Newbie question: Why are my normals getting countered most of the time?


#1

Starting out as a newbie using Nash. I’ve studied most of the basics online (frames, range etc). From what I gathered, his cr.mk, cr.mp, cr,lp are supposed to be his “good” pokes.

But what I find at online matches are that whenever I press one of these buttons when in range, I get “countered” by the opponent’s normals. A lot of times are sweeps or something similar.

Am I press it too slow? or too late? What is this reason for this?

I have practised my first confirm combo cr.mp, st.mp, lk.ss but I can never hit it because my first cr.mp would get stuff 80-90% of the time.

For now I cannot get a favourable trade while in close range so my only strategy to win is to keep running away and throw out sonic boom :stuck_out_tongue: pretty sure that’s not how you play street fighter :frowning:


#2

Can you post a replay? Being outfootsied by a better player is something that is always going to happen, but you may be making some big mistakes that you don’t seem to notice.
You can send me a private message with your CFN if you want, I can look up your replays (got to love the stalking feature).


#3

You are not taking into account how the priority system works in this game. In older SF games if any two attacks hit on the same frame, the move would trade and both characters get hit. In SFV only attacks of the same strength (HK vs HK, etc) that hit on the same frame will trade. If two attacks of different strength hit on the same frame (HK vs MK), the higher strength attack gets priority. The result is their is no trade, and the attacker hitting the weaker strength button gets counter hit. You have to take this into account when you set up your frame traps. In your case you will always get countered because mp will lose to HK everytime if they hit on the same frame. In that case, what you have to do is not press the button and punish his move if its not safe on block, or make him whiff the move with movement and punish him in his recovery frames.


#4

Are you doing them while being pressured? It could simply be that you’re getting caught by frame traps.


#5

I think this is the most likely scenario as I recall a lot of times it is being stuffed by HK. If this is the case, when should I ever throw out my normals? Should I just be blocking and punishing the whole time? What is the general approach here?

Thanks for the explanation by then way.


#6

What are frame traps, could you elaborate what is happening?


#7

Check your range as well, cr.mp feels really stubby imo.

Another common pitfall with newer players is trying to hard to get their combo starters and getting predictable, you also have f.hp and f.hk which are both pretty awesome pokes with great range that can make your opponent wary of pressing buttons and open them up to dash in throw then pressure shenanigans afterwards.

Also if running away with sonic boom works do it, you got to watch the ranges you do it at but it’s one of his tools and it forces your opponent to either takes risks to get in or take chip damage bulldogging them.

Also throwing a hp sonic boom and dashing after it is also pretty effective.

Tldr: Try using his other pokes more, combos are nice but they aren’t your only source of damage and your neutral game will suffer if you neglect your better pokes because they don’t lead to your max damage bnb.


#8

This is turning into such a silly meme that it might have been better for it to never have been mentioned.


#9

A frame trap is when you get your opponent to block a safe move then do another move which starts up slow enough for your opponent to try to throw something out but fast enough to beat whatever they throw out.

So for example if you do a move that leaves you at +1 on block then throw out a 3 frame jab your opponent has time to try to poke out but since there are no 2 frame pokes anything he tries to throw out in this gap will be counter hit by the jab.


#10

watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMpeMaU564g


#11

What meme are you talking about?


#12

Is he suggesting that the previous statement is not true? I can’t find any info on this topic online, can someone explain the priority system? So a heavier button will beat lighter button, but what about specials? And does a heavier special beat a light special?


#13

Street fighter never had a priority system until street fighter 5. Prior to that when two attack hitboxes hit two attack hurt boxes, a trade would ensue. The word “priorty” was really a misnomer prior to SFV. In the older street fighter games it was a word used to describe why one attack beat another attack when they both appeared to hit at the same time. People would say one attack had “priority” over another, when in fact what was happening was that some attacks had bigger hitboxes with smaller hurt boxes. These bigger hitboxes were making contact first, so they were registered as hitting first. Problem was back then you could not visually see hit boxes. You could not see the bigger hitboxes making first contact, what the player saw were two attacks hitting at the same time, but only one winning out. So they said the attack that won out had priority. When people learned about hitboxes later on, they came to the correct conclusion that priority was not a real thing, but uninformed players kept using the term and propagated the myth. Attacks beating other attacks had to with hitboxes and not one attack strength having “priority” over another

In SFV they added a priority system for when two opposing attacks hit on the same frame. The higher strength attack will always beat a low strength attack that **hits on the same frame **. If the same strength attack hits on the same frame you get a trade. This is a steadfast rule in the game engine, priority is now a thing that has been programmed into the game. This change makes frame traps in SFV stronger than they were in previous games. This is because now you set a frame trap, with the proper gap, that will allow you to punish jabs that are 3 frames with higher strength buttons that will hit on the same frame as the opponents jab. Where before you would get a trade and the situation would reset to neutral, now you get a counter hit punish with normal that can lead to big damage combos. You can still set frame traps where you counter hit with a jab or short attack, but these attacks don’t lead to big damaging combos or to hard knockdown situations, like they would if you counter hit with higher strength attack.

I was kind of all over the place there so if you have some questions, ask and I will try to clarify.


#14

It’s not that no kther SF has had this system, SFIII has the exact same priority system as V, it’s where they got it from.


#15

Yeah, you are right about SFIII. I was thinking more about 2 and 4.


#16

Post a replay, even a shitty phone recording will do.