Oversaturated sequential art (non fanart)


#1

t’was a rush job.


#2

Rush jOb? Well its pretty impressive. I really like the bottom with the chaotic background is awesome. Killer design on the Villian too. Personal project or Commission?


#3

thx… it’s my submission for a contest.

I didn’t have the time to work on it enough… had work deadlines & other commitments to meet. Rushed through the cleanup and colouring process, and I think if I had the opportunity I would go back and change they way I did some things – but all in all, I think it was a good learning experience.


#4

Rook, this’s really awesome. It’s not really the matter of being oversaturated as much as it is the same red. Adding just a few blues and slight highlights should do the trick.


#5

This is really great! The colours give a great sense of atmosphere, though i agree with Kandoken on the highlights. The choice of camera angles are good too.


#6

WAHAHAHA, you’re in my world now! J/K. The visuals look great. I’m not gonna pick on ya much there. I am, however, gonna get into a quick storytelling lesson. :stuck_out_tongue:

One of the fundamental things that makes good sequential art, suprisingly, has little to do with drawing, but actually, has more to do with design and clarity. How clearly can you lead your reader through your story page?

The page you have laid out is attractive, but too flashy for its own good, IMO. It’s important not to sacrifice classic panel to panel storytelling for a flashier appearance.

Let’s examine how to read your page. What order should my eye read it?

http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/8627/mangakaweb19yj.jpg

See what I’m getting at? It’s difficult to tell how the page should be read, so the reader is distracted trying to figure out how to read your story, rather than effortlessly enjoying it.

How about now?

http://img350.imageshack.us/img350/5381/mangakawebedit25ad.gif

There’s really no question of the read order, and including the villain in the foreground of panel 2 gives a clear indication of the characters position relative to each other. Nah mean?

Hehe, don’t get me wrong though, sometimes flashier panelling can still be very effective, but you have to keep in mind where you’re leading the viewers eyes.

Hope you don’t mind the lengthy critique ^_~


#7

Looks great Rook. First time I seen a sequential from you.

Chain hit the crit on the spot. Nothing else to revise. Overall great work and work on those colors. Looking better and better each time you do color your work.


#8

If you want to learn how to tell stories with the best of them go buy the book how to draw comics the marvel way.

Or just go get as many Jack Kirby comics as possible.

Never ever use Japanese manga/comics as inspiration to tell a story.

Not saying you did, but Japanese people ( manga artists ) have no idea how to tell a story with drawings and make it understanable in anyway. That’s just me sharing my personal opinion on that matter.

I guess that green guy is going to fight the dracula man, I like it. It makes me think of link going to count choculas castle because his cereal was stale for some reason.


#9

thx guys for the comments, you’re all every encouraging.
esp the more quick layout lesson from Chain. Really helps a lot… much appreciated! :slight_smile:

crits are welcome. I’m a newbie at all this.


#10

I’m not much of a sequential artist so I can’t comment on that but what you have looks great, rook. LIking the background and atmostphere.


#11

Same sentiments as SFMC. But I really do dig the drawing a lot!


#12

Bite your tongue.

Just because they go from right to left, doesn’t mean they lack storytelling.
I get a lot of Japanese manga and I can’t read Japanese, but I can still tell what’s going on through the panels.

Rook: If you get the chance, pick up “How to Draw Comics the Marvel way”. That should be a big help with your sequentials.

Chain hit it right on the head. Nice job.


#13

That is a personal opinion. There is plenty of manga out there that can teach you a lot about story telling. you dont need to cram a page with 20 panels and 400 word bubbles to tell a story. If I were you I would use manga and any source i can get my hands on to help improve. dont use one source otherwise youll end up doing things one way and become a one trick pony.

If you really want to improve. Study storyboarding. especially old ones from movies like citizen Kane. Movies run on storyboards and they are done in a variety of different ways.

Also check out Will Eisner.


#14

I am entiled to my opinion, and I will stick by it. I even recommend the book you did in the very first line of my post.

Manga is horrible at showing what the fuck is going on, and it’s not because it’s from left to right, it’s because it’s all just lines upon lines with some more lines thrown in between.

Why do you think manga always has to explain it’s self, and tell you what the fuck just happened.

Of course this doesn’t comply to every japanese comic, but I am damn sure I can give you some good examples.

http://apex.syste.ms/mgaimage/942977232.114006famu3.jpg

Look, what the fuck is going on ? It’s all just speed lines. That gets played out really really fast.

http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/1316/trigunmangascan3rs.jpg

http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/152/trigunmangascan27fy.jpg

http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/5974/trigunmangascan39dc.jpg

And here is a 6 page example from one of my favorite mangas, by probably my favorite artist ( Yushiro Nightow ), but it’s still requires like 2-3 look overs to tell exactly what just happened. He had to explain it in the last set of pages through dialogue. You shouldn’t have to do that.

