Option Select Backflip

vega

#1

Now one of the best Vega’s I know(Killa Boo/Doctor Claw in case someone randomly knows of him) mentioned something about Option Select Backflips on his bio. I haven’t heard this anywhere else, and something like this sounds too good to be true.

Is it?


#2

Its a jump option select. Jump in hp, then 3K~cr mk/lp.

If the opponent does any invincible reversal the J. Hp wiffs and vega back flips dodge. Same for back dashes. This OS is only used if you cant afford to OS block cuz there is much better jump OS that leaves you in a better position to punish (Back flip has a ton of recovery). You cannot meaty OS cuz all his moves worthy of OS is special cancellable so if it hits back flip and if it wiffs back flip > not an OS.

You can attempt to OS his second hit of Cl. Hp (meaty) but everyone sees that comming 2 miles off, so ryu has time to sit>think> change his gloves then play you like a sock puppet.


#3

other than to OS sweep or OST there is so reason to concern yourself with OS’s using vega


#4

People I play rarely backdash anyway so the main OS aren’t really useful to me.

lmao.

So for the j.HP, do I press 3K and cr.mk at the same time? Or do I press 3K in the air after the j.HP and then press cr.mk/lp when I land? (New to the whole Option Selecting, lol)


#5

Idea is to do a late j.HP or whatever in a safe jump, then 3k then whatever you want. I was playing with it just now and I think it works pretty decently from the backthrow safe jump with j.MP too, just b.throw, hold uf, then do late j.MP (for the safe jump) immediately followed by 3k followed by s.hp. If you do it correctly on a whiff you’ll go into the 3k while on a hit you’ll s.hp which you can combo off of. That safe jump’s not perfect but it’s one of his better ones so don’t mindlessly do that thinking you can beat any reversal, and I haven’t really tested to see how safe it is to do the 3k after it.


#6

I have to disagree with you. Compare the risk of OSing after a backthrow safejump (in most situations, high) to the reward of getting a 3k flip out (none)… Why would you ever want to do that?


#7

not to mention god knows how many times you’ll end up getting taunt instead


#8

Don’t mind me… just passing through. I saw the topic at the top, and thought it was interesting.

So… the question you have to ask yourself here, is what possible benefit do you get from learning this…

The only thing I could really think of, is that this OS allows you to avoid chip damage on a reversal uppercut that is 6F or more (you can’t OS 5F and below). You can also avoid contact, so you prevent the opponent from being able to FADC their uppercut. This could also be useful against EX Messiah, since you can avoid it, and possibly punish, instead of blocking it, and being in the mix, yourself. Similarly safe, slow reversals were of interest. This sounded really useful to me, so I decided to test this. Mind you… I don’t play Vega at all.

The key here is to test this against an uppercut that is 6F or slower, with the ability to FADC, or generally safe, otherwise. There are very few of these, btw.

So, I tested this option select:

Sweep-> Neutral Jump MK ~ OS 3K Flip

On Gouken’s EX Tatsu. Success! He goes flying up, cannot FADC… all is well with the world.

I had a HELL of a time reproducing this result with anyone else though. This shit is only useful against the longest moves in the game.

Sakura’s EX Shouoken lets you punish…

EX Messiah, Honda’s EX Butt Slam and EX Chicken Wing leave players really close to one another, and I couldn’t tell by sight if either player was punishable. You can look at the frame data and figure it out. I’m too lazy to do that for a situation I’ll never be in, with a character I’ll never play.

Outside of that, everything else seemed to be able to punish the OS, so it’s not worth doing.

EX Psycho Crusher/Scissor Kicks both recover before Vega. Viper’s Fierce TK and EX Seismo both can punish the flip. Honda’s EX Headbutt flies away safely, and may be able to punish Vega. Makoto’s EX Chop can punish Vega, as can her bootleg uppercut (EX Uppercut actually loses to the jump MK). Rose EX Spiral punishes Vega.

I don’t now if I missed anything, but that’s what I found. I couldn’t figure out any other reversal that was slow enough to OS, but safe on block, or FADC’able.

The OS seems fairly useless, but really good against Sakura, I guess.


#9

oh shit… HAV’s here

lol but yeah, I agree. this OS is SO situiational that you might as well not waste your time on it. I mean sure, it’s good if you’re on your last chip’s worth of health and you’re fighting one of these characters in a situiation where they should be willing to risk a move like that, but if i’m in that situiation I’ll bite the bullet and take the loss. Maybe i’ll remember this OS but I doubt it. as for any other time, I’ll use the Rule of HAV and block. That nets me a far better win/win situiation than this because If i block it and they FADC, they burn at least 2 meters. If I block it and they dont FADC then they’ve just done an unsafe move. Free damage.


#10

Hmmm, very informative. Guess it is only useful against characters/players where it wouldn’t even matter in the grand scheme of things.


#11

no you press 3 k flip in between.

the thing is

If ji.HP hits the guy or his block the game 'impact freezes" for 12 frames your 3k flip comes during that and since your char is stuck in the air it gets discarded, then the game flow restarts and you land and you press your cr.MK or whatver followup.

**If for whatever reason the ji.HP whiffs **then there is no “impact freeze” and the gameflow carries on, in this case the 3k flip input comes right at the time when you land and is not discarded so you perform the flip, then comes the cr.mk or whatever move you were planning, and since you are already well into the backflip (around 12 frames obviouly) it is this input that is discarded.


#12

Lots of moves are faster than that, but have a much slower startup when you factor distance, the reason why our ji.MP is leading to safer jump ins setups than any other of our jump in is exclusively because at the distance from where we jump, it hits wake up boxes but leaves us far enough on whiff to shoryus, even though technically even meaty to the limit it leaves us on a 4 frames trip guard and shoryus are 3 - 4 frames reversals. Fortunately at the distance where we land the shoryu hitboxes doesn’t connect before frame 5 or 6… to late.

Same thing with oki meaty st.lk, it not only recovers very fast, it also have lots of range, so our punchable boxe is reeled in and we are not vulnerable to the very first active frames of a reversal, and when the reversal come in range we are back in block stance.

All that to say that using such an OS with those kind of moves extends the domain of application.

I don’t use it though, I prefer block after safe jumps for the reasons explained above by the others, and when I am a chip away from losing a round I usually pull an empty jump -> backflip bait hoping for the guy to take it, since it is such a game looser if he doesn’t.

It could be an intresting thing though at a much higher level of play than mine, I d give it some thoughts, sometimes looking vulnerable is key to luring the other guy into abandoning his guard. I am pretty sure it is both very character and opponent’s playstyle dependant.