New Titles making too many arbitrary limitations?


#1

I’ve noticed recently most fighting game titles especially from capcom and even to an extent in Arksys’s titles they attempt to control character balance through arbritrary limitations or very finite juggle limitations that give the player little choice but to do pre-made combos.

Examples:
-Ryu’s overhead is +3 on hit for standing +2 for crouching

-Fei Long’s removal of Command throw ultra that was in the final beta but removed in the final build

-Taokaka can only chain a certain number of jabs

-Normals don’t juggle unless in a Universal juggle state.

-Specials only combo if they have a specific juggle ability and even than will not combo past a certain number of hits on a juggled opponent.

-TvC retard gravity to limit most great setups outside the corner.

-Chun’s arbritrary limit on j. FP (TvC) (This was in a betas ver was able to combo enough to hit the limit though as the gravity is so ridiculous)

-Capcom only but overheads being slow and having little combo ability except in ridiculous situations (Hopefully SSFIV will help this a bit but SFIV bothered me big time on this)

It really seems to me they are like “oh this could be too good let’s make sure it’s impossible to do” but this creation makes it difficult for the player to innovate.

3s, Marvel, GG, and other older games left lots of options there with the potential to be broke but allowed for individualized styles and just more fun because you had more options.

(also I know 3s had the 6 point limit, but be honest … it gives a shit load more options than today and was mainly put in place for the sole purpose of not allowing infinites like in 2I or NG, that’s also why almost all super rejuggles were removed)

Just curious if SRK likes the pre-fab style character design of today or the looser designed characters of yester-year?


#2

SRK likes infinite combos cause they allow players to innovate, and enhance overall gameplay experience


#3

when capcom can get basic engine features like reversals, motion windows and blockstun right then we can start worrying about character design


#4

Their hasn’t been infinites in GG since Reload and 3s doesn’t have 100% combo’s in the most ridiculous of circumstance except for akuma XD


#5

That’s bad?

You ever played KoF? You got overheads that don’t combo at all. Hell using the overhead via cancel removes the overhead property from it.


#6

Missing the most arbitrary of all decision in a fighting game lately: you can only special cancel during a combo if the normals were linked.

Wow…just wow.


#7

I read this and immediately started thinking “TEYAH, TEYAH, TEYAH, TEYAH, TEYAH”

Thanks.


#8

Lol SFIV


#9

No matter how many combo options you get, there’s always going to be one BEST combo that a player can do, and they’re always going to be looking to do that. I mean, GGXX#R Sol had how many different ridiculous combos? And yet every single top-level player went straight for the dust loop.


#10

There are many times players opt to alter combos to gain damage, position, knock downs or resets. This happens all the time in marvel, and I imagine TvC will have a lot of this as well, especially with the baroque stuff. Stopping a combo to bait a burst happens in gear, and probably in BB. In a particular situation there may be a combo that will net you the most damage, but it may not always be the “best” combo to do in regards to the rest of the match.


#11

Doesn’t it work that way in Street Fighter 2. Doesn’t sound to “lately” to me.


#12

Yes, as if there aren’t enough meaningless combos in SF4.


#13

could be, but I remember that decision being there in an older game. definitely something to research.


#14

this is one of my biggest pet peeves. and why do they have to be one-frame links? we’re human beings, not machines :confused:


#15

Sol Dust Loop is not a infinite…

I’m sure he was talking about Jam’s IAD infinite on Potemkin


#16

have you? theres ways to do tons of damage from overheads in 98 um and either version of 2k2. you can also cancel so that the overhead remains overhead, or even whiff cancel into it

no, in sf2 you can go from crouching to standing or vice versa and be able to cancel light chains


#17

u can go from lp to lk or lk to lp too


#18

Yeah, I recall in 98 Robert being able to combo after a meaty overhead and Kim doing BC combos from his in 2002. I used to use late cancels.


#19

Yep, and I know that Leona can get free DM out of her overhead in KOF XII. Late example, but yeah.


#20

UOHs lead to plenty of supers in 3S ^