"Nem-Assists": The Nemesis Teambuilding/Assists Thread

nemesis-t-type

#437

PFFFT. I like that name XD


#438

its a good team. sent/hulk is really fun to play and you can do ghetto fly + hulk assist cross ups. i have a bunch of vids of that team online.


#439

Gotta try this out. I love ghetto crossups. And this one sounds WAY more useful than dropkick forward roll + assist.


#440

It makes me happy deep down in my heart of hearts that a team comprised entirely out of Heavies can hold its own in this game. Maybe not perfectly, but it’s nowhere near the suicide it was back in MvC2.


#441

Well, this is a game where 90% of the cast is usable, if you know the tech, do your homework, and dedicate some effort. I think that’s amazingly cool.


#442

as I’ve always said, despite this game’s flaws, Capcom has still achieved a game where around 40 of the 48 character cast can consistently hold their own on a well constructed team. UMvC3 is a VERY balanced game, mostly because almost every character has some kind of utter bullshit to abuse


#443

So, who do you think is unusable?

I’ve got my own thoughts, but I wanna hear your list.


#444

My guess: Iron Fist, Doctor Strange, Hsien-Ko and Shuma Gorath are all extremely low, but have their uses, so they’re only barely just viable.

Doc doesn’t have the buttons, IF and Hsien-Ko suffer from extreme lack of mobility, and Shuma is just lacking, so others can do his job better. But you can still win with these characters or they have assists worth keeping around.

Even She-Hulk and Thor have good potential.

In fact, the only character in this game with absolutely no redeemable qualities and simply can’t function is PW.


#445

I was thinking of testing out a Nemesis(Slam)/Dormammu(Hole)/Arthur(Daggers) just for kicks. Nemmy is the kinda heavy dude I want to play.


#446

Okay, here’s my list of bad guys: Hsien-Ko, IF, maybe Shuma. Hsien-Ko requires specific setups for godly lockdown and mixup potential for other characters, but she cannot shine well on her own, and a lot of setups that exist already make people like sentinel of ammy around as good as her godly assist, so the same effort put into someone else would be better used. And IF is slow in the air, but his ground speed is insane, his footsies are fantastic. Just, his mixups suck, and he’d be great if this game didn’t love guys with air games. Shuma’s decent, I have links to combo video showing 900k to 1mill X-factorless combos, and resets/ways to combo off his command throw. His mobility is less terrible than people give it credit for. He just requires SO MUCH WORK to make himself as good as the rest of the cast. Oh, and though he’s actually a pretty high-damage character, he has to be near the corner.

But I will protect PW to the grave. He absolutely requires you have all the stupid really specific kinda tech for, but in the proper team he annihilates, or at least accents it like no one else. I only have one example, but he’s so badass it counts: Basic Sausage. He has found so many ways to make Phoenix Wright’s weird requirements usable. And PW has some interesting things to add for teams once you figure it out. PW’s dog is one of the best assists in the game, odd thing to say, but it’s undiscovered great assist, just because it fills so many niches. It’s a low otg, one of three assists in the game, and is delayed enough that you can do very odd delayed otg stuff with it, like a Cap’s Shield Skills Hyper with doom missiles kinda deal, just lesser known, so people don’t have tech for it yet. It’s one of the best ways for Hulk to follow up his command throw, and can unlock for Hulk a pretty accessible grappler game, more like the Nem we know and love. And, of course, the assist unblockables for those who have the pressure. And Dark Wright (final mode, XF3, with the cell phone equipped) is a blast. I can mash two buttons and win for free. And, he’s like felicia in that he has pretty impossible-to-escape unblockables. Someone will find a way to bring him to the big-time eventually, but he needs a REALLY specific team, or a buff.


#447

That team sounds great, by the by. And yeah, Nem is wonderful. Nem, Thor, and Hulk are massively under-appreciated.


#448

My best character is Dormammu and I was thinking of a good evil minion to be his enforcer up front. He sounds like the one.


