Is anyone here getting a little tired of hearing “Don’t get that version, it’s not arcade perfect.” ?
To sound cratchity I started on Street Fighter 2 in the arcades and about wet my pants when someone showed me it was coming to the SNES. The SNES version of Street Fighter 2 is FAR away from being arcade perfect it’s not even funny, but did it help my game when I got to the arcades… HECK YEAH!
I like buying the best version that comes out of 2D games. I switched all of my PSX games to Saturn when I played the Saturn versions, HOWEVER unless the game is totally unplayable like X-Men vs. Street Fighter for the PSX (even then if you don’t have a Saturn well… it’s something) I don’t dog people for picking up ports that are less then perfect.
When the arcade community dries up at least they try to still play fighting games. We need to support the fighting community in the arcades AND consoles. If not why will the companies make any more? The hardcore fighters cannot support the gaming community alone.
I’m going to go with “Arcade Players.” If you have the option between perfect and imperfect, and you want to hone your skills for the arcade, go with the perfect.
And honestly, why the hell even post this? Has anyone ever actually dogged you for getting a less than perfect port on your home system? People will dog ports… but are people even in your face about the fact that your favorite version of Alpha 3 is on the DC? And even if they did, is it a problem? HECK NO!
You’re basing your rant on something subjective - which version of the game is the best. To a lot of people (especially at this site, a nexus for competitve 2D fighting game players) the “best” is arcade perfect.
It makes sense really. When someone buys an arcade port, they expect the game they bought to be the game they played. It’s kinda like how the people that all bought the Star Wars dvds got pissed that it was the “special edition” versions and not the originals.
If I had a choice, I would pick arcade perfect, but, if tournament runners can only offer the closest to an arcade port, then I would be fine with that too.
But overall, I support whatever console port there is. The reason is because when dealing with consoles, people can bring their own controllers/joysticks and not bitch about “Oh, if I had a P360/Sanwa/MAS/controller, I would do better”.
The thing is, there’s a point where the home version will hurt more than help you.
For example the V-ISM timing for PSX Alpha 3 is different which could really mess you up badly in the arcade, and the sprite size in DC Alpha 3 is smaller so the hitboxes change. Parry timing is different in the DC version of Third Strike, and lots of things that work in the arcade don’t work at home, etc.
From low-mid’ level play, it’s not a big deal, but if you’re trying to get to tournament level, then you really do need to find something as close to arcade perfect as possible, because the thing is, your body memorizes the timing for things as you play. If the timing on your home version doesn’t match the timing in the arcade, you’re going to have a very tough time adjusting. Also, things like knowing exactly what works in each situation is very important. If certain hit properties are changed, you won’t be confident in knowing what to do when the time comes.
I still buy console ports, because I like being able to practice at home/play with friends for free, but I really wish developers would stop trying to change things around. Haven’t they gotten the hint that people want it the way it is in the arcade? If you’re gonna change things like presentation and music that’s fine, just leave the gameplay the way it is.
If CoJ and CoA knew about this site and the desires of an accurate arcade port for the sake of 2000 or so tournament goers (in the US at least), then maybe they would consider it.
However, if they don’t know about our desire to have that, then they’re going to do their best to “fix” what they think is broken in the game to develop the game into more of what they had originally invisioned. Which means no bugs/glitches (Rcing and crouch canceling, perhaps even taking out the “blow out” from the CC activation in A2), adding more characters to spice up the home ports, anything that they can think of to tweak the game into something that they feel is better.
Which brings to question how will they know out desires if we don’t tell them? By posting it on this website’s forum that they’ll have to search for a handful of A3, ST and 3s topics about how the home ports suck?
Only thing that I can think of, is petitions and mass emails to those in charge of developing the home ports, added in with a link to some threads about how certain home ports mess up various properties that people have become accustomed to (Kuni rollings 2 punch buttons to give him 2 chances for an SPD, that had been changed in the PSX ST game to 2 punch buttons=lariat thus messing him up).
Otherwise CoJ and CoA won’t know what we want and will continue to do what they’ve done for the past 15+ years with home ports.
Arcade perfect is not something people even are aware of. Unless you have the arcade perfect game at home (i.e. Neo Geo) or are constantly at the arcade (I mean almost daily) then it really does not matter cause you will not see the difference.
I posted this cause for the past few days I look at thread after thread seeing people dis most of the versions out there. I heard a guy wanting to know what DC games to buy and people were saying left and right don’t pick up that version, it’s not arcade perfect.
Hate to say it, but the XBox versions are not “arcade perfect” as well. The 2 I know for a fact are SVC Chaos and King of Fighters '03. They are slightly slower. This people is the strongest console system out there w/ 2D games so far. Does this refrain me from playing the XBox version. No! I’m probably sure I can find faults w/ the PS2 versions of various games as well thing is the differences are so minute you are barely missing anything.
Is it good to say which version is better arcade perfect wise, yes. Though unless you know for a fact which one is don’t go around dissing every other version. Classic example is Capcom vs. SNK 2. I have yet to see anyone agree which one is better. Thing is since it’s so minute of a difference does it really matter?
P.S. Talking about hatred toward “tweaks” is fine. Looking down on a console version when you have no idea why you are looking down on it is plain stupid. Look at the pages where this stuff is talked about. People will ask “What makes this not arcade perfect?” Most answer “Some combos are missing.” WHAT ONES? WHICH? ANY CLUE?!?!?!?! People like to post what they hear w/o understanding what they are talking about.
