trouble cracking a Vergil open with your offense, just stick to chipping him via hadokens and safe blockstrings to force him to make a risky move. If you can predict it, throw out a hadoken, immediately cancel into denjin mode, then punish Vergil accordingly. You’ll have to practice this a bit to find the optimal time to punish.
  • Figure out correct timings to push block a (normal) Vergil blockstring. He can’t special cancel any of his normals unless he’s in Devil Trigger. So if you can force a long recovery S or H, that’s a free punish attempt.
  • If he does the move where he rushes forward with the sword slashes behind him, jump forward to get out of the way and block it. Alternatively, you can practice the timing so you can throw or hit him as he moves through you.
  • Vergils don’t have much going for them when defending against offensive pressure. Use this to your advantage and pressure with deadpool assist for painful mixups and unblockable situations.
  • Lastly, if you have some meter to burn, blow it if you feel a Vergil is getting too close. Extra chip + pushback is always handy when fighting against aggressive type play.

#6

I thought I would tell you that if you’re using Deadpool to extend Ryu’s combos, you may instead be able to use Hawkeye to extend.

Try something like:

c.L, M, c.H, f.H+A2, [try all special moves], then M, H, f.H, S… and air combo.

Then you could replace Deadpool with a better lockdown assist, such as Sentinel, Doctor Doom, Akuma (also good for defense), Captain… Personally it sounds to me like Akuma’s Tatsu assist would work pretty well with Ryu, and even be able to extend his combos just like Hawkeye. Though I imagine you’ll have to dash after your special move.


#7

They both have low health so you can easily kill them in 1 combo which is good.
ryu vs zero is probably one of ryu’s worst match ups right next to mags, doom, and dorm.
a few things you could do:
-hadoken +lock down with assist then rush in and mix up for the hit
-if u get a buster lightning happy zero you can grab him after he releases the buster and before the lightning hits you. It isnt a block string. then you otg super his ass for half his life. you can also jab him out of it.
-shoryuken his air moves when he is in close range, but only attempt this if you have a meter to cancel into super if he blocks
-chip him to death with hadoken and supers

ryu vs vergil is not as bad

  • if the vergil player uses light medium heavy as part of his block string (which most do) you can push block the medium and the heavy will whiff and then you can dash in and punish
    -if he does rapid slash into spiral swords do a shoryuken or snap back and it will hit him out of his super since it isnt a block string.
    -if vergil activates swords and teleports behind you you still block back! dont change your input to forward. since his swords appear before him it counts as if he is still on the same side before he teleports. once you are in block stun reverse your blocking input.
    -chicken block helm breaker and punish him. It isnt safe if you chicken block it.