#449

I completely support that team, I really think Nem and Dorm work great together. Dark Hole is really good for setting up Tentacle Slams, adding pressure, or catching opponents to start (moderately scaled) combos. At the same time, Launcher Slam is good for incoming character mix-ups, continuing combos off of Flame Carpet, and it makes a wonky but effective anti-air for Dorm. Setting up Stalker Flares at the end of Nemesis combos is always fun, as well.

I don’t play Arthur, but in theory they’re a good match. Daggers is a three Fireball pressure move to help Nemmy approach, and mix-ups happen with Dorm. I’m not sure how the DHC would go with Arthur, but it sounds like it’d be good.

(I also went through that thought process a lot. Dormammu can possess and empower normal human beings perfectly fine, so he should totally be able to control an undead tank)


#450

I’m not entirely used to the concept of making themed teams. All the teams I have went between have been based on how they synergize. I never went theme first. My mains were the only team that I just liked the characters too much, and forced the synergy until it worked.

That said, Nem/Dorm/Arthur is pretty damn solid. Dark hole helps Nem get close for shenanigans and outmatches a lot of ranged moves. I have always been jealous of a good arthur player, because I think he’s crazy solid and fun to play. His assist is great with everyone, especially Dorm, who likes the beamishness of daggers, and Nem loves the daggers. Yeah, this team’s pretty spooky.


#451

Yeah, I just gotta work on my Arthur game. I focus on both theme and synergy when it comes to mostly Dorm as he is my favorite character in the game.


#452

Sweet. I’ve always been a decent-but-uninteresting dorm (tridashes all day, use the MastaCJ combo with Wesker, who I’m also boring with), and have always wanted to really use him better, but I’ve never really had the opportunity.

Nem is my best, probly. X-23 used to be, but I find if I just say “this is the team I’m using”, my lead becomes my best character, because matchup knowledge (X-23 was my lead with my odd-as-fuck vanilla team).

Throw Arthur in the lead spot temporarily, I bet you that’ll pump up his game. And you won’t be relying on that Dark Arthur spear stuff.


#453

While I honestly think everyone is USABLE and can win, I do think there are a handful of characters that either so gimped in some areas/ outclassed by other characters or require so much work for only somewhat passable results, that to consider them “Viable” against a good player with a good team, doesn’t feel honest.

in no particular order:

Tron: I was a vanilla Tron user, and loved her to death. I knew Gustaff fire would get nerfed, and it NEEDED nerf. but then Tron herself got nerfed, and I cannot call what Capcom gave her in return “buffs”, at least not in the sense that they make her a better character. 3 of her 4 special moves are useless outside of combos, and the one she is left with DESTROYS her HSD and damage scaling. of all the heavies, she EASILY does the least damage. in fact, a low meter Tron cannot be considered a Heavy IMO because her combos are so anemic, it’s pathetic. the Servbot cannon “buff” has too much leeway, making it a HUGE commitment if you decide to use that move, thus destroying any zoning she had. Her good normals were nerfed into oblivion, and she doesnt even have an assist or good DHC to make up for any of it.
Shuma Gorath: Once again, a vanilla shuma user here. While he was net buffed in UMvC3, he’s still too weak, and he’s outclassed in EVERY way by other characters. He can do everything, but he does none of it well. simple as that. that, and Chaos dimension isnt as good as it was in MvC2. still salty over that.
Hsien-Ko: what the fuck hasnt been said about hsien ko yet? a Great DS character that was destroyed in the transition to this game. just sad, and Gold Ko doesnt make up for ANYTHING, EVER.
Iron Fist: for a character that relies on getting in, his mobility is simply horrible, even on the ground, since all of it is risky. his launcher is a JOKE, and is a subtle nerf to his anti-air game, making his ability to score a combo off of random hits (which is important in this game) very, very, bad. His powerups are also just pathetic, with the “attack-up” one being the only useful one, and even then, the damage difference is pretty small, even for long combos. the defense one and meter one dont change enough to be relied on in any meaningful way. if the defense one cut damage by 1/2 or something crazy like that, all the sudden he would become better, since he could TAKE risks, and not fucking DIE. or if meter doubled. basically, ki is useless. the lack of any aerial options is also fucking terrible for a game like this, and I see no reason why he doesnt have any.
Pheonix Wright: similar to Tron, was ok on point at best, but his assist made earned him a spot on teams, which would have made his metagame improve by simply being USED. no one uses him now, except for a couple awesome players, and thats more like the exception that proves the rule IMO. He’s he best off of all 5 character in my opinion, but he’s still bottom 5 in my book.