Not to say the rest of the comments were not important, but your’s deserves special treatment.
Most tournament players will tell you flat out you cannot practice high level action on console period. Simple reason being if it is done on arcade machines your hand memorizes everything for whatever it uses. So even if you use an console joystick, you will be slowed down cause of the difference in arcade joystick to console joystick. I used to train w/ tournament fighters and right before matches they will not touch the console version cause it messes w/ you no matter how perfect it is. Console is good for practicing ideas for combos and techniques. Using them practically HAS to be done in the arcade. There is no other way. And yes I know some joysticks mimick the arcade very well, but every system is slightly different. Too much time on a console makes you used to a console game. Arcades are the only TRUE way to train.
I agree that things like timing for a parry is just plain wrong to do, but more then likely it will not mess a tournament player up cause he gave up the console well before the tournament. (Again not that I condone Capcom for doing that).
IF were also going with this idea then XBox live is the biggest mistake in history cuase it changes the timing of everything no matter how minute. Yet I find A LOT of tournament players on there. Makes you wonder sometimes
This seems like an elaborate troll…? What tournament players would tell you you can’t practice high level on console? Other than some Cali 3S players, I’m unaware of many/any top US players that would subscribe to that belief. DrewDub to me is the ultimate counter example of this - this guy plays against the CPU on console all day, but will rock on any playback system because he’s been really bored and learned the game. But who cares? It’s not like there’s any reward here. We’re all playing for fun, and if somebody’s so psychotic that they can ONLY play on XXX, time to roll your eyes and move on without them.
As regards joysticks, it’s probably more the case that if you can’t adjust for whatever random stick you’ll be playing on in whatever random maintenance state it is that day, you’re going to get worked. Expect this to happen. Since I OWN several arcade machines and YOU presumably have played on multiple arcade machines over time, you’ll of course grant that there’s no perfect shared experience between different machines. You can try for that kind of thing, but it doesn’t happen, and in the end the learned reflexes garnered from increased home play would more than offset the made-up problems introduced by playing at home on a good MAS-type stick.
Yeah, and I saw Ricky and Justin get rocked by some random guy on Live at ECCX. It’s a different game - Live is not to be expected to be the same exact game as 3S Arcade, and denying that is denying the non-realtime nature of distance communications. But Live is there and is a viable option for play, which sure as hell beats the pants out of going to the local arcade and playing against a mashing scrub or at home playing against my girlfriend. (Who is also a mashing scrub, but she’s hot so we’ll let that slide.)
That all being said, you want to get as close as possible to the gaming experience. MvC2 for PS2 (a favorite whipping boy) randomly screws with Tron. If you learned how to play the crippled PS2 Tron and come play against people on DC or Naomi or Xbox, you’ll get rocked. So if someone asks/inquires about what system they should get to play MvC2 on, it is pretty wise and pretty appropriate to suggest they stay away from the PS2 and go for the best possible playing experience. Arcade perfect may not be possible, but the overall playback experience you want to be as optimum as possible, and hopefully learn enough there to go walk over to OAQS’s house and play against him and not look like a scrub. If you don’t care about the social aspects of your choice of any game, just lock yourself in the basement and hey you didn’t care about anyone else’s feedback anyways so use whatever system you want.
I agree to a certain extent. First off I should be more elaborate. The tournament fighters I have played were on Tekken Tag Tournament. The only other popular Tournament fighter game in the area is MVC2 which I only play on occasion. Most of the 3D tournament fighters I played on there were very troll-ish. they had only a couple handful of strategies they used. Most of them on 2d games I showed them tended to get frustrated and went back to 3D. My forte is 2D but I am (or at least used to be) pretty good in Tekken, Vitura Fighter 4, and Soul Calibur. So playing them did not bother me.
If the fighters you know can do either then I wish I met them instead of the ones I know. Personally I play either. Like I said though most of the serious fighters I know that worried about their skills on a console game being different had no problem playing the console version all they want, but when it came time to be ready for a tournament, they spent the time in the arcade. It’s my experience at least. Me personally again I am a mid tier fighter simply cause I play for fun. I adjust to whatever I am on cause my skills work on anything. Only time I really get thrown off is if I spend too much time on a pad. Even then it does not take any time at all to get used to it.
My personal belief is if your skills and techniques are good enough, you will win. Problem w/ live is cause of lag, Cheap techniques that work well offline, fail online and moves that should not work offline, work online. It’s a different beast. Personally it’s getting harder and harder, but I try to find players that play using sheer technique and skill. Japan seems to have the most which is sad since most american players I come across use easy traps then complain cause the person gets cheap back to avoid them.
My point is if you are patient enough there will be players on there that are WELL worth the time in finding them. Players that will improve even the best players game, and you get to fight them as much as you want. Good tradeoff in my book.
Last thing the thing about Tron is what I wish people would post about. this thread is mostly about people dissing a game then giving a vague reason like “combos don’t work”. If Tron is the only problem for the PS2 version (which I am thinking it is not) how many newbs even play Tron? Tron is not one of the most popular characters and many would shrug that reason off.
Never said all play on it. Just said a lot. Many complain about live. That takes up many threadss as well. However many other fighters find it useful (like Preppy it seems). It poses an interesting question. My opinion is above. Might not be right, but it’s my 2 cents.