I’m no master or anything, and a lot of you are better artists then me, but the reliance on speed lines by all sorts of artists now a days to portray motion is killing me.

Manga to me is what you look at for cool designs and stylistic inspirations.

If you want to learn how to tell a story, look at animation ( japanimation included ) storyboards, or ol school comics.

But whatever, thats what I think, I’m still learning. I just don’t want to become anime inspired artist from america # 2342342 who is all style and no substance.


#15

We’ll you have a point, and I agree. Now I challenge you to find manga that does make sense and is easy to follow. Look for manga that isnt about action. Or better yet look for some scenes that are not about action and youll see what I am talking about. All the pages you just posted has chaotic action in it and is only one example. HAJIME no Ippo is about boxing and I can follow that just fine. The action is clear and you can tell whats going on. There are a few panels that maybe hard to follow, but you even find that in comics here in america.

Im not gonna totally defend manga, its just a matter of taste, Im just challenging you to find what I ask for.


#16

Hehe, looks like we got a good ol fashioned debate here.

There are good points made both ways. There are good and bad examples of storytelling in both American and Japanese comics, but IMO, manga generally tends to have more “free form” storytelling than American or European comics. Some call it style, but I call it flash over substance. Haha, seriously, what the fuck is going on in those pages VSlash posted?

That’s not all manga though, some artists are quite good and straightforward. One of my favorite mangas is Sanctuary, and it is quite easy to follo., And, I havne’t read it, but my friends assure me that Berserk is very well told as well.

American comics has some big blemishes too though, even though it does tend to be clear more often. If you look at the comics Image was putting out when it was starting; back when Rob Leifeld was the hot shit and everyone and their mom was trying to imitate Jim Lee (and failing), you will see some horrible comics.

I haven’t read Drawing Comics the Marvel way, but anyone who is interested in comics should read Understanding Comics, by Scott McCloud. It’s a very insightful book about what comics are, and how they work. It doesn’t deal much with the actual drawing involved in comics, but focuses more on ideas, and really dissecting what sequential art is, and how it is unique from all other mediums.


#17

You should read it, it’s highly recommended. Written by Stan Lee and John Buscema.It goes over just about every manner of creating a comic from the art stand point in some way.

Venturi, I said that a lot of manga is like that, some may not be, if you were to find some and post it that wasn’t I wouldn’t be surprised.

When I speak of bad manga storytelling I guess I’m almost 85% focus’d on movement and action, where it really is sometimes just all speed lines. Of course, for example, I know whats going on when two characters are just talking. I’m not that retarded.

If any of you are subscribed to deviant art, one of my most favorite artists is LeSean Thomas. I love his work, but he recently posted a page from his up coming Cannonbusters that made me sad. It was all just speed lines, speed lines everywhere, I barely knew what was going on.

http://www.deviantart.com/view/22889751/ <—that’s the picture in question.

And it kills me that people are all like OMG great movement ! It’s just lines ! Sure they are very useful at times to convey motion, but when you overuse them, to me, they lose meaning. I’d hate to see a manga enfluenced artist draw the flash, the whole book would be speed lines.

But yes, this is just my personal opinion, and I do realise I am nowhere near the artistic talent some of you are, let alone a professional like LeSean Thomas.

I guess I will just have to keep practicing and put my money where my mouth is.


#18

I didnt mean to sound like i was talking down to you. Im learning just like everyone else lol. Yeah speed lines can be overdone, I think there is a time and place for them and even If i were to use them…id use em sparingly. Thats a problem I am having with a lot of artists now adays. over usage of speedlines. It can be tough on the eyes. Just has to be used right. I like the sharknife style but he kinda falls into the same trap. Its all personal preference like u said.


#19

I guess you just aren’t very good at interprating pictures into story because I had no trouble figuring out those manga pages or LeSeans stuff.

(Manga page 1: P1- OMG! P2-Quick action P3- Giant Robot smashes ground where character is. P4- Character is saved by friend tackling him out of the way, revealing what the quick action was)

As has been said, there’s bad storytellers all over the world. Don’t make blanket assumptions based off the few you’ve seen.
Yes, you’re entitled to your opinion, but that doesn’t make it right.


#20

Fine, you draw speed lines all over the place and be like every other artist, and I will try to actually learn to portray movement without having to rely on that shit for every panel.

I don’t believe you knew what happened in the those Trigun pages, if you say you did the first time around, it’ll just feel like your disargeeing with me because I’m actually opposed to something a shitload of artists are doing now a days.

If you do it well, awesome. But everyone needs to stop trying to be Joe Mad.