and honorary mentions to Ghost Rider and Strange, since while they both have a FUCKTON of issues like the above characters, they also have a handful of very specific awesome things that can make them viable on well constructed teams (GR’s long reach and Strange’s good set of hypers)


#454

I’m sorry but I have to call you out on PW. He’s certainly not the best of the five. Shuma should fit that bill, as he can function and infact does have a very good assist to back him up, one that isn’t easy to replicate. In fact, each of them except Tron have good assists. IF has LOG FOOT which is very nice, Shuma with Mystic Ray, and Gold Hsien-Ko assist does infact count because of the amount of lockdown it can provide(lockdown that the opponent can’t do crap about mind you). Even Tron has some fun and useful tech with her Beacon Bomb that can lead to, for example, a free Nemesis air grab. But what does PW have on his own to contribute to the team? A Low OTG assist as his best one…Why would you not just play Wesker? I mean, sure you can trade IF for RR, but that’s OK because their playstyles are completely different, one’s keepaway, one’s rush. PW is more or less rush because he HAS to land that Objection for anything to happen. And lets face it, Dark Wesker vs Dark Wright…just try to think about that.


#455

keep in mind, it’s a low hitting assist that goes fullscreen, OTG’s and stays out for what can feel like FOREVER. in the heat of a fight, that assist gets lost very easily, and can open people up simply because they dont see it coming. It’s one of the few assists in the game that can actually list “hard to see coming” on its list of pros. it serves an entirely different purpose than Wesker gun IMO.

as for why I put him near the top of the 5, I dunno, It’s mostly just an inkling. I’ve seen PW on specially designed teams, and it can be scary, and a PW that HAS gone through all the bullshit and gotten his 3 items does become alot stronger, even without “Dark PW” or X factor.

I still think Tron is the absolute worst in the game. she has a shit zoning game, a shit grab/command grab game, some of the worst HSD in the game, some of the worst damage scaling in the game Hypers that are useless outside of combos, a reliance on meter to deal any worthwhile damage and does not build meter well compared to other high-hitcount characters, shitty normals that either neuter her combos due to multiple hits or early groundbounces or simply no longer work well because they got hit with the nerf stick, and she has really fucking hard time extending combos without assists. ALL Tron has is high health, and even then, she’s not even the highest.


#456

Then again, the team argument can also be used on Tron. I’d like to redirect you to the previously mentioned Beacon Bomb setups. Infact, I’m more or less lumping her in with a new kind of point character I like to call the Swappers. These are characters that can hard tag to other characters and have them continue/reset a combo for large damage. Current known residents are Firebrand, Tron and She-Hulk. Also, how’s her meter building and you forgot that she also has a weird hitbox in her favor.

Back to PW, his powerup mode isn’t even that good either. It’s not like Frank or Phoenix where they just dominate the whole time. PW has chip in his favor, sure, and he does hurt, but one, his powerup mode isn’t eternal like the others, two, there’s no way not to have PW on screen and still power him up like with Frank and Phoenix, and three, other than his chip, his pointing Hs are his other kill moves, but the cH one doesn’t hit low, so there’s no real mixup game like what Phoenix and Frank have either.